# 54.5 mpg's by 2025... **URL:** \ **Category:** Shift518 Automotive\ **Created:** [July 29, 2011, 3:53pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/54-5-mpgs-by-2025/259691 "2011-07-29T15:53:04Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![usmc2801](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/usmc2801/32/6387_2.png) [@usmc2801](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/usmc2801)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2011, 5:12am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/54-5-mpgs-by-2025/259691/21 "2011-07-31T05:12:50Z")
PJB’s problem is adapting…he is stuck in the past and cannot seem to grasp technology and change, like it or not hybrids and electric cars will be the future. ---
**Author:** ![Cliff](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/b38774/32.png) [@Cliff](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Cliff)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2011, 6:34am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/54-5-mpgs-by-2025/259691/22 "2011-07-31T06:34:53Z")
> [@Re-financing question](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/re-financing-question/44302/27): > > wow the amount of stupidity here always surprises me. > > yes this needs to happen. deal with it. > > this is also down from 62mpg > > by 2050 they don’t want any vehicles produced anymore that use oil for fuel. Exactly. Obviously the technology available today for electric motors is not as appealing to the car scene as a gas motor… but the manufacturers have been using gas powered motors for a century. Its been the primary focus. For all we know is thy electric might have capabilities to exceed gas powered vehicles 20 years from now. Its a new technology… look at computers 20 years ago… cell phones 10 years ago. If the focus switches I’m sure performance issues can be reasolved. We need to embrace the change… ---
**Author:** ![PJB](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/pjb/32/6389_2.png) [@PJB](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/PJB)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2011, 9:42am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/54-5-mpgs-by-2025/259691/23 "2011-07-31T09:42:21Z")
A top fuel dragster goes 300+ mph in a 1/4 mile in under 6 seconds. Still not something we all own or drive to work, mainly do to the same reason we’re not driving electric cars- practicality. ---
**Author:** ![Vovchandr](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/vovchandr/32/6275_2.png) [@Vovchandr](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Vovchandr)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2011, 9:50am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/54-5-mpgs-by-2025/259691/24 "2011-07-31T09:50:03Z")
What the hell does that have to do with anything? Every electric car, including the one above is practical yet still has super car performance. You do realize that something like 95% of equipment in the world is electric motor powered? ---
**Author:** ![PJB](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/pjb/32/6389_2.png) [@PJB](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/PJB)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2011, 9:56am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/54-5-mpgs-by-2025/259691/25 "2011-07-31T09:56:47Z")
well I was going with your performance specs there and how both are one seaters (atleast the red thing appears to be). Performance isnt everything. Most cars are not performance cars and a hell of alot of cars are driven by people who dont give a fuck about how fast it goes, how it handles, etc. I know that guys like us here that are into cars care about performance but we’re a small minority in reality. ---
**Author:** ![Turbo\_B18C\_EJ6](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/turbo_b18c_ej6/32/6611_2.png) [@Turbo\_B18C\_EJ6](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Turbo_B18C_EJ6)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2011, 10:02am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/54-5-mpgs-by-2025/259691/26 "2011-07-31T10:02:30Z")
well i think some of the domestic owners in the past have hated on imports because they were afraid of the technology that was beening used. Also electric motors create at least three times the power and torque as a internal combustion enigne “per hp”. Im still a fan of internal combustion enignes over electric but if done correctly can be impressive power wise to say the least ---
**Author:** ![Oppie1](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/oppie1/32/6374_2.png) [@Oppie1](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Oppie1)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2011, 10:23am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/54-5-mpgs-by-2025/259691/27 "2011-07-31T10:23:23Z")
If electric cars were more affordable, I would already own one. I love technology; bring it!!! BTW - it says light duty trucks, so who cares? I wonder what’s in store for the HD stuff and for peeps who tow and haul? ---
**Author:** ![PJB](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/pjb/32/6389_2.png) [@PJB](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/PJB)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2011, 10:41am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/54-5-mpgs-by-2025/259691/28 "2011-07-31T10:41:49Z")
Pickups are light duty trucks. 3/4 and 1 tons are included in that. ---
**Author:** ![Vovchandr](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/vovchandr/32/6275_2.png) [@Vovchandr](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Vovchandr)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2011, 11:52am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/54-5-mpgs-by-2025/259691/29 "2011-07-31T11:52:04Z")
> [@Apparently, the front fell off.](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/apparently-the-front-fell-off/42727/32): > > well I was going with your performance specs there and how both are one seaters (atleast the red thing appears to be). > > Performance isnt everything. Most cars are not performance cars and a hell of alot of cars are driven by people who dont give a fuck about how fast it goes, how it handles, etc. > > I know that guys like us here that are into cars care about performance but we’re a small minority in reality. That thing is a two seater FYI. So what’s your point? These things are cheaper to “refill” will work for vast majority of commuters and price will drop. If you wanna drive a few hundred miles a day, well then you’re fucked while the rest of the world will enjoy spending next to nothing on gas. ---
**Author:** ![Oppie1](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/oppie1/32/6374_2.png) [@Oppie1](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Oppie1)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2011, 12:00pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/54-5-mpgs-by-2025/259691/30 "2011-07-31T12:00:49Z")
> [@MMy New office \> yours](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/mmy-new-office-yours/44164/92): > > Pickups are light duty trucks. 3/4 and 1 tons are included in that. If it gets 44 mpg, and it can tow 15,000lbs, who gives a shit how they do it? That’s just my thinking… ---
**Author:** ![HudsonFalcon](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/hudsonfalcon/32/6460_2.png) [@HudsonFalcon](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/HudsonFalcon)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2011, 12:01pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/54-5-mpgs-by-2025/259691/31 "2011-07-31T12:01:23Z")
Mere words from the empty suit we call our President. Saying that goal and achieving that goal are two very different things. If it does happen however it’s another nail in the coffin for the US economy since foreign countires don’t & won’t have to conform to these ridiculous environmental standards and can create & ship goods for much cheaper. ---
**Author:** ![imported\_hybrdthry91](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/imported_hybrdthry91/32/6315_2.png) [@imported\_hybrdthry91](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/imported_hybrdthry91)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2011, 8:41am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/54-5-mpgs-by-2025/259691/32 "2011-08-01T08:41:12Z")
Why don’t they just require it next year? I mean just make it a law and they will have to comply right? It is obviously that simple isn’t it? What happens when performance suffers and the consumer doesn’t want to buy the cars that get 60+mpg? Instead they want to buy the car that gets 30mpg but has better performance? You can’t decide what the consumer is going to buy. So what happens when they produce 75% 60+mpg cars but the other 25% is the only thing that sells. What does ford and GM do when all the cars sit on the lot? do they just hike up the prices of the 25% to cover their costs? Why can’t the consumer’s choice drive the market? If they want better MPG they’ll buy cars with better MPG’s and the companies will produce more cars with better MPG’s. If the consumers don’t want them which statistics have shown american’s don’t want them then why force it. Chevy GM and ford all make plenty of cars that get better gas mileage but they don’t sell them in america because americans don’t want them. If we were really wanting to get off our foreign oil dependency the **first** thing they would do is offer incentives to produce more diesel cars. Which we could start TODAY because all the companies already make the diesel cars. Gasoline offers good performance/gallon, diesel offers excellent energy/gallon. Why would you waste your time trying to get 60+mpg on a gasoline engine when you can use less oil in a diesel. ---
**Author:** ![JSEnclosures](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/jsenclosures/32/6678_2.png) [@JSEnclosures](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/JSEnclosures)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2011, 9:18am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/54-5-mpgs-by-2025/259691/33 "2011-08-01T09:18:00Z")
if fullsize trucks need to get 44 i’d like to see someone try and tow with it, it would have to be gutless. I’m glad this is Obama’s focus and not the national debt ugh ---
**Author:** ![usmc2801](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/usmc2801/32/6387_2.png) [@usmc2801](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/usmc2801)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2011, 9:21am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/54-5-mpgs-by-2025/259691/34 "2011-08-01T09:21:50Z")
> [@new wheels + vw + jdm yo'](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/new-wheels-vw-jdm-yo/44332/38): > > if fullsize trucks need to get 44 i’d like to see someone try and tow with it, it would have to be gutless. I’m glad this is Obama’s focus and not the national debt ugh Yeah damn him!!! God forbid he tries to save the working American money on gas! What is he thinking??? You guys really are ridiculous, you look for anything at all to bash the President because you don’t like him. ---
**Author:** ![ninety1two40](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/ninety1two40/32/6332_2.png) [@ninety1two40](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/ninety1two40)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2011, 9:26am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/54-5-mpgs-by-2025/259691/35 "2011-08-01T09:26:06Z")
> [@OMFG it's BEAUTIFUL out!](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/omfg-its-beautiful-out/44337/42): > > Yeah damn him!!! > > God forbid he tries to save the working American money on gas! What is he thinking??? > > **You guys really are ridiculous, you look for anything at all to bash the President because you don’t like him.** Fuck Yeah! To hell with Obama:evilking ---
**Author:** ![KrazyKid](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/krazykid/32/6371_2.png) [@KrazyKid](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/KrazyKid)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2011, 9:55am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/54-5-mpgs-by-2025/259691/36 "2011-08-01T09:55:46Z")
Def doable. But it will take sacrifices. its like any off the wall car project you or I would take on. its so far “out of the ordinary” it will take giant leaps to accomplish. It wont be cheap. R&D and materials costs. - saftey: The cars/trucks we have, are “safe” because they are built like a brick shit house. Doors on a 2011 car weigh around 120lbs, back in the 90’s they were no where near that. Just one example. All the heavy ass THICK “safty” steel they dump into them weigh the cars down alot. look at the progression of the honda civics. 2011 civic weighs close to 2800lbs. a 1990 weighs 2100 or so. I know thats not all safty weight, it also includes a bunch of frivolous shit and over complicated electronics with MILES of wire. What I am getting at is, no a days cars are fucking beasts. Trucks weigh a a few tons. Aerodynamics. Trucks are fucking bricks. Most cars are getting better, up top, but not the entire package. To make this work they might look ugly but they could cut through the air better, so who cares. Math + physics. The HP needed to propel a car from a dead stop to XX speed, and the HP needed to sustain XX speed on level ground with no added winds, weights, or resistance. The results would surprise you. Sorry to say it, but you want to hit those figures, they might be slower, but they will do it. maybe it will keep the streets safer too. FUCK IT GOVERN THE CARS/TRUCKS DURING RUSHHOUR TIMES ON INTERSTATES!!! I actually would LOVE to see that happen. You want to drive fast, get the fuck off the interstate and risk it somewhere else. I GUARRENTEE once people got used to the fact that the more the press the gas pedal shit wont go any faster, all they are left to do is pay the fuck attention and stay in a lane… grid locks and piss poor traffic flows WILL get better. did you know most people spend close to 62 hours a year SITTING in traffic? Not going foward, wasting fuel. multiply that out by the MILLIONS OF TRAVELERS… thats a lot of wasted fuel! START THINKING OUTSIDE THE BOX, dont only focus on improving the cars, IMPROVE THE DAMN PROCESS! ---
**Author:** ![car\_ramrod](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/car_ramrod/32/6441_2.png) [@car\_ramrod](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/car_ramrod)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2011, 11:02am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/54-5-mpgs-by-2025/259691/37 "2011-08-01T11:02:18Z")
> [@Newman's 1986 BMW 326rb build thread.](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/newmans-1986-bmw-326rb-build-thread/22123/1527): > > Yeah, I can really see a fullsize truck getting 44 mpg. I would think these politicians would want us driving something getting 4 mpg because their pockets are lined with gas money. > [@Running from cops?](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/running-from-cops/44262/54): > > because no politicians own oil fields or are lobbied money by oil companies, right? > > Its an impossible goal, especially for trucks considering how few even break 20 mpg. > [@power adapters?](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/power-adapters/44305/4): > > Its known facts/news that oil money plays a big part in government. > > Oil is important because almost everybody in the country depends on it in one way or another. Therefore they tax and charge the fuck out of it and make more money. You are fucking retarded ---
**Author:** ![Vovchandr](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/vovchandr/32/6275_2.png) [@Vovchandr](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Vovchandr)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2011, 11:09am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/54-5-mpgs-by-2025/259691/38 "2011-08-01T11:09:37Z")
Hey Obama haters… I believe at least the last 6 presidents promised to reduce our dependence on foreign oil and with the record high gas prices the last two wanted to remove dependence on all oil. Will it work? Probably not, it’s all politics and correct me if I’m wrong but the republican house had to approve this. People that hate one party but not the other irk me. Either hate all govt or just stop caring as it wont change and it’s still the best around. As far as performance, those manufacturers will likely have to buy their way out of the rule or introduce other models to improve their avg brand MPG just as they had to do by 2015. Porsche has a 15 mpg model? Introduce 100mpg equivalent electric track beast. Could work. ---
**Author:** ![Cossey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/3ec8ea/32.png) [@Cossey](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Cossey)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2011, 7:38pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/54-5-mpgs-by-2025/259691/39 "2011-08-01T19:38:53Z")
> [@OMFG it's BEAUTIFUL out!](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/omfg-its-beautiful-out/44337/49): > > Hey Obama haters… > > I believe at least the last 6 presidents promised to reduce our dependence on foreign oil and with the record high gas prices the last two wanted to remove dependence on all oil. > > Will it work? Probably not, it’s all politics and correct me if I’m wrong but the republican house had to approve this. > > People that hate one party but not the other irk me. Either hate all govt or just stop caring as it wont change and it’s still the best around. > > As far as performance, those manufacturers will likely have to buy their way out of the rule or introduce other models to improve their avg brand MPG just as they had to do by 2015. > > Porsche has a 15 mpg model? Introduce 100mpg equivalent electric track beast. Could work. The thing that sucks is say a company makes two cars, one that gets 20mpg and one that gets 100mpg, while the average for the company is 60mpg, that is not the same as the CAFE required average. CAFE uses the “harmonic” mean, not the simple arithmetic mean. The harmonic mean is measured: X / (1/Y1 +1/Y2) = Z X = Number of cars in fleet (2 in my example) Y = MPG of a car, continuing for each vehicle in the fleet (Y1 = 20, Y2 = 100) Z = CAFE measured average MPG across the fleet. So by my calculations, CAFE would measure it as 33.33mpg across the fleet, but using the math we learned through school, it is 60mpg. Pretty fucked up IMO. ---
**Author:** ![Vovchandr](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/vovchandr/32/6275_2.png) [@Vovchandr](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Vovchandr)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2011, 11:47pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/54-5-mpgs-by-2025/259691/40 "2011-08-01T23:47:45Z")
It’s actually 40 MPG by your example of 20 and 100. But yes common sense would say that it’s 60. [Previous page](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/54-5-mpgs-by-2025/259691.md?page=1) [Next page](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/54-5-mpgs-by-2025/259691.md?page=3)