# DC considering taxing 401ks **URL:** \ **Category:** NYSpeed Off Topic\ **Created:** [April 28, 2012, 7:25am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/dc-considering-taxing-401ks/222569 "2012-04-28T07:25:00Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Neon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/f19dbf/32.png) [@Neon](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Neon)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2012, 4:07am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/dc-considering-taxing-401ks/222569/21 "2012-04-30T04:07:29Z")
> [@Blue Eyed Devil"](#): > > Just saw this on FoxNews. Source? Because it’s kind of hard to take them seriously when Fox also says Obama is an immigrant socialist terrorist. ---
**Author:** ![boxxa](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/boxxa/32/5045_2.png) [@boxxa](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/boxxa)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2012, 5:23am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/dc-considering-taxing-401ks/222569/22 "2012-04-30T05:23:12Z")
> [@Neon](#): > > Source? Because it’s kind of hard to take them seriously when Fox also says Obama is an immigrant socialist terrorist. I agree. I am against taxes and all for smaller government but I do know Fox does like to spin anything they can esp. during election season. ---
**Author:** ![TradersBASE](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/tradersbase/32/5321_2.png) [@TradersBASE](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/TradersBASE)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2012, 7:00am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/dc-considering-taxing-401ks/222569/23 "2012-04-30T07:00:32Z")
> [@slo ride](#): > > i enjoy making the money but i do not enjoy watching what is done with the nearly 1/3 of it that uncle sam/state takes and just throws down the trash shoot of failed programs…then has the gall to come back and say that we aren’t ‘paying our fair share’. it is absolutely ridiculous. i am not a slave to debt and i do not feel pigeon holed by any government policies to any great extent, but i’m sick of politicians telling me i owe something to everyone else while at the same time they just keep expanding government and government spending. This is how I feel as well. I feel in our _supposed_ setup, the government exists to socialize the nations wealth _within reason_… **to enable growth and for the greater good of the nation**. They are in power to try and balance the scales of private capitalism AND to support private capitalism…to create a mixed mode economy. “Infrastructure spending” isn’t supposed to be blowing up bombs and destroying other countries to secure opium, cheap oil or to enforce the “petrodollar”. They aren’t supposed to be frivolous with our spending power and inflate our currency to worthless, yet they are. Spend and invest into OUR economy with OUR dollars. Reward companies that create tangible/fundamental growth and those that support our own economy & internal workforce. Penalize those that outsource labor & fail to support our own economy. Just make damn sure the tariffs or fees go back into our economy in place of them supporting the US directly. The government has no investment capital, their capital is revenue secured through taxation or inflation. It ALL comes at the expense of “we the people”. They have signed us up for a debt burden we cannot possibly satisfy, given our lack of manufacturing or production. We are fundamentally bankrupt at this point, hard fact to face and why most shy away from discussing reality I suspect. I would argue we are worse than Ireland in reality. I’ll probably catch flack for this statement, I’m ok with that. Why would I suggest such a silly thing when the numbers say otherwise? Because our military spending and other absurdly large BS figures are added into our GDP skewing the truth, we don’t see honest numbers. When you peg bullshit to your GDP, you’re fucking with the lowest common denominator. You’re bound to have magical powers, an ability to create illusionary wealth. > [@slowtalon](#): > > I don’t think anyone is saying you aren’t paying your fair share, i think they are talking about the people who make 100x more then you who are paying 10% on their taxes because they can afford lawyers to find them loopholes. If they payed the same tax rate as you i don’t think anyone could complain about them not paying enough taxes. > > I never thought id say this but i think it time for the dems to give the republicans what they want “flat tax.” I mean that would actually equate to a huge tax increase on the super rich, a decrease to the taxes of the middle class (the ones who need it), and the poor would stay exactally where they are, paying nothing in income tax and supplementing the coffers through sales and other taxes. I mean all the bickering about how 40% of Americans dont pay taxes, well my math might be wrong but 30% of 0 is still 0. > > The fact that on the senate floor they were talking about how raising taxes on the wealthy would only raise a few billion a year in revenue so its not worth it. While at the same time arguing how planned parenthood should be cut to save 100million a year shows just how clueless they are. If you cut programs like planned parenthood and the ability of poor women to get contraceptive’s you only further the problem. Do you want the people who cant afford things like medical care and contraceptives reproducing and sucking on Americas tit even more. Hell they should give out birth control on the corners for free, so those people might have a chance to finish their education and become functioning members of society. My biggest issue with the “Buffett rule” they are proposing is they aren’t going after the type of money they suggest they are. The rich earn via capital gains, not income. Also at this point even if they were able to bleed the rich it wouldn’t cover our debt load and they would further devastate employment to boot. Why don’t they incentivize the handout segment to get educated and go to work? Why don’t they re-tool the factory workers that saw their jobs outsourced, being left with no marketable skills? Because they want the working class to hate them and keep us divided. They could more easily “teach them how to fish” but it actually serves their goal to “give them the fish”. Even more than the last comment, why don’t they incentivize American companies to stay here with their labor? 0% corporate tax if you use American labor as one idea. Our government bloat (financial and regulatory) as well as the American wage (due to inflation) make it mega attractive to outsource labor. This is the key issue with artificial “stimulus” which amounts to inflation. This is the problem with “trickle down economics” post NAFTA/free trade agreements. Inflation when equally dispersed and operating in a vacuum is a non event. Inflation in a free trade environment is unsustainable. Added— [![](https://canada1.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/uploads/speedlife/original/3X/2/5/2519de6e294aeec2ee24d38f7eb8e0b56acd4eb5.jpeg "American Manufacturing - Did You Know?") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H8BGK97IKgg) I posted this in another thread but it’s worth another watch IMO. ---
**Author:** ![boxxa](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/boxxa/32/5045_2.png) [@boxxa](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/boxxa)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2012, 8:06am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/dc-considering-taxing-401ks/222569/24 "2012-04-30T08:06:33Z")
That is the biggest problem with our country. Everyone wants change but the government does nothing to do it in the right direction. Yes, bring manufacturing back to the US but when a company tries to, they give them the run around. Obama wants to keep spending money, why not let them spend it in the right way and give it to companies who want to hire people here or build a plant here? Nope, he rather pay people to build roads and infrastructure with materials produced over seas… brilliant! I think that quote in the video was from Steve Jobs. They have tried to move their manufacturing here in the past and have gotten the run around so why would a company deal with it? ---
**Author:** ![TradersBASE](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/tradersbase/32/5321_2.png) [@TradersBASE](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/TradersBASE)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2012, 8:22am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/dc-considering-taxing-401ks/222569/25 "2012-04-30T08:22:07Z")
> [@boxxa](#): > > That is the biggest problem with our country. Everyone wants change but the government does nothing to do it in the right direction. Yes, bring manufacturing back to the US but when a company tries to, they give them the run around. Obama wants to keep spending money, why not let them spend it in the right way and give it to companies who want to hire people here or build a plant here? Nope, he rather pay people to build roads and infrastructure with materials produced over seas… brilliant! I think that quote in the video was from Steve Jobs. They have tried to move their manufacturing here in the past and have gotten the run around so why would a company deal with it? White picket fences are being made in China and imported to America these days. Ahhh, the American dream. LOL The import/export game has played a major role in currency manipulation for sure. As we moved from manufacturing jobs to service jobs, from production to consumption they had to find a way to lower the cost of imports. Especially given the cost of American made goods, thanks to our inflated wages. ---
**Author:** ![Blue\_Eyed\_Devil](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/blue_eyed_devil/32/7292_2.png) [@Blue\_Eyed\_Devil](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Blue_Eyed_Devil)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2012, 8:31am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/dc-considering-taxing-401ks/222569/26 "2012-04-30T08:31:48Z")
Here is a Fox video from a week ago, not the same thing I saw but… [http://video.foxnews.com/v/1579289651001/congress-eyes-tax-on-401k-retirement-funds/](http://video.foxnews.com/v/1579289651001/congress-eyes-tax-on-401k-retirement-funds/) ---
**Author:** ![boxxa](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/boxxa/32/5045_2.png) [@boxxa](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/boxxa)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2012, 10:09am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/dc-considering-taxing-401ks/222569/27 "2012-04-30T10:09:26Z")
> [@Blue Eyed Devil](#): > > Here is a Fox video from a week ago, not the same thing I saw but… > > [http://video.foxnews.com/v/1579289651001/congress-eyes-tax-on-401k-retirement-funds/](http://video.foxnews.com/v/1579289651001/congress-eyes-tax-on-401k-retirement-funds/) If this passes or even becomes on the table, there will be riots over this. ---
**Author:** ![Blue\_Eyed\_Devil](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/blue_eyed_devil/32/7292_2.png) [@Blue\_Eyed\_Devil](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Blue_Eyed_Devil)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2012, 10:15am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/dc-considering-taxing-401ks/222569/28 "2012-04-30T10:15:23Z")
Riots in this country? Not a chance. The media will just say the rioters are neo-nazis and the rest of us should just pay no attention and go on being sheep… I mean good citizens. And “we” will. ---
**Author:** ![TradersBASE](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/tradersbase/32/5321_2.png) [@TradersBASE](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/TradersBASE)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2012, 10:34am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/dc-considering-taxing-401ks/222569/29 "2012-04-30T10:34:31Z")
Rioting or a threat of rioting could lead to indefinite detention without trial. HRMMMM. ---
**Author:** ![boxxa](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/boxxa/32/5045_2.png) [@boxxa](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/boxxa)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2012, 10:55am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/dc-considering-taxing-401ks/222569/30 "2012-04-30T10:55:24Z")
Yes, I am not saying that I would start riots or will riot, I just think it would really provoke the middle class. Occupy Wall Street came and was pretty big but turned to the image that it was dirty hippies all with their own agenda. It accomplished nothing but still showed that a lot of people are get pissed off. Most of the working class weren’t phased because while we were working hard, they were being bums in the street but now, if they come after something we have worked for, I just see more people getting pissed off since the approval rating of congress is so low, gas prices are over $4/gallon, and our dollar is worthless. The only thing this country has going for it is the government will continue to tax us more and more until we are all just working for the government. ---
**Author:** ![Blue\_Eyed\_Devil](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/blue_eyed_devil/32/7292_2.png) [@Blue\_Eyed\_Devil](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Blue_Eyed_Devil)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2012, 11:03am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/dc-considering-taxing-401ks/222569/31 "2012-04-30T11:03:38Z")
We all have to throw out that disclaimer. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![slowtalon](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/slowtalon/32/7205_2.png) [@slowtalon](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/slowtalon)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2012, 11:26am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/dc-considering-taxing-401ks/222569/32 "2012-04-30T11:26:40Z")
> [@boxxa](#): > > Yes, I am not saying that I would start riots or will riot, I just think it would really provoke the middle class. Occupy Wall Street came and was pretty big but turned to the image that it was dirty hippies all with their own agenda. It accomplished nothing but still showed that a lot of people are get pissed off. Most of the working class weren’t phased because while we were working hard, they were being bums in the street but now, if they come after something we have worked for, I just see more people getting pissed off since the approval rating of congress is so low, gas prices are over $4/gallon, and our dollar is worthless. The only thing this country has going for it is the government will continue to tax us more and more until we are all just working for the government. They wouldnt care if the middle class rioted because its such a small percentage of population they wouldnt even have to cover it. The fact is incentives to keep good paying American jobs sounds like a good idea but until there is a way to make sure people are payed well, and manufacturing costs in America can compete with those over seas there will still be the same problems. Mexico could put a product to market right now for way less. As long the average Americans income is tied up in paying back debt like student loans and mortgages they will buy the cheaper item. There used to be a time Americans could buy the more expensive better quality items, or the made in America items solely on principle, but there disposable income has diminished so greatly because of easily acquired high interest credit cards and loans that they no longer have that option. All the manufacturing in the world wouldnt make a difference if no one can buy the goods because their entire income goes to paying bills and trying to feed their family. Rather than subsidizing American companies and giving out more tax breaks why not get rid of NAFTA and go back to charging companies for importing goods? Perhaps that will keep American jobs in America and allow us to compete with $2 a week salaries in China. I agree taxing the rich even 80% wont solve the problem we must do something, but that money needs to be put to good use. They need to help states with infrastructure projects that bring back good paying jobs and put people to work. The fact is that those unions that you hear republicans saying are a thing of the past make up almost all blue collar well paying jobs, and they pay a great deal of there income into taxes. Companies no longer pay well and those good paying jobs that used to pay a large proportion into taxes that help finance government are gone, those people now work 2 or 3 low paying jobs just to pay there bills and that takes in turn means less jobs for other less qualified people who traditionally only needed a minimum wage job to survive and those people turn to government assistance. ---
**Author:** ![LZ1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@LZ1](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/LZ1)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2012, 11:29am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/dc-considering-taxing-401ks/222569/33 "2012-04-30T11:29:57Z")
Maybe people need to get into other industries and not manufacturing? Tech is doing extremely well Would be real interesting to mess with NAFTA after we import everything now. ---
**Author:** ![Blue\_Eyed\_Devil](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/blue_eyed_devil/32/7292_2.png) [@Blue\_Eyed\_Devil](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Blue_Eyed_Devil)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2012, 11:31am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/dc-considering-taxing-401ks/222569/34 "2012-04-30T11:31:46Z")
Wow seriously? You have been around long enough to have read my posts. Did you see the video about manufacturing and how important it is for this country to survive? WE CAN’T ALL WORK IN SERVICE JOBS, THEY ADD NOTHING TO THE ECONOMY. (For the millionth time) ---
**Author:** ![LZ1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@LZ1](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/LZ1)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2012, 11:36am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/dc-considering-taxing-401ks/222569/35 "2012-04-30T11:36:25Z")
:lol: I wasn’t arguing with you that we need manufacturing it was to the previous post about well paying jobs. It took a long time to get America fucked on the manufacturing side and there isn’t a quick/simple solution even forcing a major change now will take years to unfuck. You realize all of tech isn’t service right? Software dev etc? Google for example. Blue eyed Devil: I’m curious what your thoughts are on GM and manufacturing? Seems like GM was over paying the hell out of people assembling cars which ultimately lead to them failing horribly. ---
**Author:** ![Blue\_Eyed\_Devil](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/blue_eyed_devil/32/7292_2.png) [@Blue\_Eyed\_Devil](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Blue_Eyed_Devil)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2012, 11:37am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/dc-considering-taxing-401ks/222569/36 "2012-04-30T11:37:32Z")
Oh Ok then 🙂 Tech is no different than any other field, if you are stupid or lazy or both there are no good paying jobs. ---
**Author:** ![LZ1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@LZ1](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/LZ1)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2012, 11:45am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/dc-considering-taxing-401ks/222569/37 "2012-04-30T11:45:29Z")
> [@Blue Eyed Devil](#): > > Oh Ok then 🙂 > > Tech is no different than any other field, if you are stupid or lazy or both there are no good paying jobs. So look at all the people at GM who were making 40+ an hour assembling cars…this is going to sound shitty but you can’t have everyone in the country in the middle class. ---
**Author:** ![Blue\_Eyed\_Devil](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/blue_eyed_devil/32/7292_2.png) [@Blue\_Eyed\_Devil](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Blue_Eyed_Devil)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2012, 11:49am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/dc-considering-taxing-401ks/222569/38 "2012-04-30T11:49:48Z")
This is where it gets complicated. If the govt stopped printing money they wouldn’t have to make $40,000 to survive because their money would buy a lot more. Blah, blah, blah I could go on for hours at this point. The pay is just the tip of the iceberg. ---
**Author:** ![TradersBASE](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/tradersbase/32/5321_2.png) [@TradersBASE](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/TradersBASE)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2012, 12:01pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/dc-considering-taxing-401ks/222569/39 "2012-04-30T12:01:21Z")
> [@boxxa](#): > > Yes, I am not saying that I would start riots or will riot, I just think it would really provoke the middle class. Occupy Wall Street came and was pretty big but turned to the image that it was dirty hippies all with their own agenda. It accomplished nothing but still showed that a lot of people are get pissed off. Most of the working class weren’t phased because while we were working hard, they were being bums in the street but now, if they come after something we have worked for, I just see more people getting pissed off since the approval rating of congress is so low, gas prices are over $4/gallon, and our dollar is worthless. The only thing this country has going for it is the government will continue to tax us more and more until we are all just working for the government. Once the majority are reliant upon the government for elitist based social control, protection and jobs we’ve essentially lost our ability to think & act for ourselves. If you do think for yourself you’re labeled a “tin foiler” like I am, for going against the grain. Look at Hitler and how he rose to power, he took advantage of people that were confused & lost faith due to an economic D-Day. I’m not saying Hitler like leadership will swoop in here, but I’m also not ruling it out. Time will tell, I’m not willing to predict a time frame and don’t claim to be a visionary. It’s surely not quick & easy to dethrone the world’s superpower of course. > [@Blue Eyed Devil](#): > > Wow seriously? You have been around long enough to have read my posts. Did you see the video about manufacturing and how important it is for this country to survive? WE CAN’T ALL WORK IN SERVICE JOBS, THEY ADD NOTHING TO THE ECONOMY. (For the millionth time) THIS. I kinda hate to admit it because I work in IT and earn a living off service work but facts are facts. Service jobs can **facilitate** _some_ growth but these jobs aren’t self sustainable nor directly growth producing for obvious reasons. Tip of the iceberg indeed. Inflation is a side effect, the root cause is currency dilution, abuse of the monetary base. ---------- Post added at 03:01 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:57 PM ---------- > [@LZ](#): > > So look at all the people at GM who were making 40+ an hour assembling cars…this is going to sound shitty but you can’t have everyone in the country in the middle class. The entitlement beyond fundamental reasoning is why GM flopped, they should have folded and had their assets auctioned off. Nobody here is advocating EVERYONE should be middle class, but capitalism does require a thriving middle class to sustain itself. If you don’t have a vast & employed middle class who will buy your warez as a capitalist? ---
**Author:** ![LZ1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@LZ1](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/LZ1)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2012, 12:05pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/dc-considering-taxing-401ks/222569/40 "2012-04-30T12:05:54Z")
> [@TradersBASE](#): > > The entitlement beyond fundamental reasoning is why GM flopped, they should have folded and had their assets auctioned off. > Nobody here is advocating EVERYONE should be middle class, but capitalism does require a thriving middle class to sustain itself. If you don’t have a vast & employed middle class who will buy your warez as a capitalist? Cisco/Juniper/Google/Tenable/Microsoft all have a huge world wide market with software/design engineers based out of the US. I wasn’t talking about the guy from help desk who comes and replaces your mouse changing the world. [Previous page](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/dc-considering-taxing-401ks/222569.md?page=1) [Next page](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/dc-considering-taxing-401ks/222569.md?page=3)