# GM loses $1.1 billion in the third quarter **URL:** \ **Category:** NYSpeed Automotive\ **Created:** [October 17, 2005, 2:45pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/gm-loses-1-1-billion-in-the-third-quarter/3493 "2005-10-17T14:45:24Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![RedGoober4Life](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/redgoober4life/32/7610_2.png) [@RedGoober4Life](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/RedGoober4Life)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2005, 2:45pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/gm-loses-1-1-billion-in-the-third-quarter/3493/1 "2005-10-17T14:45:24Z")
_ **DETROIT** -_ [_General Motors Corp._](javascript:companybox(‘GM’)) _on Monday reported a net loss of $1.1 billion in the third quarter, down from a net income of $315 million a year ago._ _GM lost $1.92 per share, compared with a gain of 56 cents per share in the third quarter of 2004._ _Including special items, GM lost $1.6 billion in the July-September period, or $2.89 per share. Special items included a charge of $805 million for asset impairments in North America and Europe and restructuring charges of $56 million at GM Europe._ _Total revenue was $47 billion for the quarter, up from $44.8 billion in 2004._ _GM failed to meet Wall Street’s expectations for a loss of 87 cents a share, according to Thomson Financial._ _It was another difficult quarter for the world’s largest automaker, which lost nearly $1.4 billion in the first half of the year._ [http://www.detnews.com/2005/autosinsider/0510/17/0auto-351322.htm](http://www.detnews.com/2005/autosinsider/0510/17/0auto-351322.htm) Oh GM, don’t die ☹ There doesn’t seem to be much hope for them. Hopefully the new trucks attract some buyers, although with gas prices being higher it doesn’t seem like people will want trucks, even if they get fairly good gas mileage. Their image is pretty bad. Like I said, having the Corvette in the lineup doesn’t make up for boring cars. They need to change their thinking, because it’s clearly not working well for them. I wonder why they spent their efforts on the Solstice, as it’s unlikely that it will be able to provide them with a customer base that will make them profitable. The only think looking good for GM right now is Saturn. I’ve seen spy pictures of the new Vue on [thecarconnection.com](http://thecarconnection.com) and it looks like it could be very good (give it good fuel economy, price it well, and it could be great for them–it’s base on Daewoo architecture btw). Also, the new Aura is set to come out for 2007 I believe. It looks more upscale than the Malibu, just as sporty as the G6, and has a nice interior. Not only that, they are getting the pretty sister in the small convertible family. Now just replace the Ion with something else. Preferably with a normal interior and a non-castoga wagon rear suspension suitable for North American roads and GM may just have one division that has cars that people want to buy at MSRP. Oh, and they may get new customers! Imagine that. ---
**Author:** ![Viper966](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/viper966/32/7268_2.png) [@Viper966](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Viper966)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2005, 2:47pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/gm-loses-1-1-billion-in-the-third-quarter/3493/2 "2005-10-17T14:47:54Z")
GM cars are boring… uninspired Regurgitated cars that just dont make me want to buy ---
**Author:** ![\_Karu](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/_karu/32/7602_2.png) [@\_Karu](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/_Karu)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2005, 2:51pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/gm-loses-1-1-billion-in-the-third-quarter/3493/3 "2005-10-17T14:51:01Z")
> [@Viper966](#): > > GM cars are boring… uninspired Regurgitated cars that just dont make me want to buy ^^^ too bad for GM…however, i think this is exactly why…:shrug: ---
**Author:** ![neurokinetik](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/neurokinetik/32/7270_2.png) [@neurokinetik](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/neurokinetik)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2005, 2:55pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/gm-loses-1-1-billion-in-the-third-quarter/3493/4 "2005-10-17T14:55:10Z")
> [@Viper966](#): > > GM cars are boring… uninspired Regurgitated cars that just dont make me want to buy You could say that about Toyota’s current lineup as well. The only difference is that Toyota’s reliability record is stellar and GM’s is not. ---
**Author:** ![mike125k](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/mike125k/32/7282_2.png) [@mike125k](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/mike125k)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2005, 2:58pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/gm-loses-1-1-billion-in-the-third-quarter/3493/5 "2005-10-17T14:58:47Z")
whats so “un” boring about an accord, camry, civic? they seem pretty boring to me. ---
**Author:** ![RedGoober4Life](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/redgoober4life/32/7610_2.png) [@RedGoober4Life](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/RedGoober4Life)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2005, 3:39pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/gm-loses-1-1-billion-in-the-third-quarter/3493/6 "2005-10-17T15:39:45Z")
Image. GM needs a new image. ---
**Author:** ![JayS](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/jays/32/15375_2.png) [@JayS](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/JayS)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2005, 4:09pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/gm-loses-1-1-billion-in-the-third-quarter/3493/7 "2005-10-17T16:09:12Z")
This should be huge for them though: [http://money.cnn.com/2005/10/17/news/fortune500/gm\_wagoner/index.htm](http://money.cnn.com/2005/10/17/news/fortune500/gm_wagoner/index.htm) GM cars and trucks are not the problem. Drive down the road at 5pm and count the number of GM vehicles on the road and it’s clear they’re still moving lots of cars off the lots. When poor corporate policies and high union benefits and wages start pulling billions out of those sales it becomes difficult to compete. GM loves big trucks and SUV’s because the profit margin is high enough that they can afford to pay the “people” cost of running their business the way they do. Look for much more benefit restructuring to come and GM to come out of it able to sell a car better than the Honda Accord for similar money and actually make a profit on it. ---
**Author:** ![Smaefer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e79b87/32.png) [@Smaefer](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Smaefer)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2005, 4:14pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/gm-loses-1-1-billion-in-the-third-quarter/3493/8 "2005-10-17T16:14:15Z")
From what I have been hearing GM’s future is not in the Auto Industry. ---
**Author:** ![05OrangeSS](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/0/eada6e/32.png) [@05OrangeSS](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/05OrangeSS)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2005, 5:02pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/gm-loses-1-1-billion-in-the-third-quarter/3493/9 "2005-10-17T17:02:03Z")
I think the whole issue of GM not making their money is the “image” that foreign(don’t know how to spell that) cars are better. My cobalt mechanicaly runs great and shows no signs of deterioration with 5300 spirited miles. Until people want to support the american auto industry it will more than likey go down the sh\*tter. Just my personal feelings, but I will never buy a foreign car, even though the cobalt ss has outsourced parts. Hopefully the will bring back the Camaro or Trans Am, because I would like to be able to stay with Chevrolet for all my future cars. ---
**Author:** ![mike125k](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/mike125k/32/7282_2.png) [@mike125k](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/mike125k)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2005, 5:14pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/gm-loses-1-1-billion-in-the-third-quarter/3493/10 "2005-10-17T17:14:53Z")
That’s perposterous! Imports are always more reliable than domestics! > Most Dependable Vehicles by the [Editors of MSN Autos](http://autos.msn.com/help/AutosHelp.aspx?xml=masthead) In a study of three-year-old vehicles, models from General Motors and Ford win top spot in most segments. Eight different models from General Motors earned the top score in their individual categories, while [Lexus](http://autos.msn.com/browse/Lexus.aspx) earned the top brand ranking in the J.D. Power and Associates 2005 Vehicle Dependability Study (VDS). The Vehicle Dependability Study measures problem symptoms experienced by original owners of three-year-old vehicles (2002 models). The vehicles are scored based on the number of problems per 100 vehicles (PP100). > Overall, the auto industry showed a remarkable 12 percent improvement in long-term dependability, according to the study. The industry average improved 32 PP100 compared to 2004, and 84 percent of vehicle models included in the 2005 VDS also showed year-over-year improvements. The most significant improvements include ride, handling and braking; engine; and interior. > “While the Initial Quality Study [IQS], which measures problems experienced in the first 90 days of ownership can be an indicator of how models will perform over time, our studies consistently show that long-term durability is a tremendously important factor to consumers,” said Chance Parker, executive director of product and research analysis at J.D. Power and Associates. “As the number of problems owners experience with their vehicles increases, repurchase intent and the number of recommendations owners will make to others decreases. The study also finds that long-term durability can have a significant impact on a vehicle’s retained value.” > Toyota’s Lexus brand was the top-ranked nameplate for the eleventh consecutive year with just 139 PP100. With the largest percentage improvement year over year—38 percent— [Porsche](http://autos.msn.com/browse/Porsche.aspx) was ranked second for 2005. [Lincoln](http://autos.msn.com/browse/Lincoln.aspx), [Buick](http://autos.msn.com/browse/Buick.aspx) and [Cadillac](http://autos.msn.com/browse/Cadillac.aspx) filled out the top five spots, respectively. > Also showing great improvement was [Hyundai](http://autos.msn.com/browse/Hyundai.aspx). The Korean automaker improved an impressive 115 PP100. “Hyundai experienced similar levels of improvement in the 2002 Initial Quality Study when these vehicles were new, which shows a successful effort by Hyundai in translating short-term quality improvements into higher long-term quality,” said Parker. “Even though there is still room for improvement, Hyundai is a great example of an automaker that is making strides toward improving vehicle quality by paying close attention to owner feedback and designing products with both short- and long-term quality in mind.” > Both GM and [Ford](http://autos.msn.com/browse/Ford.aspx) earned record-high segment awards, and GM’s [Chevrolet](http://autos.msn.com/browse/Chevrolet.aspx) division captured the top spot in seven segments. While the Lexus brand earned the top spot in just three segments, the [LS 430](http://autos.msn.com/research/vip/overview.aspx?year=2005&make=Lexus&model=LS%20430&src=News) luxury sedan, with a score of 90 PP100, is the first model in the history of this study to receive fewer than 100 problems per 100 vehicles. > Here are some of the details of the 2005 J.D. Power Vehicle Dependability Study: > > **Top Vehicles By Category** > **Compact Car** > [Chevrolet Prizm](http://autos.msn.com/research/vip/default.aspx?make=Chevrolet&model=Prizm&src=News) > **Entry Midsize Car** > [Chevrolet Malibu](http://autos.msn.com/research/vip/default.aspx?make=Chevrolet&model=Malibu&src=News) > **Premium Midsize Car** > [Buick Century](http://autos.msn.com/research/vip/default.aspx?make=Buick&model=Century&src=News) > **Full-Size Car** > [Buick LeSabre](http://autos.msn.com/research/vip/default.aspx?make=Buick&model=LeSabre&src=News) > **Entry Luxury** > [Ford Thunderbird](http://autos.msn.com/research/vip/default.aspx?make=Ford&model=Thunderbird&src=News) > **Mid Luxury Car** > [Lincoln Town Car](http://autos.msn.com/research/vip/default.aspx?make=Lincoln&model=Town%20Car&src=News) > **Premium Luxury Car** > [Lexus LS 430](http://autos.msn.com/research/vip/default.aspx?make=Lexus&model=LS%20430&src=News) > **Sporty Car** > [Mazda Miata](http://autos.msn.com/research/vip/default.aspx?make=Mazda&model=MX-5%20Miata&src=News) > **Premium Sports Car** > [Porsche 911](http://autos.msn.com/research/vip/default.aspx?make=Porsche&model=911&src=News) > **Midsize Pickup** > [Chevrolet S-10 Pickup](http://autos.msn.com/research/vip/default.aspx?make=Chevrolet&model=S-10&src=News) > **Light Duty Full-Size Pickup** > [Cadillac Escalade EXT](http://autos.msn.com/research/vip/default.aspx?make=Cadillac&model=Escalade%20EXT&src=News) > **Heavy Duty Full-Size Pickup** > [Chevrolet Silverado HD](http://autos.msn.com/research/vip/default.aspx?make=Chevrolet&model=Silverado%202500HD&src=News) > **Entry SUV** > [Honda CR-V](http://autos.msn.com/research/vip/default.aspx?make=Honda&model=CR-V&src=News) > **Midsize SUV** > [Toyota 4Runner](http://autos.msn.com/research/vip/default.aspx?make=Toyota&model=4Runner&src=News) > **Full-Size SUV** > [GMC Yukon](http://autos.msn.com/research/vip/default.aspx?make=GMC&model=Yukon&src=News)/[GMC Yukon XL](http://autos.msn.com/research/vip/default.aspx?make=GMC&model=Yukon%20XL&src=News) > **Entry Luxury SUV** > [Lexus RX 300](http://autos.msn.com/research/vip/default.aspx?make=Lexus&model=RX%20300&src=News) > **Premium Luxury SUV** > [Lexus LX 470](http://autos.msn.com/research/vip/default.aspx?make=Lexus&model=LX%20470&src=News) > > **Top Ten Nameplates** > > - [Lexus](http://autos.msn.com/browse/Lexus.aspx) 139 PP100 > - [Porsche](http://autos.msn.com/browse/Porsche.aspx) 149 PP100 > - [Lincoln](http://autos.msn.com/browse/Lincoln.aspx) 151 PP100 > - [Buick](http://autos.msn.com/browse/Buick.aspx) 163 PP100 > - [Cadillac](http://autos.msn.com/browse/Cadillac.aspx) 175 PP100 > - [Infiniti](http://autos.msn.com/browse/Infiniti.aspx) 178 PP100 > - [Toyota](http://autos.msn.com/browse/Toyota.aspx) 194 PP100 > - [Mercury](http://autos.msn.com/browse/Mercury.aspx) 195 PP100 > - [Honda](http://autos.msn.com/browse/Honda.aspx) 201 PP100 > - [Acura](http://autos.msn.com/browse/Acura.aspx) 203 PP100 > _Source: J.D. Power and Associates 2005 Vehicle Dependability Study_ ---
**Author:** ![RedGoober4Life](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/redgoober4life/32/7610_2.png) [@RedGoober4Life](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/RedGoober4Life)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2005, 5:24pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/gm-loses-1-1-billion-in-the-third-quarter/3493/11 "2005-10-17T17:24:23Z")
> [@05OrangeSS](#): > > My cobalt mechanicaly runs great and shows no signs of deterioration with 5300 spirited miles. I should hope so! :shrug: ---
**Author:** ![Viper966](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/viper966/32/7268_2.png) [@Viper966](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Viper966)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2005, 5:26pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/gm-loses-1-1-billion-in-the-third-quarter/3493/12 "2005-10-17T17:26:20Z")
> [@05OrangeSS](#): > > I think the whole issue of GM not making their money is the “image” that foreign(don’t know how to spell that) cars are better. My cobalt mechanicaly runs great and shows no signs of deterioration with 5300 spirited miles. Until people want to support the american auto industry it will more than likey go down the sh\*tter. Just my personal feelings, but I will never buy a foreign car, even though the cobalt ss has outsourced parts. Hopefully the will bring back the Camaro or Trans Am, because I would like to be able to stay with Chevrolet for all my future cars. yea but your cobalt is now only worth half of what u orig paid for it… GM over extended itself with rebadging the same car 5 or 6 times… its retarded… if i dont want a explorer i dont want an aviator or a mountaineer etc… i just dont see what makes them do shit like that … ---
**Author:** ![mike125k](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/mike125k/32/7282_2.png) [@mike125k](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/mike125k)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2005, 5:43pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/gm-loses-1-1-billion-in-the-third-quarter/3493/13 "2005-10-17T17:43:31Z")
> [@Viper966](#): > > GM over extended itself with rebadging the same car 5 or 6 times… its retarded… > > if i dont want a explorer i dont want an aviator or a mountaineer etc… i just dont see what makes them do shit like that … because its very cheap (comparatively) to build those. and just because you dont like them doesnt mean other people dont. an explorer and aviator are vastly different vehicles despite being built on the same platform. ---
**Author:** ![jeeves744](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/jeeves744/32/7619_2.png) [@jeeves744](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/jeeves744)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2005, 6:59pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/gm-loses-1-1-billion-in-the-third-quarter/3493/14 "2005-10-17T18:59:31Z")
and they also finally got the canadan union to take a huge cut in their over paid health insurance. Which will save GM $3 billion a year. [http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20051017/bs\_nm/autos\_gm\_dc\_17](http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20051017/bs_nm/autos_gm_dc_17) GM is fucked because of having to pay out assloads of money to all these union health plans and pensions. They are forced to cut corners and add to the price of every car to pay for that crap. ---
**Author:** ![halas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/898d66/32.png) [@halas](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/halas)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2005, 7:05pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/gm-loses-1-1-billion-in-the-third-quarter/3493/15 "2005-10-17T19:05:38Z")
> [@neurokinetik](#): > > You could say that about Toyota’s current lineup as well. The only difference is that Toyota’s reliability record is stellar and GM’s is not. :word: But even with this news the stocks went up $2.11 with the additional news of the new union health care agreement. Usually when a company posts losses more than 15 billion in three quarters their stock will barrel down to single digits yet GM has only lost about $15 per share which is huge but not that bad. I believe their setting themselves up nicely for the '07 UAW national agreement talks with financial jumbling. They still have $19.5 Biliion in untouched reserves. Yes, there are many bland models but no more than any other high volume cars out there. Its obvious that their more recent models are better preceived by the public and are selling well. Their even going to sink to the bottom or thrive better than ever, we won’t know till the first few quarters of '08. ---
**Author:** ![JayS](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/jays/32/15375_2.png) [@JayS](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/JayS)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2005, 7:24pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/gm-loses-1-1-billion-in-the-third-quarter/3493/16 "2005-10-17T19:24:24Z")
> [@Viper966](#): > > GM over extended itself with rebadging the same car 5 or 6 times… its retarded… > > if i dont want a explorer i dont want an aviator or a mountaineer etc… i just dont see what makes them do shit like that … Like GM is the only manufacturer to do that. I don’t want a Jetta or an A4. I don’t want a Camry or an ES300. I don’t want a Pathfinder or a QX4. I don’t want WRX or a 9-2x. Manufactures do this because for 95% of the public a few different body panels, engine and exhaust tuning and interior accessories make entirely different cars. And the manfacture can save big time on development. ---
**Author:** ![boardjnky4](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/96bed5/32.png) [@boardjnky4](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/boardjnky4)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2005, 8:20pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/gm-loses-1-1-billion-in-the-third-quarter/3493/17 "2005-10-17T20:20:05Z")
jetta and a4’s are not the same car, same engines but not same car, i actually looked into that a few yrs ago when i wanted to buy one. A4 is right in btwn passat size and jetta size. ---
**Author:** ![RedGoober4Life](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/redgoober4life/32/7610_2.png) [@RedGoober4Life](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/RedGoober4Life)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2005, 8:41pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/gm-loses-1-1-billion-in-the-third-quarter/3493/18 "2005-10-17T20:41:07Z")
> [@JayS](#): > > I don’t want WRX or a 9-2x. You notice that was GM’s idea, right? 🤣 Anyway, I don’t mind platform sharing. I just think the two cars should appeal to two different buyers. I still haven’t quite understood GMC. The Envoy and Trailblazer both sell well, but beyond that who really cares if it’s a GMC or a Chevy? A perfect example of what I like to see: Ford Focus, Mazda 3, Volvo S40. An example of what I hate to see: Plymouth Neon, Dodge Neon, Chrysler Neon. ---
**Author:** ![Minglor](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/minglor/32/7373_2.png) [@Minglor](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Minglor)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2005, 9:12pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/gm-loses-1-1-billion-in-the-third-quarter/3493/19 "2005-10-17T21:12:46Z")
> [@JayS](#): > > I don’t want a Jetta or an A4. i’ll take both because they are different. and maybe we can change that A to an S 😛 Sorry but i will not miss gm. ---
**Author:** ![05OrangeSS](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/0/eada6e/32.png) [@05OrangeSS](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/05OrangeSS)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2005, 9:32pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/gm-loses-1-1-billion-in-the-third-quarter/3493/20 "2005-10-17T21:32:38Z")
ok, well since this is a automotive enthusiast forum I would go out on a limb and say 95% of the people on this particular forum itself actually care for their car and regularly maintain it. I would also go out on a limb and say for my car being a brand new platform the reliability is promising so far. And as far as depreciation I’m pretty sure my car has not yet lost 50% of it’s value to whoever made that unresearched remark, meaning my car is worth $12,500, I highly doubt that. The reason the american automotive industry is in such bad shape as it is now is because people for some odd reason have the stigma that if it’s a honda it will automatically run forever, not saying honda is a bad car but like i said before I will not support the foreign market when they pay their employees like crap and pocket all the profit. My personal opinion is that those surveys are conducted in such a way that the “uninformed” driver who just buys a car and just puts gas in it and expects it to last forever find that the hondas, and whatever other foreign cars tend to take more abuse before braking? [Next page](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/gm-loses-1-1-billion-in-the-third-quarter/3493.md?page=2)