# Housing. It's an expense. **URL:** \ **Category:** NYSpeed Off Topic\ **Created:** [December 14, 2009, 7:57am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/housing-its-an-expense/77218 "2009-12-14T07:57:06Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![neonglh](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/neonglh/32/4951_2.png) [@neonglh](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/neonglh)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2009, 9:57am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/housing-its-an-expense/77218/21 "2009-12-14T09:57:00Z")
> [@Fry"](#): > > Not an investment. > > For example, here’s a typical scenario: > > Finance $100,000 for a house. > $1000/month escrow payment (principle, interest, homeowners insurance.) > x 12 months > x 5 years > =$60,000 dollars > > Unlikely that the house has appreciated $60k in 5 years, don’t you think? > > Probably a net loss, although maybe it’s less of a net loss than renting. If it appreciated $30k, then you only spent $30k or $500/month. A lot of rentals will cost you over $500/month. > > …And, discuss! On my 83k mortgage, I will pay 161k over 30 years, making minimum payments. That means with 0 inflation I will have paid almost 80k just to live there for 30 years. But… if I sold the house in 30 years, I bet it would go for 120 +, making it 40k or less to live there for 30 years. Then you have to factor the tax rebates, write-offs, etc… if you rent for 30 years, you’re going to pay 700+ now a month, and then it’s going to go up every year. You don’t get ANY of that back. So yes, it’s an expense, but less of an expense than renting :tup: If you do rental properties, it’s less of an expense, maybe even an investment. ---
**Author:** ![TurboTSi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/22d042/32.png) [@TurboTSi](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/TurboTSi)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2009, 10:05am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/housing-its-an-expense/77218/22 "2009-12-14T10:05:52Z")
^^^^^^^^ > [@How did you know you were ready...](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/how-did-you-know-you-were-ready/75568/9): > > I hate this argument. I pay $450 a month right now for rent. If I had a house right now, it would be $700+ a month for my mortgage, including a $400 or so a month tax, that I will never get back. > > And… people say you have something to show for, or you can make money from the house, but it’s all funny money. If I buy a house for 80k, sell it for 100k 10 year later… all of the other houses have gone up 20k in those 10 years as well! > > The only reason to own is so that you can customize the house to exactly how you want, and you can write off more taxes. That is it Remember when you thought the opposite 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![neonglh](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/neonglh/32/4951_2.png) [@neonglh](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/neonglh)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2009, 10:11am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/housing-its-an-expense/77218/23 "2009-12-14T10:11:41Z")
> [@TurboTSi](#): > > ^^^^^^^^ > > Remember when you thought the opposite 🙂 Hah, I’ll still argue both ways. My initial points still are valid, it’s just smarter to own :highfive: ---
**Author:** ![cougarspeed](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/cougarspeed/32/7468_2.png) [@cougarspeed](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/cougarspeed)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2009, 10:13am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/housing-its-an-expense/77218/24 "2009-12-14T10:13:30Z")
Ugh it is still in investment even if you take a loss. You are investing in your satisfaction, quality of life, financial stability, and equity to name a few. Also lets not forget if you are not owning you are probably renting so after maybe losing a few k over 30years of owning isn’t as bad as losing 15-20k a year to rent a COMPARABLE house. I hate it when renters try comparing $$$ figures. Yeah bro your 640sqft place in a complex is totally as nice as my 3200sqft house lol. ---
**Author:** ![drvnkd](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/drvnkd/32/109615_2.png) [@drvnkd](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/drvnkd)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2009, 10:16am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/housing-its-an-expense/77218/25 "2009-12-14T10:16:23Z")
What about the value of money today vs. 30 years from now? My neighbor just listed their house for 134k. If I could get that for my “nicer” house, I would fall into the 60k appreciation in 6 years category 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Willybeen](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/willybeen/32/7351_2.png) [@Willybeen](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Willybeen)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2009, 10:18am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/housing-its-an-expense/77218/26 "2009-12-14T10:18:17Z")
the only time renting makes sense is when you think you might be moving in a couple years max… especially those who bought houses 2 years ago here for 400k and lost their jobs and now have homes worth 200k with a 400k note. ---
**Author:** ![LAFENGAS](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/lafengas/32/7573_2.png) [@LAFENGAS](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/LAFENGAS)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2009, 10:20am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/housing-its-an-expense/77218/27 "2009-12-14T10:20:22Z")
As an expense…HOW HAS REMODELING NOT BEEN MENTIONED THUS FAR? ---
**Author:** ![Willybeen](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/willybeen/32/7351_2.png) [@Willybeen](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Willybeen)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2009, 10:21am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/housing-its-an-expense/77218/28 "2009-12-14T10:21:34Z")
remodeling CAN be an investment too… ---
**Author:** ![Joe](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/joe/32/7219_2.png) [@Joe](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Joe)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2009, 10:24am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/housing-its-an-expense/77218/29 "2009-12-14T10:24:41Z")
remodeling can swing both ways. Im putting a couple grand into redoing my bathroom which will probably increase the value of my house more than what i put into it. However I’d love to knock out the small bedroom next to it and turn it into half glamour bath, half walk-in closet for the master. But that would make it from a 3br to a 2br and actually knock money off. ---
**Author:** ![deebo](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/deebo/32/5218_2.png) [@deebo](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/deebo)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2009, 10:25am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/housing-its-an-expense/77218/30 "2009-12-14T10:25:22Z")
Yeah, uh… just dont take out a 200k loan on 30years and not make any advanced principle payments, seeing as you’re paying the cost of the house JUST in interest… i wouldn’t really see that as an investment ---
**Author:** ![theblue](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/theblue/32/5074_2.png) [@theblue](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/theblue)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2009, 10:25am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/housing-its-an-expense/77218/31 "2009-12-14T10:25:50Z")
one missing factor here is inflation. If you buy a house today for a $1000 monthly payment and inflation occurs (it will), you’ll still by paying $1000 a month in 10 years while your friends who rent will continue to see rent increases along with inflation. ---
**Author:** ![Blue\_Eyed\_Devil](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/blue_eyed_devil/32/7292_2.png) [@Blue\_Eyed\_Devil](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Blue_Eyed_Devil)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2009, 10:26am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/housing-its-an-expense/77218/32 "2009-12-14T10:26:53Z")
^Another good point. > [@Willybeen](#): > > … especially those who bought houses 2 years ago here for 400k and lost their jobs and now have homes worth 200k with a 400k note. My Aunt got lucky and did the opposite. I know I posted about this in the past but, my Aunt got out in and out at the right times and made huge money on her Sarasota and Wash. DC properties in just a few years. I mean more than you could make in WNY in 40 years. Again, location, location, location. ---
**Author:** ![Fry](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/fry/32/7284_2.png) [@Fry](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Fry)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2009, 10:29am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/housing-its-an-expense/77218/33 "2009-12-14T10:29:25Z")
> [@cougarspeed](#): > > Ugh it is still in investment even if you take a loss. You are investing in your satisfaction, quality of life, financial stability, and equity to name a few. Also lets not forget if you are not owning you are probably renting so after maybe losing a few k over 30years of owning isn’t as bad as losing 15-20k a year to rent a COMPARABLE house. I hate it when renters try comparing $$$ figures. Yeah bro your 640sqft place in a complex is totally as nice as my 3200sqft house lol. Word. It’s way better. I’m just proposing that a person doesn’t normally turn a profit on a single family home when you add up interest, taxes, repairs, some kinds of remodeling, etc. It can definitely be cheaper than renting if you do it right, and you definitely get a better quality of life for your money. :tup" ---
**Author:** ![neonglh](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/neonglh/32/4951_2.png) [@neonglh](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/neonglh)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2009, 10:31am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/housing-its-an-expense/77218/34 "2009-12-14T10:31:00Z")
You can definitely get some good return on investment if you do some types of remodeling by yourself. I plan on finishing my garage for around $1,000, but I guarontee that it will up the value of my house when I sell it more than that initial $1,000. With that said though, there are definitely good and bad things to do, if you want to make a good return on them, you have to pick your battles. ---
**Author:** ![drvnkd](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/drvnkd/32/109615_2.png) [@drvnkd](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/drvnkd)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2009, 10:32am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/housing-its-an-expense/77218/35 "2009-12-14T10:32:39Z")
So, now your not moving? Or bitter about paying more money just to have a place to visit between work and Kansas? ---
**Author:** ![Joe](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/joe/32/7219_2.png) [@Joe](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Joe)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2009, 10:34am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/housing-its-an-expense/77218/36 "2009-12-14T10:34:47Z")
i might also add that owning a house is a pain in the ass ☹ I wish i could call maintenance for everything ---
**Author:** ![cougarspeed](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/cougarspeed/32/7468_2.png) [@cougarspeed](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/cougarspeed)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2009, 10:35am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/housing-its-an-expense/77218/37 "2009-12-14T10:35:33Z")
> [@Fry](#): > > Word. It’s way better. > > I’m just proposing that a person doesn’t normally turn a profit on a single family home when you add up interest, taxes, repairs, some kinds of remodeling, etc. > > It can definitely be cheaper than renting if you do it right, and you definitely get a better quality of life for your money. :tup" I agree that it may or may not return on investment. I feel given a long enough term(20+years) most people will actually return though to be honest. Given inflation and tax deductions and such. However no matter what if you are going to seek a certain standard of living regardless then owning is a wealth building tool as in over x amount of years it is likely your loss would be much less hence still having more monies!!! This is how owning builds wealth not just ROI. ---
**Author:** ![deebo](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/deebo/32/5218_2.png) [@deebo](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/deebo)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2009, 10:35am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/housing-its-an-expense/77218/38 "2009-12-14T10:35:49Z")
my father bought a house for something in the high 2’s, they’ve been living there for maybe 4 or 5 years, but it’s now worth somewhere in the 7’s-8’s, maybe 9s it really depends on where you buy the house, and how the market is ---
**Author:** ![boardjnky4](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/96bed5/32.png) [@boardjnky4](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/boardjnky4)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2009, 10:38am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/housing-its-an-expense/77218/39 "2009-12-14T10:38:07Z")
> [@LAFENGAS](#): > > As an expense…HOW HAS REMODELING NOT BEEN MENTIONED THUS FAR? I mentioned purchasing handy-man specials ---
**Author:** ![slow84ta](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/slow84ta/32/7265_2.png) [@slow84ta](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/slow84ta)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2009, 10:41am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/housing-its-an-expense/77218/40 "2009-12-14T10:41:54Z")
> [@cougarspeed](#): > > Ugh it is still in investment even if you take a loss. You are investing in your satisfaction, quality of life, financial stability, and equity to name a few. Also lets not forget if you are not owning you are probably renting so after maybe losing a few k over 30years of owning isn’t as bad as losing 15-20k a year to rent a COMPARABLE house. I hate it when renters try comparing $$$ figures. Yeah bro your 640sqft place in a complex is totally as nice as my 3200sqft house lol. :word: Renters will always pay rent. Home owners will someday not have to pay a mortgage. Plus all the tax perks, I get more money back in taxes then when I just ranted. My rent and mortgage payments are close too. So it’s not like I’m spending an ass load more. Sure if something breaks I gotta fix it, but thats why I bought a brand new house, so I wont have to worry about it for along time. :loopie: When I rented, I hated it, there was always trash in renting situations, atleast in mine. Now I own in a nice area and don’t have to worry about what might happen to my car at night or who might be trying to bang my door down at 4am for someone whom used to rent before me. :bloated: [Previous page](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/housing-its-an-expense/77218.md?page=1) [Next page](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/housing-its-an-expense/77218.md?page=3)