# NADA vs KBB vs Black Book Rant **URL:** \ **Category:** NYSpeed Automotive\ **Created:** [December 16, 2015, 7:42am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/nada-vs-kbb-vs-black-book-rant/273402 "2015-12-16T07:42:09Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![LUC1F3R](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/luc1f3r/32/7299_2.png) [@LUC1F3R](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/LUC1F3R)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2015, 7:42am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/nada-vs-kbb-vs-black-book-rant/273402/1 "2015-12-16T07:42:09Z")
Anyone have some insight as to how dealers chose what price they wanna use to value a trade in? The wife’s car is worth $21500 on the low end of nada and kbb but only $17500 in black book…which is what two dealers have offered. One of the dealers had the same car in a lower trim on the lot for $26k and they still wouldn’t budge on trade in value. What gives? ---
**Author:** ![OfficerK](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/4da419/32.png) [@OfficerK](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/OfficerK)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2015, 7:49am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/nada-vs-kbb-vs-black-book-rant/273402/2 "2015-12-16T07:49:24Z")
Dealers want to make the most money? ---
**Author:** ![tpgsr](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/tpgsr/32/7374_2.png) [@tpgsr](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/tpgsr)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2015, 7:55am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/nada-vs-kbb-vs-black-book-rant/273402/3 "2015-12-16T07:55:51Z")
The last guy I talked to told me that they typically use those for reference but the Adessa pricing is where they will typically work from. ---
**Author:** ![LZ1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@LZ1](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/LZ1)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2015, 7:58am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/nada-vs-kbb-vs-black-book-rant/273402/4 "2015-12-16T07:58:54Z")
@Beck ---
**Author:** ![LUC1F3R](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/luc1f3r/32/7299_2.png) [@LUC1F3R](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/LUC1F3R)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2015, 7:59am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/nada-vs-kbb-vs-black-book-rant/273402/5 "2015-12-16T07:59:14Z")
Any way to see adessa pricing without being a dealer? The douchebag at one dealer showed me auction pricing on 3.0l sedans as comparables… ---
**Author:** ![Onyx\_Z32](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/onyx_z32/32/7581_2.png) [@Onyx\_Z32](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Onyx_Z32)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2015, 8:03am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/nada-vs-kbb-vs-black-book-rant/273402/6 "2015-12-16T08:03:57Z")
For a trade in it’s really their call and they’re going to use whatever suits them. KBB always seemed low to me, NADA a bit high. Black book is updated more frequently than the others so it’s more prone to market swings. Trade in and what they’re going to sell it for are totally different. You can’t compare the $26k car on the lot to yours because it may have had tires put on, parts & labor done to get it ready to sell. It’s also possible that they over offered for the car on the lot, had to invest too much to get it sell worthy and since they were burned they’re less inclined to take another of those cars in on trade… unless they get it for $17,500. ---
**Author:** ![LUC1F3R](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/luc1f3r/32/7299_2.png) [@LUC1F3R](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/LUC1F3R)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2015, 8:07am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/nada-vs-kbb-vs-black-book-rant/273402/7 "2015-12-16T08:07:22Z")
I guess I expected a little more flexibility on trade in pricing when spending over 50k on a new car…buying shit sucks. ---
**Author:** ![Onyx\_Z32](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/onyx_z32/32/7581_2.png) [@Onyx\_Z32](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Onyx_Z32)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2015, 8:08am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/nada-vs-kbb-vs-black-book-rant/273402/8 "2015-12-16T08:08:25Z")
> [@LUC1F3R](#): > > Any way to see adessa pricing without being a dealer? > > The douchebag at one dealer showed me auction pricing on 3.0l sedans as comparables… One of them (NADA or Blue Book, I forget which) IS auction pricing so you wouldn’t really benefit. What kind of car are we talking about? - - - Updated - - - > [@LUC1F3R](#): > > I guess I expected a little more flexibility on trade in pricing when spending over 50k on a new car…buying shit sucks. Are you paying cash or financing? If financing, are you doing it through the dealership or finding a lender on your own? ---
**Author:** ![LUC1F3R](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/luc1f3r/32/7299_2.png) [@LUC1F3R](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/LUC1F3R)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2015, 8:13am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/nada-vs-kbb-vs-black-book-rant/273402/9 "2015-12-16T08:13:48Z")
> [@Onyx Z32](#): > > One of them (NADA or Blue Book, I forget which) IS auction pricing so you wouldn’t really benefit. > > What kind of car are we talking about? > > - > - > - Updated - - - > > Are you paying cash or financing? If financing, are you doing it through the dealership or finding a lender on your own? trading in a cts performance coupe, looking to buy a 16 ats performance/premium coupe, i believe financing has to go through ally because of loyalty offers. ---
**Author:** ![Onyx\_Z32](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/onyx_z32/32/7581_2.png) [@Onyx\_Z32](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Onyx_Z32)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2015, 8:29am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/nada-vs-kbb-vs-black-book-rant/273402/10 "2015-12-16T08:29:26Z")
> [@LUC1F3R](#): > > trading in a cts performance coupe, looking to buy a 16 ats performance/premium coupe, i believe financing has to go through ally because of loyalty offers. Ah, ok so you have no flexibility on lenders. And anything “performance” (in my limited experience) isn’t going to be great on trade since it’s the middle of winter. Remember they have to turn around the car and sell it so they don’t want it on the lot for 6 months. And if they have to auction it they’re not getting top dollar. I remember a joke about trading in a Camaro in December but can’t remember the punch line… basically the Camaro owner gets screwed. This is likely why black book is lower. ---
**Author:** ![LUC1F3R](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/luc1f3r/32/7299_2.png) [@LUC1F3R](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/LUC1F3R)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2015, 8:32am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/nada-vs-kbb-vs-black-book-rant/273402/11 "2015-12-16T08:32:28Z")
> [@Onyx Z32](#): > > Ah, ok so you have no flexibility on lenders. > > And anything “performance” (in my limited experience) isn’t going to be great on trade since it’s the middle of winter. Remember they have to turn around the car and sell it so they don’t want it on the lot for 6 months. And if they have to auction it they’re not getting top dollar. I remember a joke about trading in a Camaro in December but can’t remember the punch line… basically the Camaro owner gets screwed. This is likely why black book is lower. eh that sucks as performance doesn’t really mean performance…its just caddys tier system. Basically just means that it gets all the goodies except navigation which is in their premium level. (base\ **Author:** ![Beck](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/beck/32/28683_2.png) [@Beck](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Beck)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2015, 8:41am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/nada-vs-kbb-vs-black-book-rant/273402/12 "2015-12-16T08:41:49Z") KBB is a guide. Dealers buy cars. KBB can say your car is worth $60,000 and guess what? They don’t have to write a check for it. There is no accountability. A dealer says your car is worth $17,000 and is willing to write a check? Then it’s worth what someone is willing to pay for it. KBB is always high. Edmunds is surprisingly close (assuming you don’t rate your 50,000 mile car as “clean”) What is the car you are trying to trade in? PM me and I’ll look up manheim. ---
**Author:** ![Onyx\_Z32](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/onyx_z32/32/7581_2.png) [@Onyx\_Z32](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Onyx_Z32)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2015, 8:44am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/nada-vs-kbb-vs-black-book-rant/273402/13 "2015-12-16T08:44:00Z")
> [@LUC1F3R](#): > > eh that sucks as performance doesn’t really mean performance…its just caddys tier system. Basically just means that it gets all the goodies except navigation which is in their premium level. (base\ **Author:** ![bracketracer](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/bracketracer/32/15592_2.png) [@bracketracer](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/bracketracer)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2015, 8:45am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/nada-vs-kbb-vs-black-book-rant/273402/14 "2015-12-16T08:45:07Z") Yep, Manheim is the source here. Updated daily, with real world auction sale numbers. ---
**Author:** ![LUC1F3R](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/luc1f3r/32/7299_2.png) [@LUC1F3R](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/LUC1F3R)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2015, 8:46am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/nada-vs-kbb-vs-black-book-rant/273402/15 "2015-12-16T08:46:58Z")
> [@Onyx Z32](#): > > I hear ya but it was always my impression the general rule was you wanted to buy coupes or “sporty” cars in the winter and trade them in the summer. Someone like @**[Beck](http://www.nyspeed.com/member.php?u=5819)** or @**[Kramer](http://www.nyspeed.com/member.php?u=34280)** has been in the business more recently so maybe that’s changed. > > You could also look at it this way: You’re getting $4k less on your trade, but saving $1,500 or so in taxes on the new car by trading it in. Yep which is why im pushing to trade rather than sell on my own. Plus the car we want has to be ordered so i dont want the wife to be stuck without a car. ---
**Author:** ![Onyx\_Z32](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/onyx_z32/32/7581_2.png) [@Onyx\_Z32](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Onyx_Z32)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2015, 8:49am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/nada-vs-kbb-vs-black-book-rant/273402/16 "2015-12-16T08:49:00Z")
> [@bracketracer](#): > > Yep, Manheim is the source here. Updated daily, with real world auction sale numbers. Daily would probably make the trade in price worse off for him if there are seasonal factors involved. Ultimately as Beck said it’s only worth what someone will give you for it. ---
**Author:** ![Quattro\_Krant](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/ac91a4/32.png) [@Quattro\_Krant](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Quattro_Krant)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2015, 11:11am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/nada-vs-kbb-vs-black-book-rant/273402/17 "2015-12-16T11:11:51Z")
Just like every asshole that wants to trade me in their whipped 2000 Volvo with 2 million miles on it, looking for $30K, and wanting to pay nothing for a new one. It is only worth what someone will pay. ---
**Author:** ![Joe](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/joe/32/7219_2.png) [@Joe](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Joe)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2015, 11:25am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/nada-vs-kbb-vs-black-book-rant/273402/18 "2015-12-16T11:25:37Z")
FWIW, both of the Buffalo area Cadillac dealers I went to offered me jack shit when I tried to trade in my STS-V on a new CTS Vsport, and they couldn’t even get me the Opulent Blue I wanted. Like, $10,000. Pretty sure they thought I was just a dreamer. I ended up getting $17,500 from a dealer in Detroit for it, finding the car I wanted in stock on [cars.com](http://cars.com). The look on the sales manager’s face when I brought the new one in for service a week later to ask about a light I was getting was priceless 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![LUC1F3R](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/luc1f3r/32/7299_2.png) [@LUC1F3R](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/LUC1F3R)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2015, 11:36am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/nada-vs-kbb-vs-black-book-rant/273402/19 "2015-12-16T11:36:21Z")
> [@Quattro Krant](#): > > Just like every asshole that wants to trade me in their whipped 2000 Volvo with 2 million miles on it, looking for $30K, and wanting to pay nothing for a new one. It is only worth what someone will pay. Is that what you think is happening here? - - - Updated - - - > [@Joe](#): > > FWIW, both of the Buffalo area Cadillac dealers I went to offered me jack shit when I tried to trade in my STS-V on a new CTS Vsport, and they couldn’t even get me the Opulent Blue I wanted. Like, $10,000. Pretty sure they thought I was just a dreamer. I ended up getting $17,500 from a dealer in Detroit for it, finding the car I wanted in stock on [cars.com](http://cars.com). > > The look on the sales manager’s face when I brought the new one in for service a week later to ask about a light I was getting was priceless 🙂 I may have to go this route. Was registration a PITA? Ive noticed that the car im trading in goes for 27-28 down in the jersey area, and gm pricing on the ats should be the same there as it is here. ---
**Author:** ![Kramer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/97f17d/32.png) [@Kramer](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Kramer)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2015, 11:43am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/nada-vs-kbb-vs-black-book-rant/273402/20 "2015-12-16T11:43:27Z")
someone said it…but kbb doesn’t write checks and half the time a vehicle im trying to sell to someone is usually below KBB price and they still bitch [Next page](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/nada-vs-kbb-vs-black-book-rant/273402.md?page=2)