# New video surfaces of P51D crash @ Reno this summer **URL:** \ **Category:** Shift518 Off Topic\ **Created:** [December 19, 2011, 11:33am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/new-video-surfaces-of-p51d-crash-reno-this-summer/261864 "2011-12-19T11:33:48Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 19\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Boxersix](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/boxersix/32/6327_2.png) [@Boxersix](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Boxersix)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2011, 11:33am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/new-video-surfaces-of-p51d-crash-reno-this-summer/261864/1 "2011-12-19T11:33:48Z")
A new video was released yesterday of the Reno airshow crash of the P51D that killed numerous people instantly, and seriously injured many more. It was initally thought that the plane came in low and slid taking out the crowd, but this video clearly shows that was not the case [http://bobmccarty.com/2011/09/16/video-p-51-crash-at-reno-air-show/](http://bobmccarty.com/2011/09/16/video-p-51-crash-at-reno-air-show/) He apparently made a full loop pass at which time the plane nose dived into the earth at well over 350mph. Note one thing about the crash?..it happened SO fast that there wasn’t a fuel explosion, just debris. Another video, which I haven’t been able to locate, apparently shows a front view of the cockpit moments before the crash and it shows that the pilot could not be seen in the plane. The pilot of a P51 is positioned shoulder-high and upright when strapped in, and it’s not known whether the seat failed, or he black out and slumped forward over the yoke. :’( ---
**Author:** ![RTrac1](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/rtrac1/32/6312_2.png) [@RTrac1](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/RTrac1)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2011, 11:40am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/new-video-surfaces-of-p51d-crash-reno-this-summer/261864/2 "2011-12-19T11:40:36Z")
buddy of mine races there. was a scary few hours not knowing if he was in the stands during that crash! that video makes me sick to my stomach. intense ---
**Author:** ![Shady](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/6de8d8/32.png) [@Shady](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Shady)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2011, 11:45am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/new-video-surfaces-of-p51d-crash-reno-this-summer/261864/3 "2011-12-19T11:45:07Z")
Wow… ---
**Author:** ![capitalcrew](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e79b87/32.png) [@capitalcrew](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/capitalcrew)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2011, 12:06pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/new-video-surfaces-of-p51d-crash-reno-this-summer/261864/4 "2011-12-19T12:06:26Z")
Jesus christ. The fucking sound. ---
**Author:** ![TurboTravis](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/turbotravis/32/6406_2.png) [@TurboTravis](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/TurboTravis)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2011, 1:58pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/new-video-surfaces-of-p51d-crash-reno-this-summer/261864/5 "2011-12-19T13:58:36Z")
The pilot was in his 70’s, correct? ---
**Author:** ![RocketPunch](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/rocketpunch/32/6429_2.png) [@RocketPunch](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/RocketPunch)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2011, 3:38pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/new-video-surfaces-of-p51d-crash-reno-this-summer/261864/6 "2011-12-19T15:38:37Z")
Holy shit!! Horrible… ---
**Author:** ![Boxersix](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/boxersix/32/6327_2.png) [@Boxersix](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Boxersix)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2011, 8:14pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/new-video-surfaces-of-p51d-crash-reno-this-summer/261864/7 "2011-12-19T20:14:51Z")
> [@Praxair Roll Call!](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/praxair-roll-call/47341/19): > > The pilot was in his 70’s, correct? Yeah, mid 70’s. Was one of the worlds best pilots of this aircraft. ---
**Author:** ![TurboTravis](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/turbotravis/32/6406_2.png) [@TurboTravis](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/TurboTravis)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2011, 9:21pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/new-video-surfaces-of-p51d-crash-reno-this-summer/261864/8 "2011-12-19T21:21:00Z")
> [@F.S. EVO Clutch Line Stainless steel braided](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/f-s-evo-clutch-line-stainless-steel-braided/47355/2): > > Yeah, mid 70’s. Was one of the worlds best pilots of this aircraft. Huge gray area with the age IMO. ---
**Author:** ![Boxersix](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/boxersix/32/6327_2.png) [@Boxersix](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Boxersix)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2011, 11:30pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/new-video-surfaces-of-p51d-crash-reno-this-summer/261864/9 "2011-12-19T23:30:18Z")
Yes and no I guess, I know what you’re getting at. I know some 70+ year olds that are in better health than people younger than I am. My flight instructor was in his mid to late 70’s back when I was in flight school and the guy was tip top/sharp as a tack as they say.:dunno. I’ve read all sorts of babble on this crash, from parts of the elevator missing in photos, to how the plane had big modifications to control surfaces and other misc BS(nothing definitive though). The picture of him “not in the plane” though makes me wonder if the seat did fail, because even if he had blacked or red out, you would still see him strapped in slumped over. Hate to see people get killed. REALLY hate seeing another one of these planes go down. Yeaaaah, I’m THAT asshole. ---
**Author:** ![TurboTravis](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/turbotravis/32/6406_2.png) [@TurboTravis](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/TurboTravis)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2011, 11:35pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/new-video-surfaces-of-p51d-crash-reno-this-summer/261864/10 "2011-12-19T23:35:46Z")
> [@Looking to mod my XBOX 360...need some info](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/looking-to-mod-my-xbox-360-need-some-info/47301/18): > > Yes and no I guess, I know what you’re getting at. I know some 70+ year olds that are in better health than people younger than I am. My flight instructor was in his mid to late 70’s back when I was in flight school and the guy was tip top/sharp as a tack as they say.:dunno. > > I’ve read all sorts of babble on this crash, from parts of the elevator missing in photos, to how the plane had big modifications to control surfaces and other misc BS(nothing definitive though). The picture of him “not in the plane” though makes me wonder if the seat did fail, because even if he had blacked or red out, you would still see him strapped in slumped over. > > Hate to see people get killed. REALLY hate seeing another one of these planes go down. Yeaaaah, I’m THAT asshole. Huge difference in comparing your flight instructor in a 152 to this guy, but I know what you’re saying. Again, huge gray area. These things are ‘experimental’ right? Curious to see how ‘low’ the seat could go if various parts of the structure failed. ---
**Author:** ![Boxersix](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/boxersix/32/6327_2.png) [@Boxersix](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Boxersix)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2011, 11:41pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/new-video-surfaces-of-p51d-crash-reno-this-summer/261864/11 "2011-12-19T23:41:43Z")
Some are and some are not. they update certain flight controls and electronics for reliability and redundancy. common airframe crap that you already know about. Some of the P38’s/p40’s out there are those experimentals, while many of the remaining P51’s are still pretty unmolested. And I’ve never flown a 152 to be honest :tongue 172, 182, 182RG, some beech and mooney’s, Da20’s. I’d rather be in an open ultralight than a 152 at this point :rofl ---
**Author:** ![TurboTravis](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/turbotravis/32/6406_2.png) [@TurboTravis](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/TurboTravis)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2011, 11:45pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/new-video-surfaces-of-p51d-crash-reno-this-summer/261864/12 "2011-12-19T23:45:17Z")
> [@About to switch some lights, ever bought from here](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/about-to-switch-some-lights-ever-bought-from-here/47295/7): > > Some are and some are not. they update certain flight controls and electronics for reliability and redundancy. common airframe crap that you already know about. Some of the P38’s/p40’s out there are those experimentals, while many of the remaining P51’s are still pretty unmolested. > > And I’ve never flown a 152 to be honest :tongue 172, 182, 182RG, some beech and mooney’s, Da20’s. I’d rather be in an open ultralight than a 152 at this point :rofl Any links to the pics that you’ve mentioned? ---
**Author:** ![Boxersix](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/boxersix/32/6327_2.png) [@Boxersix](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Boxersix)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2011, 12:43pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/new-video-surfaces-of-p51d-crash-reno-this-summer/261864/13 "2011-12-20T12:43:26Z")
New photo of the damaged elevator, showing trim aero breaking off. This is just elevator trim and really doesn’t affect the flight of the plane to the point that it would have caused this crash on it’s own. ![http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-lSf0Fc2zXII/TnTWsfvnLiI/AAAAAAAADsE/eTvKv7ZQb9A/s1600/Reno-crash.jpg](http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-lSf0Fc2zXII/TnTWsfvnLiI/AAAAAAAADsE/eTvKv7ZQb9A/s1600/Reno-crash.jpg) Trim piece of trailing edge on elevator now completely gone during flight(well before the crash) ![http://msnbcmedia3.msn.com/j/MSNBC/Components/Photo/_new/g-cvr-110917-crash-330pm.grid-8x2.jpg](http://msnbcmedia3.msn.com/j/MSNBC/Components/Photo/_new/g-cvr-110917-crash-330pm.grid-8x2.jpg) Him clearly visible in the cockpit prior to takeoff ![http://cdn2.dailycaller.com/2011/09/9e3854e1584b4e0a95c5042198168cd7.jpg](http://cdn2.dailycaller.com/2011/09/9e3854e1584b4e0a95c5042198168cd7.jpg) And in the dive. ![http://www.chron.com/mediaManager/?controllerName=image&action=get&id=1605506&width=628&height=471](http://www.chron.com/mediaManager/?controllerName=image&action=get&id=1605506&width=628&height=471) May take on this…either his belts came undone and he’s crumpled up under the yoke, or that seat failed and he’s unable to ever remotely control that plane. and why is the tail gear down?..Scrambling ot pull on anything he could like the undercarriage levers to get back up??? This was the pilot :’( ![http://www.csmonitor.com/var/ezflow_site/storage/images/media/images/0917-reno-air-races-crash.jpg/10727943-1-eng-US/0917-reno-air-races-crash.jpg_full_600.jpg//](http://www.csmonitor.com/var/ezflow_site/storage/images/media/images/0917-reno-air-races-crash.jpg/10727943-1-eng-US/0917-reno-air-races-crash.jpg_full_600.jpg//) And right before the impact ![http://msnbcmedia4.msn.com/j/MSNBC/Components/Photo/_new/110918-crash-hmed-10a.grid-6x2.jpg](http://msnbcmedia4.msn.com/j/MSNBC/Components/Photo/_new/110918-crash-hmed-10a.grid-6x2.jpg) ---
**Author:** ![Boxersix](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/boxersix/32/6327_2.png) [@Boxersix](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Boxersix)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2011, 12:45pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/new-video-surfaces-of-p51d-crash-reno-this-summer/261864/14 "2011-12-20T12:45:49Z")
Also, FWIW, there is a rather large cavity right below the cockpit tub. I believe it housed some minor electronics but also led to the airfeed for the underbelly engine radiator. Possibly the floor failed and that’s where he ended up? I dunno :dunno ---
**Author:** ![Shady](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/6de8d8/32.png) [@Shady](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Shady)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2011, 1:24pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/new-video-surfaces-of-p51d-crash-reno-this-summer/261864/15 "2011-12-20T13:24:52Z")
The death aside for a second, that looks nothing like a P51 IMO the little differences really ruin the plane for me. I love love love P51 such gorgeous planes ---
**Author:** ![RTrac1](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/rtrac1/32/6312_2.png) [@RTrac1](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/RTrac1)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2011, 1:34pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/new-video-surfaces-of-p51d-crash-reno-this-summer/261864/16 "2011-12-20T13:34:35Z")
man those planes are huge compared to the formula one class my buddy races in ---
**Author:** ![TurboTravis](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/turbotravis/32/6406_2.png) [@TurboTravis](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/TurboTravis)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2011, 3:31pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/new-video-surfaces-of-p51d-crash-reno-this-summer/261864/17 "2011-12-20T15:31:03Z")
As Adam suggested, my educated guess at this point is that there was a structural failure. ---
**Author:** ![Skidplate](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c2a13f/32.png) [@Skidplate](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Skidplate)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2011, 3:48pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/new-video-surfaces-of-p51d-crash-reno-this-summer/261864/18 "2011-12-20T15:48:26Z")
> [@How Kinky are you](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/how-kinky-are-you/47360/24): > > The death aside for a second, that looks nothing like a P51 IMO the little differences really ruin the plane for me. I love love love P51 such gorgeous planes to me it looks like the only obvious mod is the really tiny cockpit bubble. ---
**Author:** ![Boxersix](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/boxersix/32/6327_2.png) [@Boxersix](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Boxersix)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2011, 5:58pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/new-video-surfaces-of-p51d-crash-reno-this-summer/261864/19 "2011-12-20T17:58:03Z")
> [@WTH: oil change/tire rotation in/near southtowns](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/wth-oil-change-tire-rotation-in-near-southtowns/47346/11): > > to me it looks like the only obvious mod is the really tiny cockpit bubble. Most changes you’d never even notice even being a nut about the P51. Lots of changes in the control mechanism, electronics and aviation instrumentation. Many also change the aerofoil profiles(ailerons, elevator, rudder, flaps, etc) to provide more control surface and lift for more radical maneuvering. Some change the canopy section to more modern polycarbonate parts for more visibility. This is all on top of modifications to the Packard engines which already put out in excess of 1600-1700HP.