# no casino for Buffalo..... **URL:** \ **Category:** NYSpeed Off Topic\ **Created:** [July 8, 2008, 12:38pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/no-casino-for-buffalo/51202 "2008-07-08T12:38:24Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![camarojoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/c67d28/32.png) [@camarojoe](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/camarojoe)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2008, 1:06pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/no-casino-for-buffalo/51202/21 "2008-07-08T13:06:24Z")
> [@Dr.Stevil](#): > > the citizens for a better buffalo are a bunch of bone heads. I’m willing to bet probably un-employed and bitch about taxes all while voting the same politicians in over and over again Unfortunately, not. From article: Citizens for a Better Buffalo is led by its president, Diane Bennett, a retired attorney, and includes public officials, religious leaders and community activists. The group is largely funded by the Margaret L. Wendt Foundation. The Baird Foundation and a private donors have also helped fund the lawsuit, which has cost more than $1 million. Because Buffalo has such a draw already, let’s shit on some progress. If you don’t like the casino, you don’t have to go, but any type of construction is good. And being that this is the LARGEST privately funded project in the history of Buffalo, let’s flush it. ---
**Author:** ![Paulo](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/paulo/32/7328_2.png) [@Paulo](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Paulo)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2008, 1:07pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/no-casino-for-buffalo/51202/22 "2008-07-08T13:07:35Z")
> [@BigRon](#): > > They should get the Bills to move downtown then add a casino as well. > Before and after tigers, lions and red wings games they are filled with people who eat at local resturants. > The casino and the surrounding areas keep people in the area longer, spending more money. > > Not like OP where people show up early, eat and drink stuff they brought and leave after the game. That really is an awesome idea. Hell, DT is fucking DEAD on Sundays, so it’s not like you’ll have to worry about traffic… ---
**Author:** ![Nikuk](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/nikuk/32/7254_2.png) [@Nikuk](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Nikuk)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2008, 1:10pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/no-casino-for-buffalo/51202/23 "2008-07-08T13:10:21Z")
> [@Paulo](#): > > That really is an awesome idea. Hell, DT is fucking DEAD on Sundays, so it’s not like you’ll have to worry about traffic… DT is better equipped for the traffic then fucking OP. But with ralph one foot in, I doubt anything of substance will happen there. ---
**Author:** ![JayS](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/jays/32/15375_2.png) [@JayS](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/JayS)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2008, 1:14pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/no-casino-for-buffalo/51202/24 "2008-07-08T13:14:07Z")
> [@Nikuk](#): > > DT is better equipped for the traffic then fucking OP. Really? 18000 people leaving a Sabres game cause about the same amount of fuckup as 80000 people leaving a Bills game. I can’t imagine 80000 people all trying to leave DT at once. Having street lights every block kills a mass traffic exodust DT. ---
**Author:** ![Nikuk](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/nikuk/32/7254_2.png) [@Nikuk](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Nikuk)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2008, 1:15pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/no-casino-for-buffalo/51202/25 "2008-07-08T13:15:09Z")
> [@JayS](#): > > Really? 18000 people leaving a Sabres game cause about the same amount of fuckup as 80000 people leaving a Bills game. I can’t imagine 80000 people all trying to leave DT at once. Having street lights every block kills a mass traffic exodust DT. Taking 20 minutes to leave a sabres game \>\>\> taking \>1hr to leave OP. Then again, when I go to the arena I make use of the MetroRail. No, really. ---
**Author:** ![Joe](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/joe/32/7219_2.png) [@Joe](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Joe)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2008, 1:16pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/no-casino-for-buffalo/51202/26 "2008-07-08T13:16:39Z")
also i heard additional traffic for the casino might shake the grain elevators, and we cant be having that since they’re made of rust. that will be the next lawsuit. ---
**Author:** ![JayS](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/jays/32/15375_2.png) [@JayS](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/JayS)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2008, 1:24pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/no-casino-for-buffalo/51202/27 "2008-07-08T13:24:11Z")
> [@Nikuk](#): > > Taking 20 minutes to leave a sabres game \>\>\> taking \>1hr to leave OP. > > Then again, when I go to the arena I make use of the MetroRail. > > No, really. Been a while since I’ve been to a Bills game. I don’t remember it taking an hour to get home. Still not convinced it wouldn’t be worse with 80k trying to escape DT. I take the truck to sabres games and make sure to park in a lot facing the street. While everyone is backed up at the single lot exit I just drive over the curb to the street. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![OfficerK](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/4da419/32.png) [@OfficerK](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/OfficerK)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2008, 1:25pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/no-casino-for-buffalo/51202/28 "2008-07-08T13:25:26Z")
:word: its pretty rough/slow trying to leave from a Sabres game (heading towards the Northtowns at least). I cannot imagine ~80000 trying the same ---
**Author:** ![MaximaSE98](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/maximase98/32/7600_2.png) [@MaximaSE98](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/MaximaSE98)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2008, 1:29pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/no-casino-for-buffalo/51202/29 "2008-07-08T13:29:24Z")
I love these articles…it doesnt seem to bother the Senecas because 20 min ago they bumped up our design due date for the first phase of the casino ---
**Author:** ![MOBOOST4U](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f4b2a3/32.png) [@MOBOOST4U](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/MOBOOST4U)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2008, 1:29pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/no-casino-for-buffalo/51202/30 "2008-07-08T13:29:58Z")
No way this will stand ---
**Author:** ![dozr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/41988e/32.png) [@dozr](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/dozr)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2008, 1:55pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/no-casino-for-buffalo/51202/31 "2008-07-08T13:55:52Z")
Est 2,000 jobs Est Avg Salary = $34000 $68,000,000 Pumped into economy through new jobs, minus whatever jobs a large percentage of people leave to come work here. Estimated revenues for $12 mos (I feel this is probably conservative) $400,000,000 Estimated payment to City/County (if they can decide who gets it) $7,000,000 max. (single digit percentage of slots ONLY) The casino will NOT pay property tax, bed tax, sales tax, or any local or state taxes. The city of Buffalo has to pay for all of the infrastructure upgrades and maintenance (roads, plowing, salt) as well. By my admittedly shitty calculations… **THIS IS A LOUSY FUCKING DEAL.** And note to those who have no idea how casinos work: They have all amenities inside the casino grounds, hotels, restaurants, shopping, entertainment, gambling, snacks, gift shops, bars, etc. Not to mention parking, lack of clocks or windows. They are designed top to bottom to keep everyone inside spending money. WHY WOULD ANYONE START A BUSINESS NEXT TO A CASINO in a shithole area? Niagara Falls USA still sucks, (Crime is actually on the rise around the casino), most businesses around it failed within 6mos to a year, etc etc. Casinos are a classic last ditch attempt at being the saving grace for cities with poor economies, and guess what - it doesnt work! With that said - I really don’t care what happens, I just can’t believe noone is pissed off about the shitty deal we negotiated. ---
**Author:** ![Fry](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/fry/32/7284_2.png) [@Fry](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Fry)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2008, 1:58pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/no-casino-for-buffalo/51202/32 "2008-07-08T13:58:41Z")
> [@dozr](#): > > Est 2,000 jobs > > Est Avg Salary = $34000 > > $68,000,000 Pumped into economy through new jobs, minus whatever jobs a large percentage of people leave to come work here. > > Estimated revenues for $12 mos (I feel this is probably conservative) $400,000,000 > > Estimated payment to City/County (if they can decide who gets it) $7,000,000 max. (single digit percentage of slots ONLY) > > The casino will NOT pay property tax, bed tax, sales tax, or any local or state taxes. > > The city of Buffalo has to pay for all of the infrastructure upgrades and maintenance (roads, plowing, salt) as well. > > By my admittedly shitty calculations… > > **THIS IS A LOUSY FUCKING DEAL.** > > And note to those who have no idea how casinos work: They have all amenities inside the casino grounds, hotels, restaurants, shopping, entertainment, gambling, snacks, gift shops, bars, etc. Not to mention parking, lack of clocks or windows. They are designed top to bottom to keep everyone inside spending money. > > WHY WOULD ANYONE START A BUSINESS NEXT TO A CASINO in a shithole area? > > Niagara Falls USA still sucks, (Crime is actually on the rise around the casino), most businesses around it failed within 6mos to a year, etc etc. > > Casinos are a classic last ditch attempt at being the saving grace for cities with poor economies, and guess what - it doesnt work! > > With that said - I really don’t care what happens, I just can’t believe noone is pissed off about the shitty deal we negotiated. But, but, but… Look at the booming metropolis’s that have grown up around Turning Stone! And Mohegan Sun! And… Oh, wait. You’re right. ---
**Author:** ![Fry](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/fry/32/7284_2.png) [@Fry](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Fry)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2008, 2:00pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/no-casino-for-buffalo/51202/33 "2008-07-08T14:00:13Z")
> [@JayS](#): > > Really? 18000 people leaving a Sabres game cause about the same amount of fuckup as 80000 people leaving a Bills game. I can’t imagine 80000 people all trying to leave DT at once. Having street lights every block kills a mass traffic exodust DT. Right. Because absolutely no provisions for traffic would be made if a major sports team moved downtown. You might as well argue that the Bills shouldn’t move downtown because football is hard to play on a hockey rink. ---
**Author:** ![BigRon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/58956e/32.png) [@BigRon](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/BigRon)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2008, 2:11pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/no-casino-for-buffalo/51202/34 "2008-07-08T14:11:15Z")
Yeah obliviously city planners would need to figure out the best design, but they built Ford Field and Tigers stadium within the last couple years and they are great venues with tons of night life and restaurants around them. And all they have is a “People Mover” that takes people around in a circle to parking ramps and casinos. Plus reduce the number of tickets from 80k to 70k so you have more sell outs and less black outs. They would need Ralph to sell the team locally and a guaranty to stay in the area for 20 years before they would consider something like that I am sure. ---
**Author:** ![dozr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/41988e/32.png) [@dozr](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/dozr)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2008, 2:11pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/no-casino-for-buffalo/51202/35 "2008-07-08T14:11:43Z")
“Casino gambling is the wrong short term solution for the long term (and complicated) problem of insufficient state and local tax revenues.” They are building here for one reason only, they know they can suck 300+ million dollars out of our economy each year, even after they pay employees and give a little stipend to the local government. ---
**Author:** ![dozr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/41988e/32.png) [@dozr](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/dozr)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2008, 2:13pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/no-casino-for-buffalo/51202/36 "2008-07-08T14:13:01Z")
> [@BigRon](#): > > Yeah obliviously city planners would need to figure out the best design, but they built Ford Field and Tigers stadium within the last couple years and they are great venues with tons of night life and restaurants around them. And all they have is a “People Mover” that takes people around in a circle to parking ramps and casinos. > Plus reduce the number of tickets from 80k to 70k so you have more sell outs and less black outs. > > They would need Ralph to sell the team locally and a guaranty to stay in the area for 20 years before they would consider something like that I am sure. AFAIK the stadium has already been reduced to less than 70k capacity. 50-55k is probably the right number for a city like buffalo. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Russian](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/the_russian/32/7414_2.png) [@The\_Russian](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/The_Russian)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2008, 2:16pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/no-casino-for-buffalo/51202/37 "2008-07-08T14:16:57Z")
Holy logic math overload dozr. God damn and rochester wants to build one too. lawls ---
**Author:** ![Nikuk](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/nikuk/32/7254_2.png) [@Nikuk](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Nikuk)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2008, 3:47pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/no-casino-for-buffalo/51202/38 "2008-07-08T15:47:54Z")
doozer - Your math proof is missing something: cost of infrastructure upgrades & maintenance. ---
**Author:** ![Bigairskier1580](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/bigairskier1580/32/7612_2.png) [@Bigairskier1580](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Bigairskier1580)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2008, 5:09pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/no-casino-for-buffalo/51202/39 "2008-07-08T17:09:13Z")
Football downtown would be far more productive for the city of Buffalo than a casino ever could. Cannot disagree with that. ---
**Author:** ![RedGoober4Life](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/redgoober4life/32/7610_2.png) [@RedGoober4Life](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/RedGoober4Life)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2008, 5:15pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/no-casino-for-buffalo/51202/40 "2008-07-08T17:15:08Z")
> [@BuickGN](#): > > vegas is not poor, vegas is the farthest from poor you can get. > > sure there are some people in there pissing money away, but no way is it considered poor It’s a place where poor people cater to rich people. [Previous page](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/no-casino-for-buffalo/51202.md?page=1) [Next page](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/no-casino-for-buffalo/51202.md?page=3)