# Pens @ PNC Park **URL:** \ **Category:** PittSpeed Off Topic\ **Created:** [June 14, 2009, 9:13pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/pens-pnc-park/202989 "2009-06-14T21:13:47Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![OLDS\_ROCKETMAN](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/olds_rocketman/32/5942_2.png) [@OLDS\_ROCKETMAN](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/OLDS_ROCKETMAN)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2009, 3:42pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/pens-pnc-park/202989/21 "2009-06-17T15:42:24Z")
> [@FYI: National Fuel Rebates](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/fyi-national-fuel-rebates/40499/9): > > we get it. The pirates as an organization make money. They have a nice stadium that is good for the city. > > What you don’t seem to realize is that noone gives a fucks less about a team that is comfortable being losers. They trade away any hope of having a decent team and call it a rebuilding process, that’s a bunch of shit. Management wants their money and knows they can never be competitive with the current situation so they make it up with a dirt cheap roster. That is fine for the people in the pirates organization who are making the money, but it sucks for the fans. Team 2009 payroll New York Yankees $201,449,189 New York Mets $149,373,987 Chicago Cubs $134,809,000 Boston Red Sox $121,745,999 Detroit Tigers $115,085,145 Los Angeles Angels $113,709,00 Philadelphia Phillies $113,004,046 Houston Astros $102,996,414 Los Angeles Dodgers $100,414,592 Seattle Mariners $98,904,166 Atlanta Braves $96,726,166 Chicago White Sox $96,068,500 San Francisco Giants $82,616,450 Cleveland Indians $81,579,166 Toronto Blue Jays $80,538,300 Milwaukee Brewers $80,182,502 St. Louis Cardinals $77,605,109 Colorado Rockies $75,201,000 Cincinnati Reds $73,558,500 Arizona Diamondbacks $73,516,666 Kansas City Royals $70,519,333 Texas Rangers $68,178,798 Baltimore Orioles $67,101,666 Minnesota Twins $65,299,266 Tampa Bay Rays $63,313,034 Oakland Athletics $62,310,000 Washington Nationals $60,328,000 Pittsburgh Pirates $48,693,000 San Diego Padres $43,734,200 Florida Marlins $36,834,000 they are ahead of 7 teams that spend more money than them including cleveland and houston that is over 100 mil. the cubs are only .500 and look how much they spend. ---
**Author:** ![SK360](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/sk360/32/5933_2.png) [@SK360](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/SK360)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2009, 4:15pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/pens-pnc-park/202989/22 "2009-06-17T16:15:14Z")
I’m sure we can all be spared the details and excuses by a team employee. The Pirates have sucked dick since 1992. The only reason people go is for “Something to do” and the special giveaways/concerts/fireworks. The Nutting’s are pretty good at milking money from people and should be run out of town. ---
**Author:** ![PurpleMongoose](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/purplemongoose/32/3349_2.png) [@PurpleMongoose](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/PurpleMongoose)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2009, 9:38pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/pens-pnc-park/202989/23 "2009-06-17T21:38:48Z")
> [@FYI: National Fuel Rebates](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/fyi-national-fuel-rebates/40499/6): > > low priced pirates tickets are part of the deal the pirates made with the city to get the stadium built. I believe they needed the new stadium to be competitive, if I recall correctly. When does that part happen? I also seem to remember the people who’d be paying for it saying no thanks, but it got pushed through, anyway. ---
**Author:** ![OLDS\_ROCKETMAN](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/olds_rocketman/32/5942_2.png) [@OLDS\_ROCKETMAN](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/OLDS_ROCKETMAN)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2009, 10:38am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/pens-pnc-park/202989/24 "2009-06-18T10:38:37Z")
whether the pirates are competitive or not the stadium and the team bring in $$$$… go to the people who work at mullins or firewaters or atrias and tell them that the pirates suck and no one should pay attention to them. i’m sure they feel a lil different. 3 rivers was horrible for baseball and excellent for football but yet rooney pulled the same tricks…even threatened to move the team outside the city… in turn a stadium that absolutely sucks was built… heinz field is fuckin horrible. ---
**Author:** ![SK360](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/sk360/32/5933_2.png) [@SK360](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/SK360)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2009, 11:23am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/pens-pnc-park/202989/25 "2009-06-18T11:23:19Z")
Atleast a team fucking wins at Heinz Field. I could give 2 fucks less how much money the Nutting’s are making off of fucking skyblast night. They have turned this City’s baseball team into the laughing stock of the league for 17 years now. ---
**Author:** ![Darkstar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@Darkstar](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Darkstar)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2009, 11:37am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/pens-pnc-park/202989/26 "2009-06-18T11:37:03Z")
> [@The new fuel economy standards congress passed](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/the-new-fuel-economy-standards-congress-passed/40451/53): > > Atleast a team fucking wins at Heinz Field. > > I could give 2 fucks less how much money the Nutting’s are making off of fucking skyblast night. They have turned this City’s baseball team into the laughing stock of the league for 17 years now. You do realize they just bought the team, right? ---
**Author:** ![OLDS\_ROCKETMAN](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/olds_rocketman/32/5942_2.png) [@OLDS\_ROCKETMAN](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/OLDS_ROCKETMAN)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2009, 11:53am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/pens-pnc-park/202989/27 "2009-06-18T11:53:52Z")
> [@The new fuel economy standards congress passed](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/the-new-fuel-economy-standards-congress-passed/40451/53): > > Atleast a team fucking wins at Heinz Field. > > I could give 2 fucks less how much money the Nutting’s are making off of fucking skyblast night. They have turned this City’s baseball team into the laughing stock of the league for 17 years now. you just dont get it… its two separate things. its how was a baseball stadium more benificial than a football stadium to the citys economy… the other issue is the teams performance. and within that there is the underlying issue of how MLB doesnt have the same rules for a team to succed like football and hockey. you keep ignoring black and white facts that spending more and more money isn;t goin to garentee anything. the cubs, mets and even LA havent won anything in the last 20 years and continue to spend tons of money. It hasnt even worked consistantly for the yankees. The pirates are in a catch 22 right now because previous regimes (way before mclatchy, littlefield, bonifay) left their farm systems baron of any talent. You can sit here and say how much better the pirates would be if they had bay and nady and mcclouth but i remember they were just as bad of not worse when they had them. A lot of things have been out of their control as well… Oliver Perez was untouchable his first year then went in the shitter…you can’t blame the onwer for that stuff. you can;t blame the owner for adam laroche hitting 35 HRs in ATL and then trading for him and hit shits the bed in april may and june… Casey Stengel could rise from the dead and manage the team and it wouldnt mean they would win more games…Forget about 93-08…there isnt shit that can be done about it now…its 09…they are finally starting to make ground on getting too consistancy. you cant get good until you are consistant. the fact they are doing slightly better without bay/mcclouth/nady’s HR’s is a credit to how good the moves actaully were… the pirates are doing it with speed, contact hitting and consistant pitching. That is the model they need to follow. They simply cant outbid the yanks, sox, cubs, mets…etc for the big HR guys. The Pirates under the MLB structure would have to throw all their eggs in one basket and they proved it doesnt work… they’ve went out and signed quality players that have come here and went in the tank and then get blamed for signing washed up bums when it was not the case. They paid kendall big money to make the fans happy and he couldnt get an extra base hit to save his life. They had giles who hit 30+ HRs on a regular basis and LOST with him. > [@How many vacation days do you get/are you carrying over?](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/how-many-vacation-days-do-you-get-are-you-carrying-over/40504/13): > > You do realize they just bought the team, right? to be fair the nuttings didnt just buy they team. they have been the silent majority for atleast 8 years… McClatchy was just the face because he was part owner/CEO. he infact only ever owned 10-15% of the team. he took all the abuse when he really wasnt the man behind the black curtain. his initial investment was 10mil when the team was bought for 90mill in 96. i mean mcclatchy to the pirates was less than mcginleys were to the steelers. there are many entities that have their hand in the pirates. one of which is the pittsburgh associates…there are a lot of people who are part of them. to put things in perspective the pirates playing in a league with the yanks, red sox, etc…is like the corner store going against walmart. I’m not making excuses…i just understand the reasons of why they haven;t done well on a regular basis… I want to see them do well as much if not more than the average fan…it affects me in more ways than just my fan side. I would love to be getting a ring just like the steelers and penguins front office staff. for most of my career here i have been against most of what they did in baseball ops but i still understood the pirates cant compete in the current MLB. the fan in me doesnt want to support losing but i now really do think progress is being made from A to the big leagues and believe their is reason to be positive. ---
**Author:** ![BeastMode](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/beastmode/32/6027_2.png) [@BeastMode](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/BeastMode)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2009, 12:30pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/pens-pnc-park/202989/28 "2009-06-18T12:30:54Z")
> [@Trader feedback: 3sny.](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/trader-feedback-3sny/43396/5): > > you just dont get it… its two separate things. its how was a baseball stadium more benificial than a football stadium to the citys economy… the other issue is the teams performance. and within that there is the underlying issue of how MLB doesnt have the same rules for a team to succed like football and hockey. you keep ignoring black and white facts that spending more and more money isn;t goin to garentee anything. the cubs, mets and even LA havent won anything in the last 20 years and continue to spend tons of money. It hasnt even worked consistantly for the yankees. The pirates are in a catch 22 right now because previous regimes (way before mclatchy, littlefield, bonifay) left their farm systems baron of any talent. You can sit here and say how much better the pirates would be if they had bay and nady and mcclouth but i remember they were just as bad of not worse when they had them. A lot of things have been out of their control as well… Oliver Perez was untouchable his first year then went in the shitter…you can’t blame the onwer for that stuff. you can;t blame the owner for adam laroche hitting 35 HRs in ATL and then trading for him and hit shits the bed in april may and june… Casey Stengel could rise from the dead and manage the team and it wouldnt mean they would win more games…Forget about 93-08…there isnt shit that can be done about it now…its 09…they are finally starting to make ground on getting too consistancy. you cant get good until you are consistant. the fact they are doing slightly better without bay/mcclouth/nady’s HR’s is a credit to how good the moves actaully were… the pirates are doing it with speed, contact hitting and consistant pitching. That is the model they need to follow. They simply cant outbid the yanks, sox, cubs, mets…etc for the big HR guys. The Pirates under the MLB structure would have to throw all their eggs in one basket and they proved it doesnt work… they’ve went out and signed quality players that have come here and went in the tank and then get blamed for signing washed up bums when it was not the case. They paid kendall big money to make the fans happy and he couldnt get an extra base hit to save his life. They had giles who hit 30+ HRs on a regular basis and LOST with him. > > to be fair the nuttings didnt just buy they team. they have been the silent majority for atleast 8 years… McClatchy was just the face because he was part owner/CEO. he infact only ever owned 10-15% of the team. he took all the abuse when he really wasnt the man behind the black curtain. his initial investment was 10mil when the team was bought for 90mill in 96. i mean mcclatchy to the pirates was less than mcginleys were to the steelers. there are many entities that have their hand in the pirates. one of which is the pittsburgh associates…there are a lot of people who are part of them. to put things in perspective the pirates playing in a league with the yanks, red sox, etc…is like the corner store going against walmart. > > I’m not making excuses…i just understand the reasons of why they haven;t done well on a regular basis… I want to see them do well as much if not more than the average fan…it affects me in more ways than just my fan side. I would love to be getting a ring just like the steelers and penguins front office staff. for most of my career here i have been against most of what they did in baseball ops but i still understood the pirates cant compete in the current MLB. the fan in me doesnt want to support losing but i now really do think progress is being made from A to the big leagues and believe their is reason to be positive. good read :bigthumb: too bad Cleveland couldn’t do shit after that 9th inning come back yesterday on the Brewers ☹ ---
**Author:** ![06se-r](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/0/c5a1d2/32.png) [@06se-r](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/06se-r)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2009, 1:33pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/pens-pnc-park/202989/29 "2009-06-18T13:33:01Z")
pgh is long accused of being fairweather fans…but when the weather is stormy and coudy for 16 years, you kinda dont want to even bother. when they were good in the early 90’s, they had a lot of fans. its not about winning a world series, its about at least being semi-decent. forget salary cap issues. money has nothing to do with it., the yankees spend the most every year, they dont win it every year. if the pirates could be like 81-81 for a few seasons, people would have a reason to be excited. when you know 70 wins is a goal, you dont get excited. ---
**Author:** ![OLDS\_ROCKETMAN](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/olds_rocketman/32/5942_2.png) [@OLDS\_ROCKETMAN](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/OLDS_ROCKETMAN)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2009, 1:56pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/pens-pnc-park/202989/30 "2009-06-18T13:56:36Z")
when they were good in the early 90’s they had play off games with like 45k there…3 rivers held over 59 for baseball!!! pittsburgh is fair weather even with the steelers…3 rivers had plenty of empty seats in 98-00. look at pitt hoops…the bandwagon was in full effect this year. when the cubs fans can support the cubs and then havent made a series since 45 pittsburgh has no excuse just because we havent won anything 16 years. its easy to be a fan when ur team wins…a true fan is there no-matter what. ---
**Author:** ![SK360](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/sk360/32/5933_2.png) [@SK360](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/SK360)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2009, 2:46pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/pens-pnc-park/202989/31 "2009-06-18T14:46:15Z")
I used to watch a ton of Baseball games when I was a kid, went to the ball park A LOT to see Andy Van Slyke, Jay Bell, Don Slaught, Bob Walk, Doug Drabek, Barry Bonds, Bobby Bonilla, Jeff King & all the other Early 90’s players. I have no motivation any more when the Ownership and management do not even care about winning as long as they are making bank. Easy for you to sit there and bitch about how us “Bandwagon Fans” won’t support the organization when they are the ones signing your paychecks ---
**Author:** ![Swarzkopf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/7feea3/32.png) [@Swarzkopf](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Swarzkopf)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2009, 2:52pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/pens-pnc-park/202989/32 "2009-06-18T14:52:08Z")
> [@2007 man of the year](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/2007-man-of-the-year/40503/5): > > pgh is long accused of being fairweather fans…but when the weather is stormy and coudy for 16 years, you kinda dont want to even bother. when they were good in the early 90’s, they had a lot of fans. its not about winning a world series, its about at least being semi-decent. forget salary cap issues. money has nothing to do with it., the yankees spend the most every year, they dont win it every year. if the pirates could be like 81-81 for a few seasons, people would have a reason to be excited. when you know 70 wins is a goal, you dont get excited. Exactly! My thoughts were summed up perfectly by this post. ---
**Author:** ![77rednecktruck](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/77rednecktruck/32/5966_2.png) [@77rednecktruck](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/77rednecktruck)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2009, 6:21pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/pens-pnc-park/202989/33 "2009-06-18T18:21:08Z")
> [@Trader feedback: 3sny.](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/trader-feedback-3sny/43396/6): > > I have no motivation any more when the Ownership and management do not even care about winning as long as they are making bank. x9968932890329 the management of the pirates make it pretty well known that they could care less about the fans and if the team is any good. As long as they are making money, they are happy. ---
**Author:** ![OLDS\_ROCKETMAN](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/olds_rocketman/32/5942_2.png) [@OLDS\_ROCKETMAN](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/OLDS_ROCKETMAN)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2009, 10:54am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/pens-pnc-park/202989/34 "2009-06-19T10:54:47Z")
> [@Trader feedback: 3sny.](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/trader-feedback-3sny/43396/6): > > I used to watch a ton of Baseball games when I was a kid, went to the ball park A LOT to see Andy Van Slyke, Jay Bell, Don Slaught, Bob Walk, Doug Drabek, Barry Bonds, Bobby Bonilla, Jeff King & all the other Early 90’s players. > > I have no motivation any more when the Ownership and management do not even care about winning as long as they are making bank. > > Easy for you to sit there and bitch about how us “Bandwagon Fans” won’t support the organization when they are the ones signing your paychecks the core the pirates have now is right on par with where the pirates you listed above were around 87-88. the home runs are less but in every other catagory they are right about even. this team is on its best pace since 99… that not saying a lot but its showing significant improvement from the last 5 years. i would have loved to see the 25-40 yr olds live thorugh the the steelers in the 60’s… i dont think there is a person on this board that wouldnt stick up for the company they work for when it was gonna effect their wallet. interesting stat…in the championship round…pittsburgh teams (pens 1 and pirates 5) are undefeated in game 7\* ( 1903 was a 9 game series and the pirates lost game 7) ---
**Author:** ![Darkstar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@Darkstar](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Darkstar)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2009, 12:35pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/pens-pnc-park/202989/35 "2009-06-19T12:35:57Z")
Pittsburgh needs to rise up and support the Pirates. I don’t care about baseball or the Pirates, but we need to get them at least respectable, so as to keep up the city’s good name. ---
**Author:** ![SK360](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/sk360/32/5933_2.png) [@SK360](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/SK360)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2009, 2:06pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/pens-pnc-park/202989/36 "2009-06-19T14:06:44Z")
> [@Galant VR4 for sale $3500 Queens NY](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/galant-vr4-for-sale-3500-queens-ny/40393/9): > > Pittsburgh needs to rise up and support the Pirates. I don’t care about baseball or the Pirates, but we need to get them at least respectable, so as to keep up the city’s good name. They sell out plenty of Fireworks/Concerts/Yankee’s nights… How about they work on getting better first then maybe they will win their fans back. ---
**Author:** ![OLDS\_ROCKETMAN](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/olds_rocketman/32/5942_2.png) [@OLDS\_ROCKETMAN](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/OLDS_ROCKETMAN)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2009, 10:24am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/pens-pnc-park/202989/37 "2009-06-20T10:24:20Z")
> [@STI Humpers Unite!](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/sti-humpers-unite/38852/16): > > They sell out plenty of Fireworks/Concerts/Yankee’s nights… How about they work on getting better first then maybe they will win their fans back. its a catch 22… ---
**Author:** ![PASunrise06](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/e56c9b/32.png) [@PASunrise06](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/PASunrise06)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2009, 2:58pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/pens-pnc-park/202989/38 "2009-06-21T14:58:42Z")
I still think we should just sell the pirates and buy a basketball team… but just keep the pirate logo “P” so we have nice hats… ---
**Author:** ![bgblockelcamino](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/bgblockelcamino/32/5997_2.png) [@bgblockelcamino](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/bgblockelcamino)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2009, 3:41pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/pens-pnc-park/202989/39 "2009-06-21T15:41:43Z")
basketball sucks. much rather watch pirates than basketball. don’t think pittsburgh would support another fall/winter sports when you have penguins and steelers overlapping. ---
**Author:** ![jph102900](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/jph102900/32/6049_2.png) [@jph102900](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/jph102900)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2009, 8:45am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/pens-pnc-park/202989/40 "2009-06-23T08:45:11Z")
![http://www.pittspeed.com/uploaded/champspens.jpg](http://www.pittspeed.com/uploaded/champspens.jpg) [Previous page](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/pens-pnc-park/202989.md?page=1) [Next page](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/pens-pnc-park/202989.md?page=3)