# Physics Question: Will the plane take off? (27 page debate on elisetalk)
**URL:** https://forums.speedlife.net/t/physics-question-will-the-plane-take-off-27-page-debate-on-elisetalk/8189
**Category:** NYSpeed Off Topic
**Created:** [February 15, 2006, 7:40am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/physics-question-will-the-plane-take-off-27-page-debate-on-elisetalk/8189 "2006-02-15T07:40:29Z")
**Posts on this page:** 20
**Page:** 3
### Author:  [@66impalass](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/66impalass)
#### Post date: [February 15, 2006, 8:34am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/physics-question-will-the-plane-take-off-27-page-debate-on-elisetalk/8189/41 "2006-02-15T08:34:44Z")
> [@JaysGreenLX](#):
>
> It will not take off.
>
> I didn’t read the whole thing because I am sure its filled with…whatever…but the plane won’t have any air moving over its wings to help provide lift. The engines simply provide thrust which moves the air over the wings fast enough to facilitate lift. Since the plane isn’t moving through the air, no lift.
:bangshead:
> [@66impalass\`](#):
>
> thats the thing it will move, if there is thrust acting on the air behind the plane, the is a resultant force pushing the place foward. The treamill has nothing to do with it. the tradmill is basically there to give a normal force so the plane would not fall. put a skatebord on a treadmill, now hold it in place, no movement, now put a force against the top of the bored, the bored its self will move foward, same concept.
>
> Fluids\>you
people need to learn to read, jesus
---
### Author:  [@Pass\_McGass](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Pass_McGass)
#### Post date: [February 15, 2006, 8:37am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/physics-question-will-the-plane-take-off-27-page-debate-on-elisetalk/8189/42 "2006-02-15T08:37:00Z")
I hope this Mass Debate gets heated. Oh man, a heated mass-debation.
---
### Author:  [@Fetter](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Fetter)
#### Post date: [February 15, 2006, 8:38am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/physics-question-will-the-plane-take-off-27-page-debate-on-elisetalk/8189/43 "2006-02-15T08:38:07Z")
> [@Pass McGrass](#):
>
> I hope this Mass Debate gets heated. Oh man, a heated mass-debation.
:lol:
_EDIT_ Can someone make this into a yes or no poll?
---
### Author:  [@Juan](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Juan)
#### Post date: [February 15, 2006, 8:40am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/physics-question-will-the-plane-take-off-27-page-debate-on-elisetalk/8189/44 "2006-02-15T08:40:35Z")
**NO**
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### Author:  [@Ovrwrkd](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Ovrwrkd)
#### Post date: [February 15, 2006, 8:41am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/physics-question-will-the-plane-take-off-27-page-debate-on-elisetalk/8189/45 "2006-02-15T08:41:28Z")
I think I’ll resign from the internet for the day :ham:
I fell into the conveyer belt trap :bloated: The thrust generated by the engines is acting upon the air behind the plane, not the ground on which the wheels rest. The wheels are simply a means to reduce friction and allow the plane take off with less thrust. Although a factor in the overall equation, a very small one.
Man could I go for a drink right now 🍺
> [@Fetter](#):
>
> :lol:
>
> _EDIT_ Can someone make this into a yes or no poll?
and uh… done!
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### Author:  [@JaysGreenLX](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/JaysGreenLX)
#### Post date: [February 15, 2006, 8:42am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/physics-question-will-the-plane-take-off-27-page-debate-on-elisetalk/8189/46 "2006-02-15T08:42:05Z")
> [@66impalass\`](#):
>
> :bangshead:
>
> people need to learn to read, jesus
Didn’t I just say I didn’t read the other shit. I don’t agree with your theory or your spelling of BOARD at all.
---
### Author:  [@JUICEDSS](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/JUICEDSS)
#### Post date: [February 15, 2006, 8:42am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/physics-question-will-the-plane-take-off-27-page-debate-on-elisetalk/8189/47 "2006-02-15T08:42:14Z")
If the conveyor matches the wheel speed, then the plane will never move forward which is required to create the lift to get the plane off the ground.
No forward motion, no lift, no trip to Hawaii…
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### Author:  [@Fetter](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Fetter)
#### Post date: [February 15, 2006, 8:44am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/physics-question-will-the-plane-take-off-27-page-debate-on-elisetalk/8189/48 "2006-02-15T08:44:56Z")
Thrust \> You
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### Author:  [@Pass\_McGass](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Pass_McGass)
#### Post date: [February 15, 2006, 8:45am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/physics-question-will-the-plane-take-off-27-page-debate-on-elisetalk/8189/49 "2006-02-15T08:45:08Z")
Ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!
---
### Author:  [@STEALTTH](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/STEALTTH)
#### Post date: [February 15, 2006, 8:49am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/physics-question-will-the-plane-take-off-27-page-debate-on-elisetalk/8189/50 "2006-02-15T08:49:09Z")
> [@JaysGreenLX](#):
>
> It will not take off.
>
> I didn’t read the whole thing because I am sure its filled with…whatever…but the plane won’t have any air moving over its wings to help provide lift. The engines simply provide thrust which moves the air over the wings fast enough to facilitate lift. Since the plane isn’t moving through the air, no lift.
haha, but the plane is STILL MOVING…through the air…
if the plane needs to take off at 300MPH…and the plane is going 300MPH on a conveyer going 300MPH with its engines on, you don’t think it would take off if the pilot pulled back on the controls and seperated the plane from the runway?
---
### Author:  [@Fetter](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Fetter)
#### Post date: [February 15, 2006, 8:51am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/physics-question-will-the-plane-take-off-27-page-debate-on-elisetalk/8189/51 "2006-02-15T08:51:46Z")
not if it isn’t moving… which it would.
Now we are “argueing” about it here at work… lol.
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### Author:  [@newman](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/newman)
#### Post date: [February 15, 2006, 8:52am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/physics-question-will-the-plane-take-off-27-page-debate-on-elisetalk/8189/52 "2006-02-15T08:52:00Z")
lol.
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### Author:  [@Blue\_Eyed\_Devil](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Blue_Eyed_Devil)
#### Post date: [February 15, 2006, 8:53am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/physics-question-will-the-plane-take-off-27-page-debate-on-elisetalk/8189/53 "2006-02-15T08:53:21Z")
> [@AWDrifter](#):
>
> The conveyor belt is an irrelavent part of the equation.
> It is mentioned just to confuse you.
>
> The jet engines are pushing the mass of the plane forward.
> The jet engines don’t give a rat’s ass about the wheels or what they are doing.
READ THIS
---
### Author:  [@STEALTTH](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/STEALTTH)
#### Post date: [February 15, 2006, 8:53am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/physics-question-will-the-plane-take-off-27-page-debate-on-elisetalk/8189/54 "2006-02-15T08:53:31Z")
:word:
but :lol:at this thread
---
### Author:  [@JaysGreenLX](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/JaysGreenLX)
#### Post date: [February 15, 2006, 8:55am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/physics-question-will-the-plane-take-off-27-page-debate-on-elisetalk/8189/55 "2006-02-15T08:55:17Z")
> [@STEALTTH](#):
>
> haha, but the plane is STILL MOVING…through the air…
>
> if the plane needs to take off at 300MPH…and the plane is going 300MPH on a conveyer going 300MPH with its engines on, you don’t think it would take off if the pilot pulled back on the controls and seperated the plane from the runway?
The plane isn’t moving though the air. The air is moving through the turbine, some of the surrounding air may be passing over the wings, but not all of it is going 300mph or over the whole surface of the wing.
---
### Author:  [@JUICEDSS](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/JUICEDSS)
#### Post date: [February 15, 2006, 8:56am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/physics-question-will-the-plane-take-off-27-page-debate-on-elisetalk/8189/56 "2006-02-15T08:56:27Z")
Someone mentioned a guy on roller skates and a treadmill and a push. Yes, the guy moves forward because the treadmill did not **match** his speed.
That is the part that everyone overlooks. Yes, the plane is using its thrust against the air behind it but if the conveyor is capable of matching the wheel speed which indicates the plane’s forward motion, it should not move, it needs to go forward in relation to the ground or it will not fly.
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### Author:  [@nitroinsane](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/nitroinsane)
#### Post date: [February 15, 2006, 8:56am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/physics-question-will-the-plane-take-off-27-page-debate-on-elisetalk/8189/57 "2006-02-15T08:56:34Z")
13 people viewing page 54 here we come
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### Author:  [@Deuce](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Deuce)
#### Post date: [February 15, 2006, 8:56am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/physics-question-will-the-plane-take-off-27-page-debate-on-elisetalk/8189/58 "2006-02-15T08:56:42Z")
Im a little late to this thread but here is my opinion, and i also fix jet engines…
i dont think it will take off, because the plane isnt actually moving against the air, it needs the air to pass under/over its wings to generate enough lift to take off. the wheels will be moving fast enough at but there wont be enough air to create the lift. The point that determines when an aircraft takes off isnt speed, but rather how much lift.
back in the ol’ days with aircraft carriers and piston powered airplanes (ex, ww2) the aircraft carrier would ALWAYS turn INTO the wind before launching the aircraft to allow more air to travel under the airplanes wings giving it more lift. (so the wind is blowing directly towards the aircraft as it takes off)
if the aircraft is on a “treadmill” going 150mph and there is a 150mph headwind flying into the aircraft then yes, it could take off.
the aircraft receives its forward thrust from the engines, this is somewhat irrelevant but there are numerous things which go into calculating “take off rated thrust” for that specific aircraft on that take off. things that will effect the throttle settings for take off are, air temperature, air pressure, cargo load/weight, wind speed/direction etc…
if an aircraft was on a giant treadmill it would NOT take off. it would just sit there and its wheels would spin really fast and it wouldnt go anywhere. it will not take off unless there is airflow to provide lift
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### Author:  [@Pass\_McGass](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Pass_McGass)
#### Post date: [February 15, 2006, 9:00am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/physics-question-will-the-plane-take-off-27-page-debate-on-elisetalk/8189/59 "2006-02-15T09:00:04Z")
Say you put the plane on a non moving conveyor. Then turn it on. The plane (in theory) should just sit in one spot with the wheels moving. Now turn on the planes engines and put them at full speed. How is it NOT going to move forward?
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### Author:  [@JaysGreenLX](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/JaysGreenLX)
#### Post date: [February 15, 2006, 9:01am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/physics-question-will-the-plane-take-off-27-page-debate-on-elisetalk/8189/60 "2006-02-15T09:01:41Z")
> [@Pass McGrass](#):
>
> Say you put the plane on a non moving conveyor. Then turn it on. The plane (in theory) should just sit in one spot with the wheels moving. Now turn on the planes engines and put them at full speed. How is it NOT going to move forward?
It wouldn’t. The plane would move backwards on the conveyor. Once the engines were turned on and matched to the speed of the conveyor it would sit in one spot.
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