# Planning to buy a brand new cross-over SUV... **URL:** \ **Category:** NYSpeed Automotive\ **Created:** [November 9, 2008, 9:19pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/planning-to-buy-a-brand-new-cross-over-suv/57872 "2008-11-09T21:19:07Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 17\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![slasky](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/slasky/32/7408_2.png) [@slasky](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/slasky)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2008, 12:53pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/planning-to-buy-a-brand-new-cross-over-suv/57872/61 "2008-11-11T12:53:37Z")
> [@\_Karu\_](#): > > wait… What? > > AWD == 4WD ? > > AWD != 4WD ? > > Clarify, please. > 4WD = Low range and High Range gearing > AWD = Only high range gearing > **Part-time 4WD:** No centre differential. Cannot be used on dry/wet, semi-slippery roads due to the lack of the centre differential. When activated, both front and rear axles are physically locked to each other and have to spin at the same rate. This becomes a problem when turning on sufficiently high friction surfaces. Examples: Suzuki SUVs, most 4WD pickup trucks, cheaper SUVs. > **Permanent 4WD:**. No two wheel drive mode. System is equipped with a centre differential, and hence is safe to use on all surfaces. All four wheels are powered all of the time (usually 50/50 front and rear axles). This is arguably the best system since the torque split ratio does not change and is the most predictable. All wheels “help out” all of the time and this stabilises the vehicle + improves handling. With the extra two drive wheels, the vehicle has twice the amount of traction all of the time (even in no-slip conditions) vs. a 2WD vehicle. Examples: MB M-class SUV, the Range/Land Rovers. > **Full-time 4WD:** Basically permanent 4WD but with a 2WD mode. This was born out of customer demand (for a 2WD mode). Examples: Toyota Sequoia, Mitsubishi Montero. > **Permanent AWD:** Basically permanent 4WD but without low range gearing. Examples include the Audi Quattro AWD system, the MB’s 4-matic AWD system, Subaru’s manual transmission AWD system. > **Full-time AWD:** System is active at all times, however in most cases, the one set of wheels (usually the rears) only receive 5-10% of the engine’s power unless slippage occurs. At that point, power is progressively transfered to the opposite axle to help out. Some systems can transfer power to the rear upon acceleration to improve traction. However, they revert to 2WD mode when coasting. > [@\_Karu\_](#): > > How about resale value? I am not sure. You could always look up an older model on KBB and compare the awd with the fwd. ---
**Author:** ![Fry](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/fry/32/7284_2.png) [@Fry](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Fry)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2008, 12:54pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/planning-to-buy-a-brand-new-cross-over-suv/57872/62 "2008-11-11T12:54:28Z")
AWD != 4WD 4 wheel drive systems bind on dry pavement when you’re, say, turning in a parking lot. The wheels all have to rotate at the same speed. AWD is definitely better handling, but 4WD you can turn off to save a little gas for 99.9% of your driving. My Xterra is 4WD. Turning it on definitely makes it handle more predictably in the snow, even though AWD would be even better. But as Slasky said, even 2WD is fine. The most important thing is not being a retard. ---
**Author:** ![Daddie](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/daddie/32/7621_2.png) [@Daddie](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Daddie)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2008, 1:42pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/planning-to-buy-a-brand-new-cross-over-suv/57872/63 "2008-11-11T13:42:31Z")
Just wondering, have you ever considered a Wagon of some sort? Out of those that you listed, I’ve test drove all of them. The RAV4 is sick nasty in v6 form. That being said - the Outlander I actually enjoyed the most. Reliability - I don’t know, but they whore the v6 motor out in everything, as the 4 cyl, and I haven’t heard too many issues… If I was to buy, probably would go with the RAV4 ---
**Author:** ![slasky](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/slasky/32/7408_2.png) [@slasky](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/slasky)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2008, 1:47pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/planning-to-buy-a-brand-new-cross-over-suv/57872/64 "2008-11-11T13:47:23Z")
> [@\_Karu\_](#): > > How about resale value? I looked up a 2005 crv on KBB. The 2wd was worth $900 less than the AWD. I think the AWD option costs more than $900 when you buy it. ---
**Author:** ![Beck](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/beck/32/28683_2.png) [@Beck](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Beck)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2008, 4:09pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/planning-to-buy-a-brand-new-cross-over-suv/57872/65 "2008-11-11T16:09:17Z")
> [@slasky](#): > > I looked up a 2005 crv on KBB. The 2wd was worth $900 less than the AWD. I think the AWD option costs more than $900 when you buy it. KBB is a “guide”. They aren’t actually writing the checks. If you went to a dealership, they’d offer you atleast $1500-$2000 less. ---
**Author:** ![slasky](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/slasky/32/7408_2.png) [@slasky](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/slasky)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2008, 6:07pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/planning-to-buy-a-brand-new-cross-over-suv/57872/66 "2008-11-11T18:07:11Z")
> [@Beck](#): > > KBB is a “guide”. They aren’t actually writing the checks. > > If you went to a dealership, they’d offer you atleast $1500-$2000 less. The AWD option is $1200 so it is not that big of a loss. I would not get it just because I was concerned about resale value. ---
**Author:** ![\_Karu](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/_karu/32/7602_2.png) [@\_Karu](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/_Karu)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2008, 7:24pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/planning-to-buy-a-brand-new-cross-over-suv/57872/67 "2008-11-11T19:24:43Z")
Thanks again for all your inputs. Yeah, I got the idea now, 4WD != AWD. And yes, both RAV4 and CRV are 4WD. Watching this [http://automobiles.honda.com/cr-v/features.aspx?feature=4wd](http://automobiles.honda.com/cr-v/features.aspx?feature=4wd) I got a pretty good understanding on CRV’s 4WD… > [@Honda's Website](#): > > Best of all, Real Time 4WD requires little **maintenance** , and in 2007, this 4WD system was further improved for better performance on adverse road conditions. What kind of maintenance are we talking about here? Is Buffalo’s road “salt n’ pepper” will greatly affect the 4WD components? I read a very brief explanation on RAV4’s 4WD over here: [http://www.toyota.com/vehicles/minisite/rav4/experience/index.html](http://www.toyota.com/vehicles/minisite/rav4/experience/index.html). From what I understand, I have to enable the 4WD when I want to use it. On contrast, I can’t do that with CRV. So, which is the better one? ---
**Author:** ![Jim1234664](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/jim1234664/32/7438_2.png) [@Jim1234664](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Jim1234664)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2008, 8:01pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/planning-to-buy-a-brand-new-cross-over-suv/57872/68 "2008-11-11T20:01:24Z")
it seems to me if you want real awd full time with no driver intervention the forrester is the only choice, you do give up some fuel economy though ---
**Author:** ![RedGoober4Life](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/redgoober4life/32/7610_2.png) [@RedGoober4Life](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/RedGoober4Life)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2008, 8:01pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/planning-to-buy-a-brand-new-cross-over-suv/57872/69 "2008-11-11T20:01:47Z")
Subaru’s. ---
**Author:** ![\_Karu](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/_karu/32/7602_2.png) [@\_Karu](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/_Karu)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2008, 8:44pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/planning-to-buy-a-brand-new-cross-over-suv/57872/70 "2008-11-11T20:44:51Z")
Ladies and gentlemen, please start discussion on Subaru Forester. I’ve been reading about it and getting some \<3 out of it. Please discuss. Subaru XT 2.5X Premium looks good to me. Anybody have any idea on Subaru’s incentives? Discount? Rebate? 0%? ---
**Author:** ![Jim1234664](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/jim1234664/32/7438_2.png) [@Jim1234664](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Jim1234664)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2008, 8:56pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/planning-to-buy-a-brand-new-cross-over-suv/57872/71 "2008-11-11T20:56:47Z")
Not quite sure about the brand new models but there are a TON of subarus running around with 200+k with completely stock and original drive lines, that says something (if you are looking to keep it a long time) ---
**Author:** ![\_Karu](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/_karu/32/7602_2.png) [@\_Karu](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/_Karu)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2008, 9:08pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/planning-to-buy-a-brand-new-cross-over-suv/57872/72 "2008-11-11T21:08:40Z")
Anybody in NYSpeed working for Subaru dealer? lol. ---
**Author:** ![vt1992s10](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/73ab20/32.png) [@vt1992s10](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/vt1992s10)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2008, 9:19pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/planning-to-buy-a-brand-new-cross-over-suv/57872/73 "2008-11-11T21:19:21Z")
> [@Jim1234664](#): > > Not quite sure about the brand new models but there are a TON of subarus running around with 200+k with completely stock and original drive lines, that says something (if you are looking to keep it a long time) My Legacy 🙂 205,000 selling it because I want something different still has a lot of life left ---
**Author:** ![Jim1234664](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/jim1234664/32/7438_2.png) [@Jim1234664](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Jim1234664)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2008, 9:21pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/planning-to-buy-a-brand-new-cross-over-suv/57872/74 "2008-11-11T21:21:15Z")
> [@\_Karu\_](#): > > Anybody in NYSpeed working for Subaru dealer? lol. SI01 > [@vt1992s10](#): > > My Legacy 🙂 205,000 selling it because I want something different still has a lot of life left ride on brother, 204,000 here ---
**Author:** ![jetlounge](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/jetlounge/32/4994_2.png) [@jetlounge](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/jetlounge)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2008, 10:43am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/planning-to-buy-a-brand-new-cross-over-suv/57872/75 "2008-11-12T10:43:19Z")
I had a fully loaded Murano SE that was turned in a few months ago…end of lease. I looked at buying the next SUV AWD, tired with driving someone elses car…looked at CR-V, RAV4, Rogue. Touched and drove 'em all. Months prior I actually had a Ford Escape Hybrid AWD fully loaded on order. Ford so royally pissed me off the last couple of months I told them to shove it, and gas was going down anyway. Hybrid was still MSRP, but you can buy any other SUV (any make) for dealer invoice now. That differential pays for a lot of gas. Anywho: Went with the CR-V. For all of the goodies I had in the Murano (leather, in-dash nav, rear view camera, heated seats)…only the CR-V came with that installed. The Rogue doesn’t even have nav…they sell that crappy mini unit that sits on the dash. Other than that…I found the CVT to be ok, sometimes slow on accelleration. I miss the inteligent memory key though. Small problems with Nissan…throttlebody shot and fixed under warranty. Seats failed and broke a support rail 2 months prior to lease end. Since air bags included, no chance for recycled parts. Expensive. Also, MPG on the Murano started at 21, gradually went to 17. Other than the installed goodies being standard on the CR-V: The other thing the CR-V has over the RAV4…CR-V is a 5 speed auto. RAV4 still uses a 4 speed. Makes no sense. Resale value will be the same. ---
**Author:** ![\_Karu](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/_karu/32/7602_2.png) [@\_Karu](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/_Karu)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2008, 10:48am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/planning-to-buy-a-brand-new-cross-over-suv/57872/76 "2008-11-12T10:48:04Z")
^Thanks for your input. MotorTrend was talking something about CRV’s 5-speed auto. Apparently, you can’t manually shift like RAV4… Also something about the ability to manully shift to 3 but not 4. Any comments on that? ---
**Author:** ![jetlounge](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/jetlounge/32/4994_2.png) [@jetlounge](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/jetlounge)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2008, 10:55am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/planning-to-buy-a-brand-new-cross-over-suv/57872/77 "2008-11-12T10:55:20Z")
^ Doesn’t matter to me. I never manually shift on an automatic. At best, I coast in neutral sometimes to play the gas saving game…But that gets tired real fast. [Previous page](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/planning-to-buy-a-brand-new-cross-over-suv/57872.md?page=3)