# Ron Paul 2nd in Nevada Caucus right now! **URL:** \ **Category:** PittSpeed Off Topic\ **Created:** [January 19, 2008, 1:47pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/ron-paul-2nd-in-nevada-caucus-right-now/194911 "2008-01-19T13:47:28Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 10\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![JackdUp](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/jackdup/32/6015_2.png) [@JackdUp](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/JackdUp)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2008, 1:50pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/ron-paul-2nd-in-nevada-caucus-right-now/194911/41 "2008-01-24T13:50:16Z")
Cliffs: They don’t want you growing your own (medical or otherwise) maryjane, but they’ll gladly regulate, tax and force you to use their own watered down version of Kindbud grown in a cave in Mississippi. ---
**Author:** ![beat90tsi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/43a26b/32.png) [@beat90tsi](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/beat90tsi)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2008, 2:03pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/ron-paul-2nd-in-nevada-caucus-right-now/194911/42 "2008-01-24T14:03:21Z")
> [@The Bimmer is donezo, and I want to cry. (Pics PG. 5)](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/the-bimmer-is-donezo-and-i-want-to-cry-pics-pg-5/34544/29): > > Who said anything about communism. Don’t jump the gun. All I said, is that the rich (which is roughly 1% of the USA) have been obtaining tax brakes and incentives while Bush is/was president. Ok…learn how taxes work, and who foots the bill…ok? > “Suppose that every day 10 men go to a restaurant for dinner. The bill for all ten comes to $100. If it was paid the way we pay our taxes, the first four men would pay nothing; the fifth would pay $1; the sixth would pay $3; the seventh $7; the eighth $12; the ninth $18. The tenth man (the richest) would pay $59.” > The 10 men ate dinner in the restaurant every day and seemed quite happy with the arrangement until the owner threw them a curve. “Since you are all such good customers,” he said, “I’m going to reduce the cost of your daily meal by $20.” Now dinner for the 10 only costs $80. The first four are unaffected. They still eat for free. Can you figure out how to divvy up the $20 savings among the remaining six so that everyone gets his fair share? The men realize that $20 divided by 6 is $3.33, but if they subtract that from everybody’s share, then the fifth man and the sixth man would end up being paid to eat their meal. > The restaurant owner suggested that it would be fair to reduce each man’s bill by roughly the same percentage, being sure to give each a break, and he proceeded to work out the amounts each should pay. And so now the fifth man paid nothing, the sixth pitched in $2, the seventh paid $5, the eighth paid $9, the ninth paid $12, leaving the tenth man with a bill of $52 instead of $59. > Outside the restaurant, the men began to compare their savings. “I only got a dollar out of the $20,” complained the sixth man, pointing to the tenth, “and he got $7!” > “Yeah, that’s right,” exclaimed the fifth man. “I only saved a dollar, too. It’s unfair that he got seven times more than me!” > “That’s true,” shouted the seventh man. “Why should he get $7 back when I got only $2? The wealthy get all the breaks!” > “Wait a minute,” yelled the first four men in unison. “We didn’t get anything at all. The system exploits the poor.” > Then, the nine men surrounded the tenth man (the richest one, paying the most) and beat him up. The next night the richest man didn’t show up for dinner, so now the nine men sat down and ate without him. But when it came time to pay the bill, they discovered something important. They were $52 short! > “And that, boys, girls and college instructors, is how America’s tax system works. The people who pay the highest taxes get the most benefit from a tax reduction. Tax them too much, attack them for being wealthy, and they just may not show up at the table any more. There are lots of good restaurants in Switzerland and the Caribbean.” That’s why they save more, stop bitching. > [@The Bimmer is donezo, and I want to cry. (Pics PG. 5)](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/the-bimmer-is-donezo-and-i-want-to-cry-pics-pg-5/34544/29): > > according to this interpretation the 10th Amendment source? > [@The Bimmer is donezo, and I want to cry. (Pics PG. 5)](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/the-bimmer-is-donezo-and-i-want-to-cry-pics-pg-5/34544/29): > > We might be heading back to the day when you had to pay for all these services outside of taxation. At the turn of the last century, for instance, fire depts. would let your house burn down if you hadn’t paid them first to put our fires! I welcome the day, I like to pay my own way, and I’m sick of the freeloading losers who I pay for every freaking paycheck…next question… > [@The Bimmer is donezo, and I want to cry. (Pics PG. 5)](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/the-bimmer-is-donezo-and-i-want-to-cry-pics-pg-5/34544/29): > > Ron Paul has such a voting record above because he does not believe in the social contract of our Founding Fathers. Please show me where the founding fathers promoted a “social contract.” I seem to remember something quite different. > [@The Bimmer is donezo, and I want to cry. (Pics PG. 5)](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/the-bimmer-is-donezo-and-i-want-to-cry-pics-pg-5/34544/29): > > It’s almost like saying, how so many good Germans do today, that Hitler was good because he gave people jobs and eliminated crime by getting rid of “bad elements”. That’s EXACTLY what you support with Hilary’s plan. To create jobs by spending tax dollars, and tear down the “evil rich people” who don’t pay their “fair share.” > [@The Bimmer is donezo, and I want to cry. (Pics PG. 5)](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/the-bimmer-is-donezo-and-i-want-to-cry-pics-pg-5/34544/29): > > One thing I have learned from history is that you shouldn’t solve short-term problems by using something or someone who is going to cause bigger problems down the road. Too many Americans have become disenfranchised since the days when Roosevelt tried to give enfeebled Americans a voice and some basic stability from which to launch their version of the American dream. Federal taxing and spending has been screwing this country since FDR, and it’s not going to stop anytime soon with any of the “front runners.” You need to read “1984” hoss. Having government control all medicine will be the end of this nation. ---
**Author:** ![kilmer420](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/d6d6ee/32.png) [@kilmer420](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/kilmer420)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2008, 2:24pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/ron-paul-2nd-in-nevada-caucus-right-now/194911/43 "2008-01-24T14:24:36Z")
> [@beat90tsi"](#): > > Ok…learn how taxes work, and who foots the bill…ok? > > **I do know how taxes work, you are jumping subjects.** > > source? > > **Wikipedia or any other place that talks about the 10th Amendment** > > I welcome the day, I like to pay my own way, and I’m sick of the freeloading losers who I pay for every freaking paycheck…next question… > > **Well, that’s your opinion and everyone is entitled to it. I guess you don’t have family members that might not be living as well as you?** > > Please show me where the founding fathers promoted a “social contract.” I seem to remember something quite different. > > **[Social contract - Wikipedia](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_contract)** > > > > **BTW WIKI isn’t full of ish, before you go and start discrediting it for no reason!** > > That’s EXACTLY what you support with Hilary’s plan. To create jobs by spending tax dollars, and tear down the “evil rich people” who don’t pay their “fair share.” > > **No, go re-read. All I said is that it serves a dual purpose** > > Federal taxing and spending has been screwing this country since FDR, and it’s not going to stop anytime soon with any of the “front runners.” > > **I agree that we need to be more fiscally responsible no matter what party. Unfortunately, the government is set up so. I know you think that R. Paul has “ALL THE ANSWERS” to your prayers, but think long term.** > > You need to read “1984” hoss. Having government control all medicine will be the end of this nation. > > **It should continue to be a mix of both private and federal as it is now. There should be other regulatory practices involved. Actually, Dr. Paul is perfect for this job as his background is in medicine and he is fiscally responsible it seems. I’ve read 1984, yes big brother is always watching, that’s nothing new! The Patriot Act just made it public.** ---
**Author:** ![kilmer420](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/d6d6ee/32.png) [@kilmer420](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/kilmer420)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2008, 7:27pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/ron-paul-2nd-in-nevada-caucus-right-now/194911/44 "2008-01-24T19:27:12Z")
![http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a61/downshiftartist/avatars/1201166158661.gif](http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a61/downshiftartist/avatars/1201166158661.gif) ---
**Author:** ![beat90tsi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/43a26b/32.png) [@beat90tsi](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/beat90tsi)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2008, 6:31am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/ron-paul-2nd-in-nevada-caucus-right-now/194911/45 "2008-01-25T06:31:35Z")
> [@The Bimmer is donezo, and I want to cry. (Pics PG. 5)](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/the-bimmer-is-donezo-and-i-want-to-cry-pics-pg-5/34544/40): > > ![http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a61/downshiftartist/avatars/1201166158661.gif](https://canada1.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/uploads/speedlife/original/3X/f/c/fc377eadac29a035ffa08407ab8c1a2db744d3ad.gif) Did you even read your social contract Wiki page? First, there’s no mention of the American founders. Second…this is how it starts. > The term social contract describes a broad class of philosophical theories whose subjects are the implied agreements by which people form nations and maintain a social order. In laymen’s terms, this means that the people give up some rights to a government in order to receive social order. THEORIES…that require people to give up rights. Ben Franklin warned against exactly that. You’re on crack if you think the founders intended anything of the sort. They knew that Liberty was the solution. > A free people [claim] their rights as derived from the laws of nature, and not as the gift of their chief magistrate. > Thomas Jefferson, Rights of British America, 1774 > They that can give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety. > Benjamin Franklin, Historical Review of Pennsylvania, 1759 > I consider the foundation of the Constitution as laid on this ground that ‘all powers not delegated to the United States, by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the states, are reserved to the states or to the people.’ To take a single step beyond the boundaries thus specially drawn around the powers of Congress, is to take possession of a boundless field of power, not longer susceptible of any definition. > Thomas Jefferson How do you like the 10th amendment now Kilmer? Take it from a founder, not some modern interpreter. Social contract? > I think we have more machinery of government than is necessary, too many parasites living on the labor of the industrious. > Thomas Jefferson, letter to William Ludlow, September 6, 1824 > I would rather be exposed to the inconveniencies attending too much liberty than those attending too small a degree of it. > Thomas Jefferson, letter to Archibald Stewart, Dec 23, 1791 There are many more, but I have to get to work. -Social contract -Implied powers (of Congress) and plenty of other BS has been invented and inserted into our educational system by people who disagree with the founders views of absolute liberty. That’s why they brainwash people like you and I with it. ---
**Author:** ![kilmer420](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/d6d6ee/32.png) [@kilmer420](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/kilmer420)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2008, 9:09am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/ron-paul-2nd-in-nevada-caucus-right-now/194911/46 "2008-01-25T09:09:19Z")
> [@FS: Everything Laying Around My House CHEAP!!!!\[Gameroom/Home/Auto\] \*\*56k upgrade now](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/fs-everything-laying-around-my-house-cheap-gameroom-home-auto-56k-upgrade-now/34434/22): > > Did you even read your social contract Wiki page? > First, there’s no mention of the American founders. Second…this is how it starts. > > **Yes, I did read it. I think you missed this part: “John Locke’s writings on the Social Contract were particularly influential among the American Founding Fathers.”** > > THEORIES…that require people to give up rights. Ben Franklin warned against exactly that. You’re on crack if you think the founders intended anything of the sort. They knew that Liberty was the solution. > > **Uhm, that’s part of liberty, read up on it 😉 You always give up rights when government is involved. I now see your true libertarian colors showing. It’s funny how you think you don’t need government! It’s helped you much more then you probably consciously know.** > > How do you like the 10th amendment now Kilmer? Take it from a founder, not some modern interpreter. > > **The 10th Amendment is just fine, I don’t see your point!** > > There are many more, but I have to get to work. > > -Social contract > -Implied powers (of Congress) > and plenty of other BS has been invented and inserted into our educational system by people who disagree with the founders views of absolute liberty. That’s why they brainwash people like you and I with it. > > **There is no absolute liberty, it’s either positive or negative. It all sounds great as a THEORY as you pointed out, but we have actual PEOPLE running our government and things aren’t as you read in text books or online. Everybody is full of their own convictions.**! ---
**Author:** ![beat90tsi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/43a26b/32.png) [@beat90tsi](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/beat90tsi)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2008, 9:33am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/ron-paul-2nd-in-nevada-caucus-right-now/194911/47 "2008-01-25T09:33:58Z")
> [@FS/FT: \*SOLD 93 Civic Si/LS SOLD\*](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/fs-ft-sold-93-civic-si-ls-sold/34548/8): > > The 10th Amendment is just fine, I don’t see your point! That has become abundantly clear. You support modern group-think, not the principles upon which this country was founded. ---
**Author:** ![kilmer420](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/d6d6ee/32.png) [@kilmer420](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/kilmer420)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2008, 1:02pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/ron-paul-2nd-in-nevada-caucus-right-now/194911/48 "2008-01-25T13:02:07Z")
> [@First Round pic Fantasy Football - Who would you pick?](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/first-round-pic-fantasy-football-who-would-you-pick/34545/31): > > That has become abundantly clear. You support modern group-think, not the principles upon which this country was founded. Basic principles of life aren’t the same as the founding fathers had. (Similar to how the bible doesn’t apply to todays standards) We don’t have the same problems they did. The original text of the Constitution generated some opposition on the ground that it did not include adequate guarantees of civil liberties. The “bill of rights” spells out the immunities of individual citizens. ---
**Author:** ![beat90tsi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/43a26b/32.png) [@beat90tsi](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/beat90tsi)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2008, 3:39pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/ron-paul-2nd-in-nevada-caucus-right-now/194911/49 "2008-01-25T15:39:48Z")
> [@Debt ?'s](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/debt-s/34565/14): > > Basic principles of life aren’t the same as the founding fathers had. (Similar to how the bible doesn’t apply to todays standards) We don’t have the same problems they did. The original text of the Constitution generated some opposition on the ground that it did not include adequate guarantees of civil liberties. The “bill of rights” spells out the immunities of individual citizens. I disagree on all points. The basic principles of life are the same. Have you ever heard the phrase “power corrupts…” ? I hope I don’t have to finish it for you. The founders knew human nature, and that a government too large would always end up oppressing the people because of the human condition, greed, power, etc. (if you want to bring in the Bible, it would be called “sin”) That is why the government should fear the people, rather than us fearing the government. I am not going to try to convince you that that level of freedom is better. I know it’s better for me, and it is the way the country was founded. The fact that you disagree and want a nanny state is your own personal belief system. It just so happens that your beliefs clash with the U.S. Constitution and the intentions of the founders. The bill of rights refers to the first 10 amendments, and they’re an integral part of our government. They weren’t added 10 years later, they began the process the same year they ratified the Constitution, and all of the states completed ratification 2 years later in 1791, which was pretty quick given the speed of communication back then. Patrick Henry said “Give me Liberty or give me death.” That’s pretty blunt. The founders left no room for negotiation when it came to the power of government. The fact that people in congress (Hilary, Obama) want to use government (meaning tax dollars taken from the working class) to pay for the “greater good” doesn’t mean that’s good, right, or even legal according to the Constitution. They knew EXACTLY what we would face. > Experience hath shewn, that even under the best forms of government those entrusted with power have, in time, and by slow operations, perverted it into tyranny. > Thomas Jefferson > I predict future happiness for Americans if they can prevent the government from wasting the labors of the people under the pretense of taking care of them. > Thomas Jefferson > No government ought to be without censors; and where the press is free no one ever will. > Thomas Jefferson Sit down tonight and research the CFR or Council on Foreign Relations, and tell me if you still think the press is free. > Sometimes it is said that man cannot be trusted with the government of himself. Can he, then be trusted with the government of others? Or have we found angels in the form of kings to govern him? Let history answer this question. > Thomas Jefferson I’d rather govern myself thank you very much, particularly when it comes to medicine. > The natural progress of things is for liberty to yield and government to gain ground. > Thomas Jefferson > When the people fear their government, there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is liberty. > Thomas Jefferson > When we get piled upon one another in large cities, as in Europe, we shall become as corrupt as Europe. > Thomas Jefferson There’s nothing that new happening today. They had both insurance and banking then. This isn’t Star-Trek, our society is very similar. ---
**Author:** ![Pewter](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/pewter/32/5936_2.png) [@Pewter](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Pewter)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2008, 3:48pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/ron-paul-2nd-in-nevada-caucus-right-now/194911/50 "2008-01-26T15:48:03Z")
> [@ShalerPunk"](#): > > can we move this to the “Who Gives a Shit?” forum? [Previous page](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/ron-paul-2nd-in-nevada-caucus-right-now/194911.md?page=2)