# The Healthcare Reform Thread **URL:** \ **Category:** PolitiSUCK\ **Created:** [August 2, 2009, 6:55pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/the-healthcare-reform-thread/71479 "2009-08-02T18:55:02Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Joe](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/joe/32/7219_2.png) [@Joe](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Joe)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2009, 11:57am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/the-healthcare-reform-thread/71479/41 "2009-08-03T11:57:24Z")
ah mike125k, so you’re in that group with the “Sucks for you.” mentality. These people generally feel that way until they’re the unfortunate one. ---
**Author:** ![boardjnky4](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/96bed5/32.png) [@boardjnky4](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/boardjnky4)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2009, 12:00pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/the-healthcare-reform-thread/71479/42 "2009-08-03T12:00:50Z")
> [@Joe](#): > > Those of you who feel it’s a privelege, do you feel the same about police and fire services? I mean, those are very expensive, and they exist because of the productivity of the federal, state, and local governments that run them, with the underlying goal of keeping people alive and unharmed, just like the medical system. If not, what’s the difference? Cancer will render you just as dead as a gunshot or a fire. They are fundamental government services. Health Care has never been a government service. Really though, “right” vs. “privilege” is a stupid argument. The real question is, what is the OBLIGATION of the government. What level of involvement in your life, do you want the government to have? Many people have different opinions on what that level should be. For me, on the subject of healthcare, I would like for that level of involvement to be the following. I would like the government to make sure that health care companies are not taking advantage of citizens of the US. It should be considered a criminal offense to cause heartache to US citizens in the name of becoming rich. I would like to see insurance companies stop trying to TAKE AWAY coverage for any excuse. Actually, now that I think of it, I believe that the government should strictly define what coverage level the insurance companies must provide. ---
**Author:** ![mike125k](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/mike125k/32/7282_2.png) [@mike125k](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/mike125k)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2009, 12:02pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/the-healthcare-reform-thread/71479/43 "2009-08-03T12:02:11Z")
I don’t cry when things don’t go my way. My 401k is in the shitter these past two years, I think I deserve all that money I lost, Obama please write me a check for my lost retirement funds. Where does it end? This country doesn’t have an endless bank account! Should health care be cheaper? FUCK YES! I hate seeing how much I pay each month for it and that my rates always go up and coverage down. Do we have the money and government know-how to completely fix it right now? No, we’re in over our ears in debt, but what the hell, lets just keep piling it on right? ---
**Author:** ![Joe](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/joe/32/7219_2.png) [@Joe](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Joe)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2009, 12:05pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/the-healthcare-reform-thread/71479/44 "2009-08-03T12:05:15Z")
Boardjnky, I’m all for standardized plans, with a standardized premium, that private companies could provide. Maybe similar to how the gas company works, where they regulate in a small profit and they’re not allowed to take any more. I just don’t trust the private insurers to NOT find loopholes to screw everyone. Also, like I said, any solution to lower costs needs to be either negotiated by EVERY insurance company, together, or implemented as a gov’t plan, as individual insurance companies do not have much power to set reimbursement rates for providers. ---
**Author:** ![2TurboZ](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/2turboz/32/7577_2.png) [@2TurboZ](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/2TurboZ)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2009, 12:30pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/the-healthcare-reform-thread/71479/45 "2009-08-03T12:30:29Z")
The entire problem with the US healthcare system is the cost to provide what is now considered a standard level of care. Our standard of care is far greater than countries that have lower standards. The US is also the world leader in innovative medicine and new procedures…that costs $. We could revert to 1800’s whisky and a steak knife if you want to stay affordable but procedures, research, drugs all cost $ to develop and implement. The private sector has made fortunes because of this but as I mentioned our standard of care is higher than anywhere else in the world. You get what you pay for. As far as the Govt. stepping in…they should stay out of it. Obamanation is trying to take over every large industry in less than a years time and I do not see how any of you are ok with that or blind to it. Free Market FTW ---
**Author:** ![mike125k](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/mike125k/32/7282_2.png) [@mike125k](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/mike125k)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2009, 12:33pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/the-healthcare-reform-thread/71479/46 "2009-08-03T12:33:08Z")
> [@2TurboZ](#): > > Obamanation is trying to take over every large industry in less than a years time and I do not see how any of you are ok with that or blind to it. > > Free Market FTW I wouldn’t say that, I think there’s plenty of people on here who see what Comrade Obama is trying to do. ---
**Author:** ![2TurboZ](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/2turboz/32/7577_2.png) [@2TurboZ](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/2TurboZ)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2009, 12:35pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/the-healthcare-reform-thread/71479/47 "2009-08-03T12:35:12Z")
Well then I don’t know how they support it…it freaks me out. ---
**Author:** ![boardjnky4](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/96bed5/32.png) [@boardjnky4](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/boardjnky4)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2009, 12:36pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/the-healthcare-reform-thread/71479/48 "2009-08-03T12:36:08Z")
> [@2TurboZ](#): > > The entire problem with the US healthcare system is the cost to provide what is now considered a standard level of care. Our standard of care is far greater than countries that have lower standards. > > The US is also the world leader in innovative medicine and new procedures…that costs $. > > We could revert to 1800’s whisky and a steak knife if you want to stay affordable but procedures, research, drugs all cost $ to develop and implement. > > The private sector has made fortunes because of this but as I mentioned our standard of care is higher than anywhere else in the world. You get what you pay for. > > As far as the Govt. stepping in…they should stay out of it. Obamanation is trying to take over every large industry in less than a years time and I do not see how any of you are ok with that or blind to it. > > Free Market FTW you are absolutely right however, there are people out there being denied surgeries/medication for life-ending diseases. All the while, CEOs of health insurance companies are getting disgustingly rich. That shit is WRONG. ---
**Author:** ![Joe](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/joe/32/7219_2.png) [@Joe](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Joe)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2009, 12:36pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/the-healthcare-reform-thread/71479/49 "2009-08-03T12:36:39Z")
> [@2TurboZ](#): > > Free Market FTW Free Market does not work in matters of life and death. If someone sticks a gun to the back of your head and says “Give me all your money or I’ll shoot you,” that’s free market, and that’s what we have now. You either pay for a bodyguard to stop him from doing so, give him all your money, or you’re dead. ---
**Author:** ![2TurboZ](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/2turboz/32/7577_2.png) [@2TurboZ](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/2TurboZ)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2009, 12:38pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/the-healthcare-reform-thread/71479/50 "2009-08-03T12:38:35Z")
> [@boardjnky4](#): > > you are absolutely right > > however, there are people out there being denied surgeries/medication for life-ending diseases. All the while, CEOs of health insurance companies are getting disgustingly rich. That shit is WRONG. I dont agree with that…but didnt Barry say that sometimes its better to be on a prescription than to have the more expensive surgery at the town hall meeting? ---
**Author:** ![2TurboZ](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/2turboz/32/7577_2.png) [@2TurboZ](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/2TurboZ)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2009, 12:39pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/the-healthcare-reform-thread/71479/51 "2009-08-03T12:39:32Z")
> [@Joe](#): > > Free Market does not work in matters of life and death. If someone sticks a gun to the back of your head and says “Give me all your money or I’ll shoot you,” that’s free market, and that’s what we have now. You either pay for a bodyguard to stop him from doing so, give him all your money, or you’re dead. And you think the Govt. is going to be that body guard??? ---
**Author:** ![boardjnky4](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/96bed5/32.png) [@boardjnky4](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/boardjnky4)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2009, 12:41pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/the-healthcare-reform-thread/71479/52 "2009-08-03T12:41:06Z")
> [@2TurboZ](#): > > And you think the Govt. is going to be that body guard??? that is basically what the government is here to do. Whether or not you think they are doing a good job, is irrelevant. Well actually, it’s not. It’s why we are having this debate. ---
**Author:** ![Joe](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/joe/32/7219_2.png) [@Joe](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Joe)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2009, 12:41pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/the-healthcare-reform-thread/71479/53 "2009-08-03T12:41:17Z")
> [@2TurboZ](#): > > And you think the Govt. is going to be that body guard??? Moreso than a company that is paid to protect you but stands to gain, financially, if you die. If that’s not conflict of interest I’ve never seen one. ---
**Author:** ![2TurboZ](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/2turboz/32/7577_2.png) [@2TurboZ](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/2TurboZ)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2009, 12:43pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/the-healthcare-reform-thread/71479/54 "2009-08-03T12:43:19Z")
There is no way the govt. is more efficient than a private system. If you want certain regulations implemented to broaden the level of care available to all TAX PAYING LEGAL CITIZENS…I would be all ears but a Govt. controlled healthcare plan is obsurd. ---
**Author:** ![mike125k](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/mike125k/32/7282_2.png) [@mike125k](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/mike125k)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2009, 12:45pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/the-healthcare-reform-thread/71479/55 "2009-08-03T12:45:51Z")
> [@2TurboZ](#): > > Well then I don’t know how they support it…it freaks me out. I think most of them knew where a typical NYSpeed political thread was headed and just decided to stay out of it. I knew where this would go too, but couldn’t help myself to join in even though I knew I’d be outnumbered by Comrade Obama’s loyal conscripts. ---
**Author:** ![Joe](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/joe/32/7219_2.png) [@Joe](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Joe)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2009, 12:47pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/the-healthcare-reform-thread/71479/56 "2009-08-03T12:47:38Z")
> [@2TurboZ](#): > > There is no way the govt. is more efficient than a private system. > > If you want certain regulations implemented to broaden the level of care available to all TAX PAYING LEGAL CITIZENS…I would be all ears but a Govt. controlled healthcare plan is obsurd. So Absurd that every other first world country in the world does it? I still fail to see how people think the system set up to provide them with the best care is a private system, with profit as its motive for being in business, NOT saving lives. The most profitable solution for them is for the sick people that need care to die, and for the healthy people that don’t go to doctors to keep paying their premiums. They would never say it publicly, but when you get sick, to the point that what they will have to pay out exceeds what they will take in in premiums from you/your employer for the rest of your life, your insurance company wants you to die. How far out should we go with this FREE MARKET shit for basic services? Private fire and police departments? Private military? If we ever get invaded, pay mercenaries if you want your property defended. You guys already want private for-profit education. How far down the line do you take it? ---
**Author:** ![2TurboZ](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/2turboz/32/7577_2.png) [@2TurboZ](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/2TurboZ)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2009, 12:50pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/the-healthcare-reform-thread/71479/57 "2009-08-03T12:50:00Z")
Because when I pay into something I want to get mine back out of it. For someone to offer it up for free to anyone and everyone disgusts me more than a private industry showing #s in the black. ---
**Author:** ![Joe](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/joe/32/7219_2.png) [@Joe](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Joe)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2009, 12:51pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/the-healthcare-reform-thread/71479/58 "2009-08-03T12:51:24Z")
Who said anything about free? The public option would still cost a premium, just like an insurance company. It would just be cheaper. If your private insurance offers you better value than the public option, you keep that. Just like it says, it’s an OPTION. They already give Medicaid away for free to the poor. This would be for people who can pay a premium, but not at the crazy prices it costs to buy your own health insurance right now. ---
**Author:** ![97FormulaWS-6](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/97formulaws-6/32/7384_2.png) [@97FormulaWS-6](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/97FormulaWS-6)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2009, 12:52pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/the-healthcare-reform-thread/71479/59 "2009-08-03T12:52:34Z")
> [@Joe](#): > > So Absurd that every other first world country in the world does it? I still fail to see how people think the system set up to provide them with the best care is a private system, with profit as its motive for being in business, NOT saving lives. The most profitable solution for them is for the sick people that need care to die, and for the healthy people that don’t go to doctors to keep paying their premiums. They would never say it publicly, but when you get sick, to the point that what they will have to pay out exceeds what they will take in in premiums from you/your employer for the rest of your life, your insurance company wants you to die. Yup; Completely agree. I’m sorry, I personally don’t believe Health Care in a treatment sense should NOT be a for-profit organization. The companies who develop the equipment, drugs, etc sure; but the “insurance” companies who basically just decide who gets treatment and who doesn’t based more or less on profit margins should not. ---
**Author:** ![2TurboZ](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/2turboz/32/7577_2.png) [@2TurboZ](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/2TurboZ)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2009, 12:52pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/the-healthcare-reform-thread/71479/60 "2009-08-03T12:52:51Z")
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