# The Misinformed Tea Party **URL:** \ **Category:** NYSpeed Off Topic\ **Created:** [April 16, 2010, 8:40am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/the-misinformed-tea-party/153477 "2010-04-16T08:40:59Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Fry](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/fry/32/7284_2.png) [@Fry](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Fry)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2010, 8:40am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/the-misinformed-tea-party/153477/1 "2010-04-16T08:40:59Z")
Cliffs… It’s hard to explain this divergence between perception and reality. Perhaps these people haven’t calculated their tax returns for 2009 yet and simply don’t know what they owe. Or perhaps they just assume that because a Democrat is president that taxes must have gone up, because that’s what Republicans say that Democrats always do. … One other possibility is that taxpayers are operating on the basis of a sophisticated economic theory called “[Ricardian Equivalence](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ricardian_equivalence).” … Probably the simplest motivation the Tea Partyers have is the one that Howard Beale (actor Peter Finch) gave in the 1976 movie _Network_. “I’m mad as hell, and I’m not gonna take it any more!” … In this sense, the tea parties are simply the latest manifestation of populism, which has arisen periodically throughout American history … Unfortunately for the Tea Party populists, there is no evidence in American history that populism has ever had a meaningful effect on policy. [http://www.forbes.com/2010/03/18/tea-party-ignorant-taxes-opinions-columnists-bruce-bartlett.html](http://www.forbes.com/2010/03/18/tea-party-ignorant-taxes-opinions-columnists-bruce-bartlett.html) ---
**Author:** ![Geehee](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/geehee/32/7238_2.png) [@Geehee](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Geehee)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2010, 8:48am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/the-misinformed-tea-party/153477/2 "2010-04-16T08:48:59Z")
I way too hung over to provide anything useful in this thread. I’m sticking with the ribs thread. ---
**Author:** ![JayS](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/jays/32/15375_2.png) [@JayS](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/JayS)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2010, 8:52am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/the-misinformed-tea-party/153477/3 "2010-04-16T08:52:49Z")
Or maybe it’s that they can see beyond the BS that is the CBO’s numbers on healthcare and know that taxes will have to go up to pay for this beast. Not surprising that a week after it’s passage Obama’s finance czar starts talking about a national sales tax and carbon taxes as the only real way to pay for it. Guess what… those are going to be taxing people making less than $250k. ---
**Author:** ![Fry](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/fry/32/7284_2.png) [@Fry](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Fry)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2010, 8:55am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/the-misinformed-tea-party/153477/4 "2010-04-16T08:55:33Z")
lol you didn’t even read the article. ---
**Author:** ![JayS](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/jays/32/15375_2.png) [@JayS](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/JayS)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2010, 9:02am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/the-misinformed-tea-party/153477/5 "2010-04-16T09:02:44Z")
No, I read it, and it’s full of lots of wonderful numbers that ignore a simple fact that most tea party supports (and most people in general) do know… that eventually we are going to have to pay for all this spending. The difference is the tea party group doesn’t believe the Obama pledge that anyone making less than 250k won’t have to pay for it. When Volcker starts tossing around VAT’s and carbon taxes as a way to pay for healthcare I’m not sure how any reasonable person could believe the 250k exempt statement. To me that’s far more ignorant than knowing the exact tax rate. ---
**Author:** ![Blue\_Eyed\_Devil](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/blue_eyed_devil/32/7292_2.png) [@Blue\_Eyed\_Devil](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Blue_Eyed_Devil)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2010, 9:12am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/the-misinformed-tea-party/153477/6 "2010-04-16T09:12:16Z")
Well Fry, you seem to be “informed” so I am sure you know that the CBO just does the addition and subtraction of the numbers they received from Congress. So, being informed you know that the CBO numbers are basically worthless. Right? ---
**Author:** ![glitch](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/0ea827/32.png) [@glitch](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/glitch)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2010, 9:17am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/the-misinformed-tea-party/153477/7 "2010-04-16T09:17:30Z")
Seems like these people are just mad because a Dem is in office. ---
**Author:** ![Tunerfreak](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/tunerfreak/32/7427_2.png) [@Tunerfreak](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Tunerfreak)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2010, 9:25am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/the-misinformed-tea-party/153477/8 "2010-04-16T09:25:09Z")
> [@glitch](#): > > Where were the Tea Baggers during all of the financial bailouts? Seems like these people are just mad because a Democrat is in office. uhh they were around just not well known/covered ---
**Author:** ![theblue](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/theblue/32/5074_2.png) [@theblue](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/theblue)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2010, 9:53am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/the-misinformed-tea-party/153477/9 "2010-04-16T09:53:52Z")
> [@Blue Eyed Devil](#): > > Well Fry, you seem to be “informed” so I am sure you know that the CBO just does the addition and subtraction of the numbers they received from Congress. So, being informed you know that the CBO numbers are basically worthless. Right? lets be clear here, are you disputing the numbers and facts in this article? do you have anything to back you up? ---
**Author:** ![Fry](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/fry/32/7284_2.png) [@Fry](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Fry)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2010, 10:13am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/the-misinformed-tea-party/153477/10 "2010-04-16T10:13:45Z")
I just thought that it was interesting that the tea party members’ perception of reality (real reality, not future reality that doesn’t exist yet) was so far off. If they can’t get today right then I’m not really sure why one would consider the future that they are afraid of to be any more accurate. If you are justifying their anger with a reality that only exists in your head in the future, then I can’t really argue with that because I have no control of your brain. :shrug: ---
**Author:** ![cougarspeed](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/cougarspeed/32/7468_2.png) [@cougarspeed](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/cougarspeed)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2010, 10:16am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/the-misinformed-tea-party/153477/11 "2010-04-16T10:16:44Z")
Todays reality is skewed in not thinking future debts are meaningful. You really think tomorrow problems don’t matter because they are not here today? LOL ---
**Author:** ![Fry](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/fry/32/7284_2.png) [@Fry](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Fry)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2010, 10:29am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/the-misinformed-tea-party/153477/12 "2010-04-16T10:29:25Z")
I’m saying if you don’t know what today’s problems are then you can’t know what tomorrow’s problems are going to be. ---
**Author:** ![cougarspeed](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/cougarspeed/32/7468_2.png) [@cougarspeed](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/cougarspeed)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2010, 10:33am UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/the-misinformed-tea-party/153477/13 "2010-04-16T10:33:33Z")
I guess that is easy to say but I think it is pretty clear to some of us what we think tomorrows problems are…We might say you guys are blinded by the problems of today(politics of today for that matter) and ignore the problems of the future…Jus sayin. ---
**Author:** ![evane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/6bbea6/32.png) [@evane](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/evane)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2010, 12:00pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/the-misinformed-tea-party/153477/14 "2010-04-16T12:00:28Z")
> [@JayS](#): > > Or maybe it’s that they can see beyond the BS that is the CBO’s numbers on healthcare and know that taxes will have to go up to pay for this beast. Not surprising that a week after it’s passage Obama’s finance czar starts talking about a national sales tax and carbon taxes as the only real way to pay for it. Guess what… those are going to be taxing people making less than $250k. Sorry a VAT (national sales tax) is probaly unavoidable it exists in many other nations. What are the carbon taxes did not see or read anything on those. ---
**Author:** ![Fry](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/fry/32/7284_2.png) [@Fry](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Fry)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2010, 12:09pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/the-misinformed-tea-party/153477/15 "2010-04-16T12:09:52Z")
> [@cougarspeed](#): > > I guess that is easy to say but I think it is pretty clear to some of us what we think tomorrows problems are…We might say you guys are blinded by the problems of today(politics of today for that matter) and ignore the problems of the future…Jus sayin. Fair enough. I’m just talkin specifically about the goons at the tea party rallies but Ah nevermind. We’ve reached pointless banter stage. I like beer. ---
**Author:** ![theblue](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/theblue/32/5074_2.png) [@theblue](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/theblue)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2010, 12:13pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/the-misinformed-tea-party/153477/16 "2010-04-16T12:13:00Z")
one can only speculate the potential problems of the future, but to know the problems of today and ignore them because of something that might happen in the future just doesn’t sound so smart. If you want the real answer just look at the motives. You’ll find with the tea party that it comes down to looking out for number one today by lowering taxes and reducing the size of government to lower costs to go along with it. In reality govt. and taxes will never shrink from what we have today, but if you sell that vision then these deluded people think they can increase their wealth. ---
**Author:** ![JayS](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/jays/32/15375_2.png) [@JayS](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/JayS)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2010, 12:21pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/the-misinformed-tea-party/153477/17 "2010-04-16T12:21:12Z")
> [@evane](#): > > Sorry a VAT (national sales tax) is probaly unavoidable it exists in many other nations. > > What are the carbon taxes did not see or read anything on those. lol… yeah, that makes a lot of sense. Or, you could simply not go down the socialist path that these other nations have taken that require a VAT to pay for the services in the first place. I suppose you think $8 gas (where most of it is taxes) is unavoidable too, because we’ve got to pay for all the projects Obama wants right? An interesting opposing take on the tea party movement. [http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/politics/Hating-the-government-finally-goes-mainstream-90852389.html](http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/politics/Hating-the-government-finally-goes-mainstream-90852389.html) ---
**Author:** ![theblue](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/theblue/32/5074_2.png) [@theblue](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/theblue)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2010, 12:26pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/the-misinformed-tea-party/153477/18 "2010-04-16T12:26:11Z")
you’re missing something, the whole point of a VAT tax is to prevent tax evasion that currently happens. the level of the tax might make it socialist in your opinion, but not the collection system. ---
**Author:** ![Penfold](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/penfold/32/5007_2.png) [@Penfold](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/Penfold)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2010, 3:10pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/the-misinformed-tea-party/153477/19 "2010-04-16T15:10:55Z")
This whole thread sucks. ---
**Author:** ![PureXTC](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forums.speedlife.net/purextc/32/5223_2.png) [@PureXTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/u/PureXTC)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2010, 4:26pm UTC](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/the-misinformed-tea-party/153477/20 "2010-04-16T16:26:10Z")
> [@Penfold](#): > > This whole thread sucks. Here’s a reminder of why not to post semi-complex politics on NYSpeed and certainly not in Off Topic. It’s full of mindless voters who pulled the Obama lever because he’s good at basketball. -=A thread does not “suck” because you don’t understand/care about what is being discussed. FYI, it is easier to not reply at all then to write “This thread sucks” and move on=- [Next page](https://forums.speedlife.net/t/the-misinformed-tea-party/153477.md?page=2)