not the same platform. mazda 3 and S40 are built on a very similar platform. this is based off the EUROPEAN focus, not the north american focus. two totally different cars.
uh, my honda was built in ohio, and i am pretty sure that the american worker that assembled it was paid pretty well to do so. so much so, that new my car probably sold for 15000 when it should have sold for 9000.
i hope GM goes under, and the rest of america wakes up to global economics and realizes how the unions are putting a choke hold on our country.
And as far as depreciation I’m pretty sure my car has not yet lost 50%
It was lost the minute you drove off it out of the lot
50% is exagerated… but ALL NEW VEHICLES DEPRECIATE ONCE YOU SIGN THE AGREEMENT… you don’t even have to drive it, or sit in it, or look at it.
gm is fucked, chrysler is headed in the right direction, and i mean really, who buys a ford?
i mean really, who buys a ford?
ppl who have sex with their immediate family, so once theyre out of the gene pool(which they are gonna inevetabely do to themselves), then that will be another american car company to rot in hell
Exactly. All the major car companies do a majority of their North American car model assemblies right here in the US. If I recall, the “import” cars are more domestic than the “domestic” cars. So arguing the whole “Buy Chevy-Buy American” arguement is null.
You want to know what has killed GM actually…Their image i so torn to shit by slowness to change. The other day I was just in a 2001 Silverado. The interior was no better than my '93 Sunbird was. Actually, the dash material might have been cheaper. The car just reaked of cutting corners and cheap workmansship. Right there is a perfect example. Granted Chevy has worked on their interiors lately, but the general public is still going to be skeptical because they were so far behind what European and Asian car companies were doing.
Then, you have the unions. $30/hr plus extensive benefits, for unskilled, uneducated labor, is ridiculous…
The union/pension/legacy costs are the biggest hit to GM. Their UAW workers don’t pay a cent for healthcare! There is not one other position in the country where that is true - even non-union GM employees pay a portion for healthcare like the rest of us.
Their vehicles are climbing up the reliability ladder, in one study they are #2 behind Honda and ahead of Toyota! The Vibe is one of GM’s leading problem cars, and its a reskinned Toyota. Buick and Caddy are consistently in the top with Lexus, Acura, etc. They are far ahead of the German makes in reliability. I think the problem is more of percieved reliability - everyone who remember’s their aunt’s POS Corsica.
Interior workmanship and material quality is improving - the hammering GM took on that for years finally sunk in. Cars like the GTO, G6, Solstice and Cobalt have interiors in a whole nother galaxy compared to Fbodys, Grand Am’s, and Cavaliers. Resale value will only come about slowly after years of percieved improvement in quality. Their fullsize trucks and SUV’s are still some of the best in the buisness.
GM isn’t going anywhere for awhile, but they’ll never be the behmouth they once were. And it’d be foolish of them to sell off GMAC.
Well, I do stick primarily to GM’s though I don’t believe buying American is a good arguement.
But the fact of the matter is the money GM gets when purchasing their cars have a much greater impact on the American economy then any Japanese competitor. It goes beyond just the location of the factory - the supply chain, finance arm (GMAC), the fact GM is traded on the NYSE and stock performance affects the American investor and the Dow averages. Honda/Toyota are not traded in the US, only on the Nikkei, and one has to go through extensive Japanese securities rules and regulations to ever become a shareholder.
I meant European. :shrug:
I don’t blame GM employees for milking the system… but now its time to stop. Don’t be shocked that your now going to get paid what your worth… instead of 2-4x as much. Just be grateful you got paid a shit load more than anyone else you know doing similar work… and move on. Or try to find someone else to hire you with the same benefits/pay that you were making. Good Luck there.
well thats silly. they made the cobalt SS as a prayer for competition against foriegn cars and use some imported parts anyways…meaning, even they know foriegn cars are better, y cant u
you make a point, but that seems to be the only real arugment… buying an import helps employ just as many americans as buying a domestic… factory workers, sales force, parts guys, lot boys, so on and so forth.
now when you buy towel or some other consumer goods, thats where there are issue. none that i can argue though (for the american worker), i love my 30 dollar DVD player.
Well that was most certainly not nice. (K cuv)
Unions need to go away. A guy driving a fork lift making 30/hour plus full benefits is a liaibility. Period. The UAW makes sure factories are full of people who remove more value from their company than they add to it. How can you expect any company to stay afloat when being muscled to conduct business in this way? They might as well sell the cars for less than it costs them to build them. It’s the same damn thing.
For some reason the unions are too goddam near-sighted to realize that by demanding absurd compensation, they are forcing themselves out of jobs and driving manufacturing overseas where unions don’t exist (yet.) Why is it so hard to understand that when you insist that your position be a liaibility, your position won’t be there long. This isn’t rocket surgery! (To quote something ZD said last week that I still get a kick out of.)
The government needs to intervene to put an end to the UAW and return the auto industry to capitalism. If your existence adds value, you get to stay. If your position removes value, you’re fired. It’s simple! Too bad it will never happen… Too many rednecks in the UAW that would riot…
As for design, yeah time for GM to introduce some new competitive stuff. The Cobalt was a huge step in the right direction for their small cars. A domestic sport/economy coup with a Getrag 5 speed? A supercharged model that actually moves fairly well? Sounds good. I almost bought one myself.
They needs to stop whipping their dead horses. I mean how long has the lumin…er…Monte Carlo been around???
The solstice is a waste of time. There’s only a certain niche for miata-like cars, and it’s filled quite well by the Miata.
It seems to me like GM is banking totally on loyal-repeat buyers. And they’re getting to the age where the ones who are still chanting “buy domestic to keep jobs here, UAW4Life” are dying.
The unions aren’t near sighted, they’re just looking at a long term plan different than what we have right now. They’re hoping the government is going to step in and tax the hell out of anything “not american” so they can continue getting their high pay. That might have worked in the 50’s but in today’s global economy with emerging markets like China I don’t think that plan will work.
So they’re not nearsighted, they’re just plain stupid. And spoiled. Why the fcuk should the government tax the shit out of a good product so that some unskilled laborer that adds very little value to a company can make as much as me, a degreed engineer with several years of experience that adds a ton of value to the company?
Unions were effective and necessary during our grandparents generation, but they have evolved into a profit destroying monster that is driving manufacturing overseas, all so that people who are members of this elite club can make a ton of money without having to earn it.
I truly believe that during our lifetimes we will see manufacturing unions self-destruct by forcing all large-scale manufacturing to move to countries that don’t have unions.
I personally will never work in a union-run company. I would not be able to stand being directly affected by the stupidity. Can you imagine not being able to move a box once or pick up a wrench once because some union guy gets paid 30/hour to do it and he doesn’t want it to become apparent that his job is totally unnecessary?
this is my solution:
GM should hire very good deisgners…and then, they should pay these designers with alot of money + lots of holidays, etc…
then, hopefuly they can get much better car design like europeans and japanese car makers…
lol…
:tup:
sad, but true.