OFFICIAL: 2008 ELECTION THREAD

NYSpeed Automotive NYSpeed Off Topic
1601

I still say wind power is joke when you compare it to nuclear. The largest wind farm in the world (the Horse Hollow Wind Energy Center) generates 735 megawatts but is spread over 47000 acres!

For comparision the Watts Bar nuclear plant is located on just 1770 acres and produces 1138 megawatts. This was the last new nuclear power plant created in the US and it opened in 1996. I’m sure one built with today’s technology would be even more efficient. Watts Bar would have doubled it’s production (still on the same 1770 acres) but reactor #2 was canceled when it was 80% built due to the anti-nuclear groups.

1602

Why are you so concerned with acreage? Its clean and safe. Its easier to maintain and can create tens of thousands of domestic jobs and can power hundreds of thousands of homes.

I’m not anti-nuclear, but you can’t power America solely nuclear plants. The risks would be too high.

1603

What do you base that on?

1604

Because as a software engineer I understand the concept of scalability.

Someone already did the math for me as I was researching how best to explain this.

Electricity Consumption in the USA is 3.717 Trillion KWH (2004) per year. Current windmill technology is about 2 Megawatts per machine. Running these machines continuously at full capacity, that would be 18 Million KWH generated. Thus, approximately 213,000 windmills ( exclusive of any redundancy for failures) would be needed to power the USA. The space to locate these machine, and oh yes a windy place is also necessary. It works in beautiful Wyoming where there are large areas where cows roam and the wind blows.

One modern Nuclear plant (2 reactors @ 1200 Megawatts each) can produce 2400 Megawatts vice 2 Megawatts for a single wind generator. It would take less than 200 nuclear electricity generating plants to power the entire USA. Demand for electricity increases each year, even with better efficiencies because there are more people and more electrically powered devices. Demand in 2005 increased to 4.05 Trillion KWH.

So it would take less than 200 nuclear plants to power the entire US. That hardly seems “unsafe” to me.

1605

McCain is certainly losing his mind:

Q: Senator, finally, let’s talk about Spain. If you are elected president, would you be willing to invite President Jose Luis Rodriguez Zapatero to the White House to meet with you?

McCain: I would be willing to meet with those leaders who are friends and want to work with us in a cooperative fashion. And by the way, President Calderon of Mexico is fighting a very, very tough fight against the drug cartels. I am glad we are now working in cooperation with the Mexican government on the Merida plan. And I intend to move forward with relations and invite as many of them as I can, of those leaders to the White House.

Q: Would that invitation be extended to the Zapatero government, to the president himself?

McCain: I don’t, I, you know, honestly, I have to look at relations, and the situations, and the priorities but I can assure you I will establish closer relations with our friends, and I will stand up to those who want to do harm to the United States of America. I know how to do both.

Q: So you have to wait and see if he is willing to meet with you, will you be able to do it in the White House?

McCain: Well, again, I don’t. All I can tell you is that I have a clear record of working with leaders in the hemisphere that are friends with us and standing up to those who are not. And that’s judged on the basis of the importance of our relationship with Latin America and the entire region.

Q: Okay, what about you? I’m talking about the President of Spain.

McCain: What about me what?

Q: Okay, are you willing to meet with him if you are elected president?

McCain: I am willing to meet with any leader who is dedicated to the same principles and philosophy that we are for human rights, democracy, and freedom. And I will stand up to those that do not.

In terms of the nuclear debate, I don’t have a problem with it so long as we can find a truly safe way of dealing with waste.

1606

The problem with a nuclear powered America isn’t just the safety aspect, but existing (persuasive) carbon burning companies that won’t support alternatives.

1607

No, the problem is NIMBY’s. The existing companies want to build but they’ve given up because no one will spend the millions and millions to start construction only to get shutdown by lawsuit after lawsuit.

Read a little but about the Watts Bar plant I posted about earlier. TVA would gladly build more but not if they’re going to get shut down mid project.

1608

TVA isn’t a company, it’s an authority. There’s a lot of head butting between private generators and authorities.

1609

Yes, like the 100’s if not 1000’s of other authorities who just want to produce electricity for a good rate. If the government would step up and protect them from the NIMBY movement they would be fighting to build the reactors. Which, by the way strokedz, also would create jobs.

I was doing the math on how much land we would need for your 213000 windmills based on the 47000 acres the current largest windproject takes up and it works out to 27 million acres. Roughly every square inch of the state of Ohio.

200 nuke plants seems much smarter and cheaper.

1610

I wouldn’t think of you as the type of person to be for publicly owned authorities.

…or to overlook lobbyist groups as a major reason why we can’t have nice things like cheaper energy.

1611

Authorities can work, when you’re not in the corrupt state if NY. Here it would be full of political appointee morons who would cause a meltdown and kill us all. Since we only need 200 we can just keep the NY power authority out of it. :slight_smile:

1612

all i gota say is its because of the democrats that this is happening. with their welfare and their stupid taxes. Mcain all the way!!! USMC.:gotme:

1613

I wish i could -karma you. idiot.

1614

this election sucks :frowning:

1615

I understand the concept for Nuclear but I think the bigger problem that needs to be looked at with Nuclear is the waste product and how to deal with the waste of 200 plants.

1616

send it to Iraq. We get rid of it and if McCain wins we can uncover it in a few years and say it was left over from their WMD program.

1617

Send it to a balck hole.

Did Biden back out yet or is it going to be after the debate?

1618

electricity is the future and will be the resource that reduces our dependence on oil. nearly 50% of our power plants burn coal for their power generation. every ounce of coal we burn is mined from our own soil. instead of debating about which form of power generation will be our future, we should be researching how to make our existing infrastructure environmentally viable.

1619

wat? why would he back out after he pwns this dumb broad?

1620

x2

I’m not against nuclear plants, we should have them but 200 plants creates a lot of waste.

I just came back from Atlantic City and they have a wind/solar farm right outside the city and everyone I talked to, dealer to patron, said it was a good idea. The turbines and panels were placed on the garbage almost swampy shoreline between the city and the mainland.

Land that was not being used and was too expensive to build on.