Ok, this is in regards to my Neon ACR. The stock ACR springs are shit. Plain and simple. The stock “ACR Competition Package” springs are
Front: 150lb. inch Linear
Rear: 120lb. inch Linear
Mopar Performance offers Extra High Rate lowering springs, which have:
Front: 310lb. inch Linear
Rear: 230lb. inch Linear
They say the car will ride pretty rough, but will handle phenominally well.
Now…I found on ebay, a set of lowering springs, which offer a significantly higher springrate, then that on the Mopar Performance springs. They are:
Front: 450lb. inch Progressive
Rear: 250lb. inch Progressive
I realize, my ride quality will suffer…but aside from that…will this make the car handle better yet, over the Mopar Performance springs, or will it be too stiff, and be a bad investment? I’m trying to learn as much as a can about suspensions. Hope some of you can shine some light on this…ecspecially you racers out there.
I don’t know about the quality of the ebay springs. Could be good, could be bad.
The key here is that the Mopar springs are linear, and the lowering springs are progressive.
I’m not a suspension guru, but I’ll try to explain as best as I can.
First you need to understand what progressive springs do, and how they differ from linear springs.
Progressive means that it’s (spring)rate changes depending on the amount of deflection in a way that can not be plotted via a linear relationship. These kinds of springs try to play both sides of the line. The progressive springs try to retain some comfort while giving enhanced stiffness. Progressive springs are no good unless they have a good progressive shock to accompany them.
Long story short, if you want to use the car often for street use, you probably want to go with a progressive shick/spring package. Linear springs cannot adapt in the same way to changes in the road to allow for the comfort factor. Linear springs are very uncompromising. If you want all out performance on the track, get linear springs. Progressive springs will be good if you just want to play around and have fun, but they will hold you back from taking the next step as far as competitive racing is concerned.
If you are looking for a spring shock package, I’d look for some sort of Eibach combo. These setups tend to be a bit more proven streetwise.
Mopar springs will outhandle the progressive springs everytime (With the right shock package of course). But if you are driving down a bumpy street you will be cringing and cursing over most bumps. And your GF will get pissed and start bitching about the harsh ride. And spill coffee all over your supple leather seats and onto your nice clean carpet.
Well, to my knowledge, the higher spring rates will give you better handeling to a point… If you have esentially NO suspension with some crazy high spring rates, the car is just going to be bouncing over small imperfections, and your slip. Finding the right spring rate and dampening is key. You should spring for some adjustable dampening on your struts, so you can adjust it to where you feel fit. That will be the best increase in handeling, beacouse you can adjust it on the fly and make it right where you want it. Its prety difficult to change your spring rates casually… But, stiffer is generally better. And if the ‘factory performancey’ ones are only 310/230… your probably going to want 400/280 ish… But, thats just me… I have 550/400 on my car, and its not stiff enough… Oh, and generic ebay springs BLOW… My brother has them, and theyre just sooo cheaply manufactured… And your not going to want progressive springs for handeling, theyre so you can have bricks for springs when your ripping through turns, but have a decent ride quality still… And if your goal is handeling, your not going to want that 1/2" of soft ride… And if your slammed, your going to hit your front wheels on your fender all the time with progressive springs.
PM bpipe95, he’s the guy you met with Cass to buy that transmission. He has the suspension you want. Tried and true, taken people to national championships in autocross. Trust me on this. It’s incredible.
RX3 is right…it all depends on waht u want…if u can handle the bumps the Mopar Linears will be better…the rates listed for the progressive are the rates for maximum compression which depending on ur setup u may not even reach…Linear rates also IMO give u a better feel and more predictability on how the car will react…I qwould go mopars…or other known brand linear rate springs…if they are for teh neon its a pretty light car u dont need crazy rates…but it also depends on how low u go…the lower u got the stiffer u want too…
RX3 is SOMEWHAT right re: progressive. They are sort of like having a main and “tender” spring - or, in a way, like having low and high speed bump settings on your shocks (you don’t… trust me).
Some are “more” progressive than others. For example, unless I read it wrong, the SpecE30 spring is actually “progressive” but it goes from whatever to like 900lb in the first half inch? or something silly like that.
My point is, unless you JUST race or autox the car, you might want to consider a top-brand / quality progressive spring. I’ve found most “factory upgrade” suspension components are overpriced and uninspiring… but those seem decently matched. Rather low rate (overall… then again I had 7xx on my RSX and thought it was perfectly fine) but linear IS more predictable.
HOWEVER - you are sort of at a “worst of both words” point with the two setups you posted. The “arguably better” linear ones are a very low rate, and the higher rate ones are of questionably quality + design.
I say keep shopping… and don’t forget GOOD shocks.
PS - +1 re: talking to Brent / people he knows re: Neons.
PM bpipe95, he’s the guy you met with Cass to buy that transmission. He has the suspension you want. Tried and true, taken people to national championships in autocross. Trust me on this. It’s incredible.
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best advice so far. Listen to experience.
On the street you really want the lowest spring rate that will give you good vehicle control.
With a coilover setup you can lower the spring rate significantly while maintaining or improving performance.
Lower rate will give you a more comfortible ride.
As someone mentioned, springs alone are shit and must be installed with shocks that match
Ride quality has ALOT to do with dampeners as well…
I moved from a 450/450 springrate on my car on cheap dampeners. It rode like ass 90 percent of the time.
I now run a german made koni valved KW coilover set on 400/400 rates. The ride is 100x better. In some cases better than stock.
If your shocks cant control your springs your gonna be bouncing around like a pinball.
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Yep, if you dont have good dampening, your car is going to feel like a piece of shit. If you can get some german/japanese struts, your car should still ride prety nice, as long as you like a stiffer ride, but every bump wont feel like your car is falling apart. Adjustable’s are much better, but pricey and they dont make them for every aplication, but id say theyre what you want…
But if you are driving down a bumpy street you will be cringing and cursing over most bumps. And your GF will get pissed and start bitching about the harsh ride. And spill coffee all over your supple leather seats and onto your nice clean carpet.
PM bpipe95, he’s the guy you met with Cass to buy that transmission. He has the suspension you want. Tried and true, taken people to national championships in autocross. Trust me on this. It’s incredible.
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Yes talking to others that race your car would help, there are a lot of proven setups already in use.
Just keep in mind that while that setup may kick ass at auto-x, it’s not going to necessarily kick ass on the street as far as comfort and ride harshness are concerned. How much are you willing to compromise? You need to figure that out before plopping your money down.
Wow thanks for all the great responses guys. Some guy on neons.org is reproducing the X High Rate springs, and lots of people are buying them with great results so far. I am going to pick up a set of them. I really do not care about the ride quality of the car. Seriously, I don’t. As long as it turns, thats all that counts to me. It’s an ACR, not an Expresso. Besides, comfort cannot be found in a Neon anyways, LOL!
As for dampeners, I have new Koni Adjustables. Stock equipment on 97+ Neon ACRs’. I upgraded my 95 model to these.
My urethane chassis bushing kit just came in the mail this afternoon, and my Azenis RT-615’s should be here sometime early next week. Once the springs and bushings are installed, I am going to have a wheel alignment performed, with something around -2 degrees camber. Neons love camber. Car is finally coming together.
BTW, will I need another wheel alignment when I change my Front & Rear swaybars? I don’t think I will, but I could be wrong.
