Nissan Leaf ($25k, 100m Range, 100% Electric) VS. Chevy Volt?


#141

^^^ THIS is why people are making a big deal about it.

EVs qualify for this tax rebate, hybrid vehicles like the Prius do not. You can’t even get rebates for a Prius anymore.

See the list here: http://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/tax_hybrid.shtml

If the volt is no longer an EV by definition, one would think it no longer would qualify for and EV tax credit and then that would increase the cost of this car by $7,500 - which is definitely a big deal and would make this car uncompetitive.

I’m sure this will be the answer.[/QUOTE]

Umm… everything I’ve seen says the Volt will be eligible as-is.

Namely:

The new tax credits for plug-in vehicles will range from between $2,500 to $7,500, with factors such as battery capacity determining how much owners would receive. Cars like the Chevrolet Volt, due in late 2010, would be eligible for the maximum credit of $7,500. The total cost of the program over the next ten years is estimated at $2.8 billion - a significant sum of money, but a drop in the bucket next to the $700 billion bill it’s a part of, or the money received so far by Chrysler and GM.

To meet the tax incentive’s standards, a plug-in vehicle must have a battery with a minimum capacity of 4kWh, though an additional $200 of tax credit is added for every kilowatt-hour thereafter, which is how the Volt gets to the maximum $7,500 limit with its 16kWh battery.

If the soon-to-be Prius plug-in has a maximum storage capacity of over 4 kWh, then it too would be eligible for the credit - though starting at the $2500 level. The Volt (16 kWh) and the Leaf (24 kWh) now both max out the credit.


#142

So you just need a big battery to get the rebate? Sweet! j/k relax.


#143

hey guys, just thought i would clear some things up about this car. I am on the release team for the volt and am currently in LA training dealers as they will be getting them in their show rooms shortly.

This is quite an interesting little car. i have been driving one for the past week and a half now. People keep hearing different things and reading stuff from jalopnik about the fuel comsumption. there are many numbers being thrown around in regards to the gas consumption. like every other vehicle on the market it all comes down to the driver. Technically one could never put gas in the car if their commute is around 40 miles. That being said the battery can be drained in half the time if the user is driving agressively. t The vehicle does get the 7500 off from the US federial government but does not qualify for the use us the HOV lanes for the 2011 model year.

to clear up contraversy about the “range extender” and how the wheels are driven. There are 2 electric motors that can work either together or separetly (depending on the needs from the driver) and power is then put through a transfer case which puts power to the wheels. at no point in time does a gasoline engine ever mechanically drive the wheels. i have only had this car up to 70 mph and it pulls all the way on electric power only. The range extender or generator kicks in when there around 20% battery life left (as to not completely strain the battery) and runs at a constant rpm for maximum efficiency. it will also shut off when in stop and go traffic or at stop lights.

what people have to remember is that this is a commuter car, the first of its kind and its new technology. It pulls like a v6, has a near 50 50 weight distrobution, and wont leave you stranded if you run out of juice like the tesla and leaf. for what it is, its a great little car, makes the 2011 prius seem ancient,
.

Wow that was long so cliff notes

  1. MPG totoally depends on driver and how the cars driven
  2. Gasonline engine at no point mechanically drives the wheels, and prevents “range anxiety”
  3. its new technology and is a better package then what its currently up against.

If any one has any questions id be glad to answer and ill check up on this thread as my tour goes on . hopefully, when one becomes available we will have a leaf to comapare it to. now we are only comparing it to the prius as it is the king in the eco car segment


#144

Do they teach you the dance moves?


#145

If your really on the release team and all what kind of proof can you offer that the engine never mechanically drives the wheels, because that’s what GM reps have been saying, but someone has to prove one way or another.

Although to be honest I couldn’t care less as long as it is eligible for the ev tax credit.


#146

^Yeah, how about pictures of the drive train?

After reading about the Volt I wonder…
I have a 6000 watt generator that will run for 8 hours on 3 gallons of gas. Is that enough power to move a vehicle? If so why wasn’t this done years ago? lol

Maybe I will buy a Ford Ranger and put a generator and large motor(electric) in the bed. I think I have some big old motors from some old machines laying around somewhere. lol


#147

Have you seen the top gear episode where they do that?


#148

^No… not yet. Searching.


#149

http://ecomodder.com/forum/showthread.php/can-i-use-generator-power-electric-car-directly-4518-2.html#post53568

This is a great thread on the topic, and according to that post, you’re gonna need a lot more juice than 6k watts to get any decent acceleration/uphill performance

popping 10 car batteries in there to handle the temporary high loads would work though. That is basically the same thing as a chevy volt though. The volt likely just has a lot more logic to cut down on running the “generator”


#150

Here is another silly question; wouldn’t it make sense for an electric car to have a motor at each wheel making it AWD? Of course there is the cost of 4 motors but they could be smaller.


#151

cost / weight / complexity… they’ll get there, but first lets get the one motor thing working well.


#152

Jalopnik is now claiming that the engine sometimes mechanically drives the wheels at speeds above 30 mph


#153

^GM is turning into the Paladino of this race, the story is qlways changing. lol


#154

why havent they made a diesel assisted motor yet for a electric car? that was you can hopefully convert to waste oil and be driving around for free :slight_smile:


#155

^^
again, cost and complexity… it will happen in a later wave.


#156

The volt is a silly vehicle at its price… If I wanted a hybrid, I would just get the better Prius.

My vote goes to the Leaf. Its significantly cheaper, and goes 2x as far as my max daily commute without using gas.


#157

That artical on jalopnik states

“there are situations where the engine actually motivates the wheels at speeds above 30 MPH.”

Meaning that the gas engine will act like a generator to put power back into the battery. The battery will not charge down to 0%. it operates between 20% and 80% to ensure a long life. These situations where the gas engine would kick in above 30mph would be when the battery is down to around 20% to ensure the battery doesnt reach the 0% mark. There is no situation where the gas engine actually turns the wheels through a transmission.

normally i would i scan the diagram i have of the electric driveline but i am living out of a suitcase lol and dont have my scanner. if i can find it in the many pdfs i have ill post it up.

snapped some pics the other day

Now dont take it like im a volt fanatic, or am pro gm all the time, i am just doing my job and this tour just happens to be for the volt. Ill do my best to answer any questions, i am excited to try out the leaf when we add it in our demo/ training demo (i DO drive a nissan).

And No we dont have to sing and dance lol, it would be nice tho to have dancers around rather than stale car salesmen


#158

what do you think motivates means? one definition is to propel.


#159

Yesterday at the Ren Cen they had a Tesla, F-150 electric, Equinox electric, Volt and some other electric cars. They had a track set up and people doing laps. The line was long and I usually only head over when they have the SS and a 5.0 to do comparisons.


#160

Thanks for the input man.

Can the car be driven without gas? Like, if someone never wanted to put fuel in it?

I thought the whole idea was that you’d never need to go to the pump if you only traveled 40 miles. And that the gas motor was only there to satisfy “range anxiety” if you wanted to drive further.

:gotme: