Brake pad shims

[Harvey]

I’m looking for real life experience with brake pad shims, helping to keep brake pad and rotor heat away from the caliper (and fluid).

I seem to have developed a problem where my brake fluid is boiling, since switching to an aggressive pad (Hawk DTC 70). I recently upgraded to Motul RBF 600 fluid from ATE superblue, which has helped but not fixed the problem. Now when it gets hot the fluid is still functional, meaning that I can use the brakes, but the pedal gets really low. The pedal stays low until I bleed the system, so I know the fluid has boiled. This is not comfortable on course, and is more prevalent during long sessions.

The car came with the Brembo’s which had a double shim arrangement, (which I threw away out of ignorance) and the new pads have no shims. I’ve seen some coated steel, and titanium shims marketed for anti-squeal that are also supposed to add thermal resistance. I could also make some SS shims at work, but my question to NY Speed is, from experience do shims really help as a thermal insulator?

[theblue]

they’re the “after you’ve done everything else” icing on the cake. the best thing you can probably do is remove the shields behind your front rotors… they trap a lot of heat. After that you want brake ducts… getting titanium shims is like buying those expensive lightweight lug nuts… sure they work… but they’re not the big factor and money is better spent elsewhere.

personally, I run OEM shims on my street pads and no shims on my race pads… I’ve got insane brake ducts that bolt onto the caliper and fire air into the center of the rotor.

[Nikuk]

@theblue

they’re the “after you’ve done everything else” icing on the cake. the best thing you can probably do is remove the shields behind your front rotors… they trap a lot of heat. After that you want brake ducts… getting titanium shims is like buying those expensive lightweight lug nuts… sure they work… but they’re not the big factor and money is better spent elsewhere.

:word:

[Pauly]

The only function of the shims is to dampen the vibration between the pad and caliper that causes brake squeel.

[Harvey]

@theblue

they’re the “after you’ve done everything else” icing on the cake. the best thing you can probably do is remove the shields behind your front rotors… they trap a lot of heat. After that you want brake ducts… getting titanium shims is like buying those expensive lightweight lug nuts… sure they work… but they’re not the big factor and money is better spent elsewhere.

personally, I run OEM shims on my street pads and no shims on my race pads… I’ve got insane brake ducts that bolt onto the caliper and fire air into the center of the rotor.

I’ll take a look at ducting. Thanks

[Nikuk]

@Pauly

The only function of the shims is to dampen the vibration between the pad and caliper that causes brake squeel.

some alloy shims are marketed as a heat barrier between the pad plate & caliper, thereby keeping the fluid cooler.

[99_civic_si]

Step one, fuck hawk pads. Seriously look into something like porterfields or carbotechs (the list of good companies goes on and on). Step two, what do the wheels look like that you are running? Are they an open design to allow air in/out freely? If not, get new wheels. Step three (which you may want to do before step two) Ducting. Very helpful with heat.

[Harvey]

@theblue

the best thing you can probably do is remove the shields behind your front rotors… they trap a lot of heat.

I should have replied above, that this was done almost as soon as I got the car :wiggle:

@99_civic_si

Step one, fuck hawk pads. Seriously look into something like porterfields or carbotechs (the list of good companies goes on and on). Step two, what do the wheels look like that you are running? Are they an open design to allow air in/out freely? If not, get new wheels. Step three (which you may want to do before step two) Ducting. Very helpful with heat.

Is your rant based on experience? Have you used the DTC series of Hawk pads and had a bad experience? If you have experience to back it up, please tell me the story, otherwise ‘F’ this brand, get something else is not useful.

The wheels are stock BBS wheels. They are fairly open.

I may end up with shims and ducting.

[theblue]

DTC 70s are amazing pads, just serious money.

[Pauly]

@Nikuk

some alloy shims are marketed as a heat barrier between the pad plate & caliper, thereby keeping the fluid cooler.

wow learned something new. I would think the effect is extremely minimal. You’re talking alot of heat in a brake system

[Joe_Omerta]

what about a high temp thermal resistant paint for the caliper/bracket and such to help slow heat transfer to the fluid?

[Nikuk]

@Pauly

wow learned something new. I would think the effect is extremely minimal. You’re talking alot of heat in a brake system

hence…

@theblue

they’re the “after you’ve done everything else” icing on the cake… getting titanium shims is like buying those expensive lightweight lug nuts… sure they work… but they’re not the big factor and money is better spent elsewhere.

[99_civic_si]

@eesti

Is your rant based on experience? Have you used the DTC series of Hawk pads and had a bad experience? If you have experience to back it up, please tell me the story, otherwise ‘F’ this brand, get something else is not useful.

I haven’t used the DTC series, which I do hear great things about them, just hate the company now due to other pads being the suck in comparison to others based on experience. I read your post quick and automatically assumed you were referring to HP plus pads which I think are absolute trash.

To further help with your problem, I’m thinking ducting will be your answer.