Shop fall update

Nice welds, makes me want to learn so bad.

can you give me a ball park number on huw much will it cost to install a turbo?

Great work guys :tup:

But FYI for those that don’t know any better, front mounts on Z32s = :bloated:

Yea PITA…jsut curious y not larger Stillen replacements with the ducting…besides that the fact that they are overpriced…are they not efficient enough for you application

which ducting do you speak of?

http://www.stillen.com/product_images/405020.jpg
http://www.2kracing.com/images/airducts.jpg

ahhhhh i see, the customer wanted a custom FMIC…the customer got a custom FMIC…He eventually wants to run 600 whp

Hey, you gota give him what he wants. But he’s only hurting his efforts to get anywhere 500+ with an FMIC.

5 reasons not to put an FMIC on a Z. Z32 class is in session:

  1. If he wants to see anything around 500 he needs a dual intake. A single MAF won’t be able to handle it. What are his options for a dual intake with an FMIC? Slim to none. There are a few, but they relocate the filters to horrible locations (like the now vacant SMIC spots) where they’re exposed to everything. I’m sure once he figures that out, he’ll be back for a Hybrid custom dual intake setup… Have fun custom fabing that Nissan lovers :slight_smile:

  2. FMICs just kinda sit there… there isn’t any ducting that directs the air through the core. With SMICs, not only does the air flow much easier through the core in the stock location, but you can use the stock ducting or buy aftermarket ducting to further improve airflow. Also on this note, if you look at the factory design of the guards under the car, they create a low-pressure zone behind the core - so the air is first directed through the core by the duct then literally “pulled” and accelerated out though the back. With an FMIC the air goes… no where.

  3. The next most obvious of problems is cooling. Not only is the perfect intake location now blocked, but so is the radiator. Yeah it’s not totally blocked, but enough where you’re going to see problems (dyno and street proven.)

  4. Yet another problem is that FMIC cores are very long. The longer the core, the more pressuredrop you will experience as compared to a core of the same height and width. Given that most SMICs have appreciably more height in the core (most also have more width) and significantly less length to them, you are going to see very notable advantages when it comes to pressuredrop - the SMIC cores will beat the long narrow FMICs all day long in a comparison of inlet vs. outlet pressures.

  5. Now to the big problem - look at the design of it. The driver’s side throttlebody feeds the passenger bank of cylinders. This means that the driver’s turbo is driven by the driver’s bank of cylinders, but, the driver’s compressor feeds the passenger bank of cylinders.

This is done to create a balancing effect. As an example: If the driver’s wastegate actuator has more preload than the passenger turbo, it will be more inclined to produce a little more boost pressure than the passenger turbo. However, since the driver’s turbo feeds air into the passenger bank of cylinders, that additional pressure is going to make that side of the engine produce a little more power, which in turn, will cause the passenger turbo to spin a little harder and provide additional airflow to the driver’s bank of cylinders, thereby balancing the power output of the two banks.

A FMIC “crossflows”, meaning, the air flows through the intercooler from one side of the vehicle to the other, entering the opposing throttlebody, and returning into the cylinders on the original side. Now like I said, he’s going to need a dual intake setup and given that the passenger side of cylinders is operating completely independently of the driver’s bank, this is where the big problem comes into play. If the driver’s turbo is generating a little more boost than the passenger side, the ECU is doubling the airflow value for the driver’s bank, which is going to cause an overfueling issue for the engine as a whole since the passenger side isn’t flowing quite as much air. On the flip side, if the passenger side is flowing more air, it is going to cause the system to run lean as a whole… then kaboom.

just asking…nothing against you I would always goto you I was just curious…thats y asked if the Stealin’s werent efficient enough

Oh yeah thats ok, no offense taken whatsoever. He wanted a FMIC. I said ok. We made it he liked it. Pretty cut and dry.

Car ran well when completed, definately faster than stock.

The car will be run in speed density, MAFs are a restriction.

i count 5 reasons :stuck_out_tongue:

lol true. Fixed.

Well that’s even dumber than putting on a front mount! :stuck_out_tongue:

Yes, they are a restriction seeing as they can only meter enough air for around 500whp, but hardly enough of a problem to waste time trying to change the system to speed density.

With a MAF, all you need is a dual-intake setup (~$200) and an ECU reflash (~$200) or just buy tunning software for only ($600) and just click the box:

http://users.adelphia.net/~joshparr/images/zem.jpg

Why would you change to a complete stand-alone, have to do all that extra work installing and setting it up, have to pay for something like AEM EMS that’s going to cost you $2000 (not including what you guys would charge him to put it in) when the better / less expensive alternative is already in the car?

MAFs are more accurate and have less variability as environmental conditions change and heatsoak sets in.

Z’s have made far more power than one could put to the ground (1,000+whp) using an OEM MAS in a dual intake configuration. Greg Dupree is using a OEM MAS in a dual intake configuration and running 9’s.

And considering it is 3" diameter, although it has a screen mesh, it hasn’t proven to be a bottleneck. Initial restriction yes, bottleneck, no.

I’m not ripping on you Don, but either your customer needs to do some research into the car he owns or you need to let him know he’s going about things all wrong.

Hey, if he wants to go speed density and is willing to shell out all the thousands of dollars to have it done (and if you Z lovers over there really want to take on that task) then he’ll get it and you’ll make your money…

… but if he EVER does ANY research he’ll either be pissed that he spent all this cash and spent all that time for what he ended up with, OR he’ll be pissed that the shop he gave all his money to didn’t tell him there was a cheaper, better way to do things.

Josh I understand what you are saying and I appreciate your insight. I have a complete and thorough knowledge of fuel injection and how it and its system components work. Thanks.

I will discuss all of his options with him throughly before going forward. I am not worried about fabricating anything that this car will need to work with in its constraints I have a great fabricator.

Speed density is not a difficult system to work within nor setup on the car. We are very reasonable when it comes to installing AEM EMS…How can you justify charging hours to unplug an ECU and plug another one in. :stuck_out_tongue: Adding a MAP sensor is easy as is setting up a base tune. You make it sound like I’m out to rip off my customers…I do not appreciate that at all.

I have no problem working on Z32’s or Z33’s, actually Im becoming quite fond of them thank you. Same goes for R32’s and R33 Skylines. Pulled an engine from another skyline last night in fact in no time. Swapped 240s maybe I’ll try it again some day, doubt it but who knows.

I appreciate the constructive criticism. Thank you.

pics?

:stuck_out_tongue:

Pics as by request from newman

http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f279/Hybriddon/work/DSC01213.jpg

http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f279/Hybriddon/work/DSC01212.jpg

newman you should have sat on the shifter you tight ass with girls pants…

LMAO. Don if it’s cool with you guys I’ll be stopping by this next friday with a present.

Oh yeah, and MAP > MAF.

Yeah its cool. See you soon. Newman should have taken the shifter it would have been like the dude with the horse :stuck_out_tongue: UUUUUGGGGGHHHHHHHHHHHH

you got your hands all dirrrrty!! and that outfit is much more fitting! (lol i did like the bullet belt though… :tup: to hybrid connection(s) (=>) rocken out like woah!

i better be helping out putting the skyline back together or else… =/-