The 2014 Camaro Looks Better...

[9c1ny]

@joelster

$75k is insane. I was figuring the car would be right around the ZL-1 base price, or just a touch more ($55k-$60k). You could have 2 of my cars and some change left over. The Z/28 is sweet, but the sum of the parts just doesn’t add up to me.

Well price out a 1LE, a crate LS7, upgraded brakes ect ect, it gets $$$$ fast, plus to have a low production collector car, look at what the 427 Converts MSRP for and what they can be had for, I think once the initial frenzy dies down you will be able to pick up a new or sub 5k mile Z28 for $55-$60k

[Jeller]

@joelster

It used to be a working mans Corvette. In every generation 1st-4th it commanded a premium price over the base Camaro, but it was easily attainable on a blue collar budget. Now it’s $25k more than a base Corvette. The sad thing is that a base Corvette will probably hang with it on a racetrack (460hp and 32xxlbs versus 505hp and 38xxlbs), and a Corvette with the Z51 package will beat it handily.

Extactly what I meant just explained better :tup:

[fairgentleman_Z]

… and why wouldn’t the 1LE be considered “the working man’s Corvette”?

@ 3:01.5 it is faster than a C6 Z51 @ 3:03.6 and .4 slower than a C6 Z06 @ 3:01.1 .

[BigRon]

@9c1ny

I think once the initial frenzy dies down you will be able to pick up a new or sub 5k mile Z28 for $55-$60k

Not sure what the production numbers will be, but if they keep it limited like the Boss Luguna Seca they will be snatched up and collected.

Interesting that the track focused stripped down Camaro is more expensive the the higher hp ZL1.
Compared to the Boss/Laguna Seca vs GT500. Granted the Boss has a similar engine to the GT vs dropping the 427 into the Camaro.

[joelster]

@9c1ny

Well price out a 1LE, a crate LS7, upgraded brakes ect ect, it gets $$$$ fast, plus to have a low production collector car, look at what the 427 Converts MSRP for and what they can be had for, I think once the initial frenzy dies down you will be able to pick up a new or sub 5k mile Z28 for $55-$60k

An LS3 is $8600, an LS7 is $14,xxx so a $6k difference. The brakes would be an easy $4k-$6k price jump. Wheels would be a wash. My car has 20x10 and 20x11, the Z/28 has 19". Probably costs GM the same to make either wheel. Sway bars are different, but probably a negligible price difference. Shocks would be more for the Z/28, but the 1LE comes with sweet monotube shocks. A lighter battery might run an extra $100 versus a regular battery. The glass is slightly thinner, might cost more $$$$$ to produce.

My point is production cost is probably not much more to make a car, yet it’s $35k-$40k more. Fuck that. If they’d price it accordingly, there would be a line out the door, and they’d be looking into ways to ramp up the supply in a big way. Exclusivity means shit to me. I buy a car to drive and enjoy it. It sucks that there are probably a lot of guys like me, who have the loyalty, desire, and means to purchase the car IF it were priced right, but the company is greedy, and priced it WAY out of line.

[fairgentleman_Z]

@joelster

An LS3 is $8600, an LS7 is $14,xxx so a $6k difference. The brakes would be an easy $4k-$6k price jump.

Definitely some mark up after jumping into the GM parts bin, but your estimates are low.

Small Block, Big Block and Sealed Crate Engines | Chevy Performance

MSRP for LS3 is $7,761, LS7 is $17,129, that’s a difference of $9,500 ish.

• different accessories, radiator?

http://www.superchevyperformance.com/category_s/190.htm?searching=Y&sort=2&cat=190&show=10&page=1
I’m assuming the carbon ceramic brakes are similar to the ZR1
ZR1 brake rotors list at $2,408… each. That’s $9,600 ish
ZR1 calipers are $841 front, $635 rear. That’s $2,900 ish
So $12,500 ish total

http://www.superchevyperformance.com/category_s/205.htm
1LE brakes (same as SS) list at $5,600

So $6,900 + difference if needing pads or master cylinder to go with those parts

And then add on the aero mods to suck down rainbows

Seats, spoilers, diffusers, Z/28 badges and stitching, slight disruption to production line/training/tooling… different programming for any traction/stability control logic? Salary for R&D staff man hours, trip to Nürburg, EPA car, NHSTA car(s), all for a small production run.

[2TurboZ]

Why are you still arguing about a car 99% of the people on here could never/would never own?

[Deathproof]

The 2015 mustang gt performance package will be faster around a track than the boss302s. I wonder how they will stack up against the z28 seeing as they aren’t even limited production.

[joelster]

@fairgentleman Z

Definitely some mark up after jumping into the GM parts bin, but your estimates are low.

Small Block, Big Block and Sealed Crate Engines | Chevy Performance
MSRP for LS3 is $7,761, LS7 is $17,129, that’s a difference of $9,500 ish.

• different accessories, radiator?

http://www.superchevyperformance.com/category_s/190.htm?searching=Y&sort=2&cat=190&show=10&page=1
I’m assuming the carbon ceramic brakes are similar to the ZR1
ZR1 brake rotors list at $2,408… each. That’s $9,600 ish
ZR1 calipers are $841 front, $635 rear. That’s $2,900 ish
So $12,500 ish total

http://www.superchevyperformance.com/category_s/205.htm
1LE brakes (same as SS) list at $5,600

So $6,900 + difference if needing pads or master cylinder to go with those parts

And then add on the aero mods to suck down rainbows

Seats, spoilers, diffusers, Z/28 badges and stitching, slight disruption to production line/training/tooling… different programming for any traction/stability control logic? Salary for R&D staff man hours, trip to Nürburg, EPA car, NHSTA car(s), all for a small production run.

LS3= $8567.97

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/nal-19301360/overview/

LS7= $14099.97

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/nal-19244098/overview/

$5500 difference. Whatever, the Z/28 doesn’t have $40k worth of more stuff on it. The 1LE and ZL-1 stuff is worth some coin too.

[LZ1]

@2TurboZ

Why are you still arguing about a car 99% of the people on here could never/would never own?

Should we be fighting about what constitutes a dysfunctional relationship instead? lol

[9c1ny]

@BigRon

Not sure what the production numbers will be, but if they keep it limited like the Boss Luguna Seca they will be snatched up and collected.

Interesting that the track focused stripped down Camaro is more expensive the the higher hp ZL1.
Compared to the Boss/Laguna Seca vs GT500. Granted the Boss has a similar engine to the GT vs dropping the 427 into the Camaro.

I’m hearing 500 this year and 1000 next

[articzap]

…

@Big Boss"

(Motor Authority)

2014 Chevrolet Camaro Z/28 Is The Real Track-Focused Deal: First Ride

Chevrolet told us…

We were told that the automaker would only bring back the Z/28 moniker if there was a car that warranted the badge. You can’t simply slap together a few performance bits, gather some marketing folk to drum up a cliche-laden press release, and then shove a poorly thought out machine down the throats of the waiting Bow Tie-brand fans.

No, General Motors knows they need to deliver something special with a modern Camaro Z/28. The world wants to know if they’ve done that… and the answer is holy hell yes.

They have.

Let’s get something straight right from the outset. Chevrolet hasn’t created a daily driver dream machine. Unless of course, your preferred dream consists of a race-derived dynamic spool suspension system, no air conditioning, massive carbon ceramic brakes, and R compound barely legal street tires. Wait, this is Motor Authority, right? Then that is exactly what you’ve been dreaming about.

The boffins at Chevy want us to know that this is a track-focused machine, which happens to be street legal and can therefore be driven to and from the track. If you glance really quickly, you might think you’re looking at your average Camaro that’s wearing a few basic body modifications. Look again, look harder, and look longer. All of the body bits you see on the car create downforce. So much, in fact, that the Z/28 creates an additional 400 pounds of downforce compared to the Camaro SS. This happens thanks to the massive front splitter, the heat extractor in the hood, the side sills, and large rear spoiler. Additionally, there are underbody aero bits that also work to keep the car glued to the road.

Chevrolet knew they wanted to make this a lightweight dancing queen. That’s why the automaker opted for the LS7 instead of the LSA. It’s a 7.0-liter V-8 engine that producer 505 horsepower and 481 pound-feet of torque, and it also happens to be 63 pounds lighter than the LSA. A majority of that torque is available between 1,250 rpm and 2,000 rpm, with peak torque occurring up at 4,800 rpm. Peak horsepower is produced at 6,100 rpm.

It’s not just the motor that makes with the magic, however, as Chevy engineers were focused on making the Z/28 a well-rounded track machine. This means they had to pay serious attention to the brakes, suspension, and tires. Not only did they pay attention, but they turned to companies with expert knowledge on these subjects for help. For example, Brembo supplies the standard carbon ceramic brakes. Up front sit a pair of massive 15.5-inch rotors with six-piston calipers, while the rear units are 15.3-inch rotors clamped down upon by four-piston calipers.

For the rubber that meets the road, Chevrolet turned to Pirelli. What Pirelli came back with are the largest front tires ever fitted to a production car. The Camaro Z/28 wears 305/30-ZR19 Pirelli Trofeo R tires at each corner, which basically means that Chevy has brought a rubber gun to a rubber knife fight. Some might see this as cheating, but we think it’s picking the best tool for the task at hand… which is creating a wickedly fast track assassin.
Even more impressive than the brakes and tires, however, is the suspension setup. It’s clear that Chevrolet went above the call of duty by turning to Brembo and Pirelli for braking and tire needs. When it comes to the suspension though, the automaker has soared above the call of duty and is now forging new ground in the production car world. Chevy teamed up with a company by the name of Multimatic to develop the ride and handling of the Z28. Does that name not ring a bell? Well, it should because Multimatic created a new suspension system back in 2002 that has taken the motorsports world by storm.

It’s called the Dynamic Suspension Spool Valve system, or DSSV for short, and it allows engineers to produce the exact amount of compression and rebound predictability, repeatability, and accuracy that a given car needs. The system works so well that many racing teams have adopted the technology. We’re not talking about LeMons or ChumpCar teams here.

A number of the top Formula One teams rely on this technology, including Red Bull Racing, which means the Multimatic system could claim a part of the 2008, 2010, 2011, 2012, and (most likely) the 2013 F1 Constructor’s Championship. There are also many LMP teams running the system, with 20 of the 56 entries for the 24 Hours of Le Mans utilizing DSSV dampers.

The only other production car ever to take advantage of this setup was the Aston Martin One-77. That’s an ultra-exclusive hyper car costing well over one million bucks. Now, it’s the standard suspension setup of the Camaro Z/28. Chevrolet isn’t messing around here.
Multimatic is hoping that Chevrolet helps bring the DSSV damper system to a wider audience and it should once you dive a bit deeper into what it can do. According to Multimatic, when an automaker designs a damper system for a car, they want to be able to repeat their initial results with a 10 percent margin of error across production. On the other end of the scale, F1 teams need that margin of error down to just a half a percent. The Z/28 rings in at two percent.

This car is officially dialed in.

The Camaro Z/28 can easily and comfortably exceed 1g in corners. It can accelerate hard thanks to both its engine and its extensive weight savings over the standard Camaro SS. It can also run harder into corners and then brake later before applying clipping the apex and getting back on the power. This all helps add up to the potential for some seriously fast lap times. It also makes one hell of a noise.

But what does all of this actually mean? It means that the 2014 Chevrolet Camaro Z/28 isn’t aiming to take on the likes of the Ford Mustang, it’s forever nemesis. The Z/28 wipes the floor with every current Mustang you can buy. Yes… even the Boss 302 Laguna Seca. Chevrolet ran a handful of Mustang and Camaro variants at its own Milford Proving Grounds Road Course, which mimics a number of turns from well known racetracks like the Nuburgring, and Spring Mountain Motorsports Ranch. Their drivers were told not to hold back, and we’ll hold them to their word on this one. Here are the results:

2013 Ford Mustang GT500: 1:59.97
2012 Ford Mustang Boss 302 Laguna Seca: 1:59.05
2014 Camaro 1LE: 1:58:85
2012 Camaro ZL1: 1:56.58

2014 Camaro Z/28: 1:53.71

Now, we’ll reiterate that this was a home game for Chevy. The Milford Proving Grounds are where performance Bow Ties are born, breed, and educated. The deck is stacked in favor of the Z/28. To appease that argument, Chevrolet also boxed up the Camaro and shipped it to Germany. More specifically, the automaker and some of its finest drivers jumped in the good seat to set times at the Nurburgring. The fastest lap the Z/28 was able to run was a very impressive 7:37.40, which was enough to beat the times of the Porsche 911 and the Lamborghini Murcielago. Oh… and it was raining when Adam Dean laid down his fast video run.

The folks at GM tell us the unofficial fastest time set in the dry is in the 7:31 range. They can’t come out and claim that, of course, because a 'Ring-Based gentleman’s agreement says that it has to show up on video. So, the Chevy team plans to go back and get the time they feel the car deserves and is capable of hitting… with video proof.

Of course, a package like this won’t come cheap. The ZL1 is now the second most expensive street-legal production Camaro. The Z/28 will slot above it in the price department. That’s fine, since it slots above it in the overall performance department as well. Still, you’re losing a few amenities you might be used to. Air conditioning is the only available optional extra. If you check that box, you also add in all of the extra speakers that Chevy took out, minus the one they left per the federal mandate for the chime that lets you know the door is open.

Chevrolet themselves have stated that this is a car they want purchased by people who are going to drive it hard on the racetrack. The automaker knows a few will be socked away by folks looking to get rich at Barrett-Jackson 2050, but that’s not why this car has been created. The volume is low, with expected production to be in the 3,000 to 4,000 range over the course of two years. Chevy wants the majority of those buyers to be men and women looking to put a hardcore track machine in their garage, which can also be driven to and from the course.

For years now, the Camaro has been sort of falling by the wayside as the Ford Mustang progresses down the path from Pony Car to bonafide world-class sports car. Now though, it seems the Camaro has not only caught up… but blazed a path for both machines to follow. As they compete with each other, they will find new foes to battle from Germany and Japan…

The American Sports Car, led by the Camaro Z/28, has just declared a round of thermonuclear global war…

…would you like to play a game?

@Big Boss"

(Road & Track)

Mercedes-AMG C190 to get high tech suspension … from the Z/28?
Upcoming baby SLS; will share Multimatic dampers with the Z/28.

What do Red Bull F1 cars, all 77 Aston Martin One-77s, the 2014 Camaro Z/28, and 20 of this year’s 56 Le Mans entries have in common? They all use a relatively new damper design from a company called Multimatic. Now, add AMG’s next solo project to that list.

The Mercedes C190—that’s its internal code name; you can call it SLC or baby SLS—is AMG’s follow-up to the SLS. It’s a small sports car aimed at the 911. And, as the list above suggests, it’s going to have a pretty serious suspension. Canadian OEM supplier Multimatic has been putting its Dynamic Suspension Spool Valve (DSSV) dampers on race cars for a while, and it recently hit on a new manufacturing process that brings down the time and expense required to machine the special spool valves. The solution came from a company that laser-cuts medical devices, incidentally.

That means more applications on “affordable” road cars like the Z/28 and the Mercedes-AMG coupe. The spool valve replaces the shims in a conventional damper, providing better consistency damper to damper, more precise control of the force-velocity curve, and repeatability from impact to impact. No worries about the orifice changing shape over time. The other cool part: The use of two spool valves per damper completely decouples the compression and rebound curves, so they can be tuned independently.While I’ve never even touched a One-77, after a ride in Chevy’s track-aimed Camaro, I can say that this suspension works incredibly well. The key is that a driver can hammer on a car for lap after lap of a track like the Nürburgring with the added confidence that the suspension will react the same way every time, just how the engineers intended. And we can infer that the little AMG that’ll wear these dampers should be as track-focused as the other metal on that list. It’s a good sign, anyway, and a signal that there are probably more DSSV applications to come.

[05OrangeSS]

More…

[articzap]

…

@Big Boss"

(When car companies want to show what their cars can do, they ship them to Germany’s famed Nurburgring. Rain kept parts of the road damp, but even with that, the Z/28 lapped the track in 7:37.40. That’s 4 seconds faster than the ZL1 and faster than the published times for the Porsche 911 Carrera S and the Lamborghini Murcielago LP640. The Z/28 logged over 1,000 miles around The 'Ring and knocked down much faster unofficial laps in the dry, like over 6 seconds faster. Still, the official time is quite impressive and GM plans on returning to Germany to make the unofficial times official.)

(We got to ride along in the new Z/28 at GM’s Milford Proving Grounds road course and we were amazed with how the car stuck to the pavement. Even more impressive was how deep the drivers could go into the corners before slamming on the brakes.)

(The Z/28 has a ton of aero tricks up its proverbial sleeve. The front splitter is super strong and capable of generating 250 pounds of downforce; while Gurney flaps and a belly pan help further control air movement.)

(The Z/28 is the only GM car, and we think one of the only production cars, to run 305mm-wide tires up front. To save weight, GM also shrunk the wheel diameter to 19 inches. Since the Camaro was designed around a 20-inch wheel, this created a larger-than-optimal tire-to-fender gap. The way to fix this and keep the tires from sticking out past the fenders, was to add fender lips. We imagine these will be big sellers in the aftermarket.)

(The rear spoiler is unique to the Z/28 and helps the car produce 440 more pounds of downforce than the SS (at 150 mph).)

(The Z/28’s dry-sump LS7 is almost 64 pounds lighter than the supercharged LSA engine in the ZL1, and while it makes around 75 hp less, the weight savings result in improved weight balance. The 427 puts out 481 lb-ft of torque and features internal upgrades like Mahle pistons and Pankl-coated titanium connection rods. To feed the 7-liter engine, there’s a high-flow airbox equipped with a K&N filter.)

(While the ZL1 showcased magnetic ride control, the Z/28 took a more analog approach. Each corner of the new Camaro supercar features Multimatic Dynamic Suspension Spool Valve (DSSV) dampers. Fielded for years in the F1 and Le Mans racing world, this is the first time they’ve been made available in a volume production road car.)

(While the ZL1 was given drag race considerations, the Z/28 was molded as a pure track car. One nod to this single-mindedness is the Torsen helical limited-slip differential. This little piece of engineering cut 0.7 seconds per lap off the Milford road course times. It offers improved ABS functions during cornering and more traction on corner exit. The downside is that it’s not as robust for drag racing, but then again, that’s why they sell the COPO.)

(The carbon-ceramic Brembo brakes found on the ZR1 Corvette were tweaked and mounted to the Camaro. They help shed a ton of rotating weight, but more importantly they offer amazing, fade-free braking performance. They are also one of the reasons why the Z/28 will have a sticker price higher than the ZL1.)

(The Z/28 fields some of the best rubber out there; DOT-legal 305/30-19 Pirelli P Zero Trofeo R on all four corners. The asymmetric tires carry a super sticky 60 treadwear, and replacements will set you back around $550 each.)
2014 Chevy Camaro Z/28 - The Slash Is Back

The Z/28 badge started life as just a lowly Regular Production Order (RPO) code, but has since grown into a symbol of handling prowess. First fielded by GM in 1967, it really made a name for itself in 1969 when it threw down hard in Trans-Am racing. Since then, it’s always been associated with Camaros that had just “a bit more” in the handling department. Over time, the awesomeness of the Z28 package was diluted, but what the badge stood for was always remembered. How that badge presented itself on the car also changed over time. It started life with a slash, but then lost it with the introduction of the second-generation Camaro. Sadly, the Z28 faded away along with the Camaro in 2002.

Ever since GM re-launched the Camaro in 2010, fans have speculated on when The General would churn out a new batch of Z28s. In fact, Vegas oddsmakers had the ZL1 pegged to be the Z28 replacement, but it wasn’t so. GM teased but kept touting the corporate line that the Z28 badge deserved a really special Camaro to earn that bit of heritage. Well, it seems that GM finally decided they had a Camaro worthy of the badge, and this time around it was even going old-school by re-introducing the slash.
Yep, the Z/28 is back, and it’s officially the best-handling Camaro ever to pound asphalt on planet Earth. It also further solidifies the Camaro’s standing as the best-handling modern muscle car out there.

To achieve this, GM’s engineers decided to leave the dragstrip action to the COPO Camaro and instead focus solely on handling capability. They wanted the Z/28 to be a street car but one that was road course ready right out of the gate. As such, they adopted a mantra of, “If it slows down the car, ditch it, and if it lowers the lap time, keep it.” Everything in the Z/28 program is about faster lap times, and for the most part, the design team didn’t care what it cost. Multimatic DSSV shocks, Brembo carbon-ceramic brakes, Pankl-coated titanium rods, Recaro seats, Pirelli track tires, and Torsen helical differential are just some of the high-end parts that work to make the Z/28 king of the road course. This isn’t a car in search of a cushy ride and creature comforts. The front springs are 85 percent stiffer while the rears are 65 percent stiffer than what’s offered on an SS. Trailing link and arm bushings are stiffer as well, with the rear upper control arm bushings coming in at 400 percent stiffer. In turn, both the front and rear stabilizer bars are a touch smaller and tuned to match the reduced rebound travel of the new suspension.

Thinner rear glass, a free-flowing exhaust, belly pans, unique aero components, and the list goes on. Over 190 unique parts were used to separate the Z/28 from a 2014 1SS Camaro, and every one of those parts works in concert to make this Camaro more than worthy of the name Z/28.

[Jeller]

Makes the 1LE look like a pretty good deal. That front lip is huuuuuge and so are those front tires :eek:

[Gus]

Wow. I can’t wait to see what the next 5 years has in store for this Mustang/Camaro battle

[Onyx_Z32]

I’m sure this “flowtie” mod will be something regular Camaro guys do as well:

Chevy’s iconic moniker was doing a disservice to air flow; it was displacing air away from the radiator. In a track-ready car like the Z/28, taking cool air away from the engine is never a good thing.

Quinn then proceeded to cut out the gold contents of the bowtie resting on the Z/28’s grill, leaving only the silver outline. Upon reinstalling the homemade prototype on the grille, he tried out the car again.

The results were a win. Affectionally referred to as the “Flowtie” by the engineering team, the hallowed out bowtie added just enough airflow to the engine to cool it by a staggering 2 degrees during track sessions. Those 2 degrees were just enough to mandate the modified bowtie on all Z/28 Camaros.

Camaro Z/28 Wears Modified Bowtie For Better Flow

[joelster]

Let me bust out my hammer on mine!

[BigRon]

Just saw my first flowtie in the garage today. Impressive looking vehicle. If it is there tomorrow I will grab a photo.

[Onyx_Z32]

Good at passing on double yellow: