Why is it called Silver "Carbon" Fiber when it's not?

All over the place “Silver Carbon Fiber” parts are popping up…
But that’s like calling steel rims painted silver “Silver Aluminum Rims”…

“Silver Carbon Fibre”/Fiber is aluminized GLASS fibers… in other words… Fiber Glass with an aluminum powder coating that does not contain any carbon fibers at all…

It’s a product that is called “Texalium”, it has no carbon in it unless you count the epoxy that holds it together…

One thing you should also be aware of is that Texalium doesn’t just come in silver, it also comes in “graphite black”… I wonder how many of those cheap no-name/chinese ‘carbon fiber hoods’ you see on ebay and knock-off performance parts sites are actually just black fiber glass…

http://www.sollercomposites.com/silver-texalium.jpg

http://www.thezstore.com/store/graphics/00000001/large102083.jpg

i don’t know enough about this to discuss it but i did a bit of looking in to this recently and read in several places that the weight and strength benefits of carbon fiber are still present in this texalium/fiber-glass concoction

that may or may not be accurate… just what i read ;]

Looks like its also the same price.

I think the bolded sentence below might shed some light?

This is a very unique and new hybrid utilizing a new fabric called Hexcel Texalium. It is a high performance fiberglass twill weave coated with 99.99% pure aluminum that is 200 Angstroms thick (1 billionth of a meter). It has a very reflective silver color (hard to show it’s brilliance in the photo).

These rigid sheets are a hybrid laminate stack of carbon underneath the Texalium, providing a surprisingly attractive silver/silver colored surface with the same strengths (and same price!) as our other Carbon Fiber sheets.

Silver Sheet: $12.95
http://www.robotmarketplace.com/products/WCC-THT0151108s.html

Black Sheet: $12.95
http://www.robotmarketplace.com/products/WCC-T0151108.html

According to the manufacturer’s website Texalium falls under the same strength attributes category as regular fiber glass.

So the company itself doesn’t claim it is superior over fiber GLASS let alone even attempt to imply it’s as strong as carbon fiber.

Mind linking to your sources?

Hexcel is the company that created it…
http://www.hexcel.com/NR/rdonlyres/B31737B1-AD62-456C-953D-0B34A72EA2F0/0/HexcelIndustrialprepregsandfabricsselectorguide.pdf

In this case the company supplying is offering a layered product which does not mean that is the norm and it also shows that the Texalium itself would not be considered strong enough on it’s own.

read my second post… it has some links and a description.

the silver carbon also includes layers of “real” carbon underneath the taxalium…

it not any sort of reputable source, its just some company who sells it. first hit in google for “silver carbon fiber” :wink:

I’m not saying that Texalium is junk, what I’m saying is that calling it “silver carbon fiber” is misleading since it’s not carbon fiber.

I completely agree, I’m curious to get to the bottom of this also…

At this point from what I’ve seen I’m still thinking that whenever someone says “Silver Carbon Fiber” they are referring to the taxalium/CF-hybrid product which I pasted above - but you are right in saying that the texalium itself is not a replacement for carbon fiber.

And you’re probably right in saying that some people do use this as a tactic to mislead customers.

Bing sells some silver carbon fiber products - maybe he can shed some light on this for us.

//edit// to bing: sorry for the wonderful timing in which i chose to bring you in to this thread… it wasn’t on purpose haha

i buy my CF from companies who sell the ‘end of the roll’ so to speak off larger volumes of CF mat.

i get whatever it is they give me and am told that it is CF.

since it is pretty much entirely aesthetic (most products in the industry made from CF) who really cares anyways?

this is a semantic arguement with no useful conclusions to be drawn regardless of determination.

max and I obviously care :slight_smile:

it’s interesting to know what’s out there and available to us… at least for me.

Calling it something it isn’t and then saying “no really” doesn’t make it so…
Otherwise I guess I now have authentic BBS winter rims for my Sentra thanks to my “silver” sharpie!

Anyway the problem is not just with the people selling the parts, it’s apparent now that the suppliers are misleading the dealers as well, as bing pointed out.

So like always, Buyer Beware!

umm… they are only misleading the dealers if they are actually lieing.

just because you have acknowledged that some supposed silver CF is in fact not entirely CF doesnt mean that all CF matt that is coloured silver is in fact not CF.

If you are right though, what is the case with red cf and blue and yellow and green CF?

are they all different kinds of material made from fibreglass and other additives?

perhaps red CF contains strawberries and human blood? Green CF actually contains partially-photosynthesized plant life?

They are usually refered to as “Carbon/Kevlar” because the weave is a mix of carbon and kevlar strands. That’s why they are never a solid color and usually more like a pattern.

http://www.geminicomposites.com/carbonhoods.html has good pictures on the side that illustrate this.

Or the Seibon “Carbon Kevlar Bucket Seat”

Kevlar is a fabric so it can be coloured, carbon is an element, if the colour isn’t just painted on the outside then it means the carbon has been filled with impurities and the product will not act like carbon fibre any longer…

Also if you paint the carbon and then seal it in the epoxy it means that you have to hope that the paint doesn’t lift off the weave, once again it would ruin the actual benefits of carbon fiber…

http://www.carbon-fiber-products.com/TunerzImage-NewPix/Seibon/SBN-RS-KVLR-CF-2.jpg

I think it should also be pointed out that most hoods etc have a fiber glass structure with a carbon fiber layer over top. To make it pure carbon fiber would make it very expensive so it’s never done outside of race teams or high end products. The carbon fibre layer helps make the the part much stronger than if it was purely fibre glass.

This is also why it’s VERY unlikely that beneath these Texalium “silver carbon fiber” parts is a carbon fibre core…
So basically you’re buying a fully fiber glass part rather than a fiber glass part reinforced with true carbon fiber…

they are probably lying yes, but to assume that because it’s cost benifical that everyone just lies and none of them contain any real carbon fibre structure is just as bad…

but you definitely want to investigate before putting out your cash, so you know your getting what u wanted

First read up about wet carbon and dry carbon, your worried about the strength right. but almost every single piece of carbon fiber sold in the car world is wet carbon which has very little in common with the strengths and properties of dry carbon. most things are fiberglass covered with carbon.

So what difference does it make if it’s wet carbon, silver carbon, or fiberglass if its all the same in the end minus the looks.

http://www.seiboncarbon.com/faq.asp

Q. Are your products made with 100% carbon fiber?
A. The “carbon fiber” material is just a piece of cloth. You can’t make any shape out of it without some kind of support. We use fiberglass backing to construct the skeleton.

Q. What are the pros and cons between “dry carbon” and “wet carbon” ?
A. Dry vs. wet involves completely different processes of manufacturing. You can find extensive articles about the details on the web if you do a general search. As for pros and cons, here is a brief summary: Simply put, with dry carbon, you get the most strength and save the most weight. The weaves and quality are more consistent, but they are generally 3 to 4 times more expensive than wet carbon. Wet carbon products are hand-laid, and are more prone to small defects like wavy weaves and tiny bubbles. They do not save as much weight as their dry carbon counterparts. But on the plus side, you get an incredible combination of visual attraction, weight-deduction, and most importantly, price. All products you see on our website are wet carbon. Wet carbon products are also the most popular and most commonly referred to as just “carbon fiber”

From password jdm.

The two main processes of producing carbon products are Wet Carbon and Dry Carbon. The real difference is that Dry carbon is more than just the bling that’s been served up in the industry for the last ten or so years.

Dry Carbon is functional, ultra light weight, and is truly how carbon fiber products were meant to be made. Obtaining maximum weight reduction and superior strength are some of the advantages of Dry carbon. The cost is a lot more, but it’s well worth it for us.

As for Wet carbon, it’s all bling, very minimal in strength, relatively heavy and PLAYED OUT! PasswordJDM is proud to be the first in the industry to offer Dry Carbon.

i like this nowcage fellow he speaks the truth lol carbon fiber is what they use in the army and airplanes what is sold to to you bing is not real cf i know because i get my materials from the same place as your supplier , but it still looks nice I’ve seen “carbon fiber” hoods snap before real cf wouldn’t break so easy .