Well I wish I was civilized like you guys and just took it in the ass but, I am not.
I understand the point you two are getting at and i completely agree with it. Civilized people would engage in a point counterpoint debate with their elected leaders and hopefully both parties would learn something. Im not saying that they would have to make any headway towards agreeing with eachother, but it could be a learning experience for both. But even someone who vehemently denies any sort of conspiracy is ever taking place within government, must admit that special interests and politicians funded by corporations have all but taken over. As Noam Chomsky put it, we no longer have a republic, we have a pollyocracy (sp?) governemnt run by bussines. The people do have a reason to be pissed off. No longer do the politicians work for the people. At the time of this countries beginning, our founders, Ben Franklin especially, were disguested with the way people were elected into office in England. In england, political positions of power payed very handsomely, and the men running for those positions would do almost anything to gain a seat. Benjamin Franklin said something like, money and power both corrupt, but when you mix the two, the most evil men are put into power. It didnt go exactly like that but you get the idea. George washington willingly declined his $7,000 a year salary and worked as president for free, yes i realize he was wealthy and had a huge plantation, but today our elected leaders would gladly take both.
So what Im getting at is whether or not these people have any clue what they are talking about, why should they be respectable towards their elected leaders when their elected leaders basically view them as parasites.
Ahh nyspeed politics. Facts be damned! I’m arguing here!
well put
Wow a blue car! Loud noises!
Well in that case I will post one of my bogus emails received. 
[INDENT][INDENT]July 23, 2009
HR 3200, the House Version of the Health Care Bill:
Larry Schweikart
Take a look at what actually is in the Health Care bill. Obama makes disingenuous comments like “You’ll still keep your doctor” or “You’ll keep your existing health care.” He is either lying to us or he has no idea what is in it.
You can read the [full bill](http://frwebgate.access.gpo.gov/cgi-bin/getdoc.cgi?dbname1_cong_bills&docid=f:h3200ih.pdf), or look at some of the highlights here:
[/INDENT]
[/INDENT]Pg 30 Sec 123 of HC bill – a Government committee (good luck with that!) will decide what treatments/benefits a person may receive.
Pg 29 lines 4-16 in the HC bill - YOUR HEALTHCARE WILL BE RATIONED! (We all knew this because health care is rationed in Canada and Britain, but Obama kept saying it would not be.)
Pg 42 of HC Bill – The Health Choices Commissioner will choose your HC Benefits for you. You will have no choice!
Pg 50 Section 152 in HC bill - HC will be provided to ALL non US citizens, illegal or otherwise.
Pg 58 HC Bill – Government will have real-time access to individual’s finances and a National ID Healthcard will be issued!
Pg 59 HC Bill lines 21-24 Government will have direct access to your bank accts for election funds transfer
Pg 65 Sec 164 is a payoff subsidized plan for retirees and their families in Unions & community organizations (read: ACORN).
Pg 72 Lines 8-14 Government will create an HC Exchange to bring private HC plans under Government control.
Pg 84 Sec 203 HC bill - Government mandates ALL benefit packages for private HC plans in the Exchange.
Pg 85 Line 7 HC Bill - Specifics of Benefit Levels for Plans = The Government will ration your Healthcare! If socialized medicine is such a wonderful deal, why do Canadians as well as other foreigners come here for treatment?
Pg 91 Lines 4-7 HC Bill - Government mandates linguistic appropriate services. E.g. Translation services for illegal aliens.
Pg 95 HC Bill Lines 8-18 The Government will use groups, i.e. ACORN & Americorps, to sign up individuals for Government HC plan.
Pg 85 Line 7 HC Bill - Specifics of Benefit Levels for Plans. AARP members - your Health care WILL be rationed.
Pg 102 Lines 12-18 HC Bill - Medicaid Eligible Individuals will be automatically enrolled in Medicaid. No choice.
Pg 124 lines 24-25 HC No company can sue Government on price fixing. No “judicial review” against Government Monopoly.
Pg 127 Lines 1-16 HC Bill - Doctors/ AMA - The Government will tell YOU what you can earn.
Pg 145 Line 15-17 An Employer MUST auto enroll employees into public option plan. NO CHOICE.
Pg 126 Lines 22-25 Employers MUST pay for HC for part time employees AND their families.
Pg 149 Lines 16-24 ANY Employer with payroll $400k & above who does not provide public option pays 8% tax on all payroll.
Pg 150 Lines 9-13 Businesses with payroll between $251k & $400k who don’t provide public option will pay 2-6% tax on all payroll.
Pg 167 Lines 18-23 ANY individual who doesn’t have acceptable HC according to Government will be taxed 2.5% of income.
Pg 170 Lines 1-3 HC Bill Any NONRESIDENT Alien is exempt from individual taxes. (Americans will pay.)
Pg 195 HC Bill -officers & employees of HC Admin (the GOVERNMENT) will have access to ALL Americans’ finances and personal records.
Pg 203 Line 14-15 HC - “The tax imposed under this section shall not be treated as tax” Yes, it says that.
Pg 239 Line 14-24 HC Bill Government will reduce physician services for Medicaid. Seniors, low income, poor affected.
Pg 241 Line 6-8 HC Bill – Doctors – doesn’t matter what specialty – will all be paid the same.
Pg 253 Line 10-18 Government sets value of Doctor’s time, professional judgment, etc. Literally, value of humans.
Pg 265 Sec 1131Government mandates & controls productivity for private HC industries.
Pg 268 Sec 1141 Federal Government regulates rental & purchase of power driven wheelchairs.
Pg 272 SEC. 1145. TREATMENT OF CERTAIN CANCER HOSPITALS - Cancer patients - welcome to rationing!
Pg 280 Sec 1151 The Government will penalize hospitals for what Government deems preventable readmissions.
Pg 298 Lines 9-11 Doctors who treat a patient during initial admission that results in a readmission - Government will penalize you.
Pg 317 L 13-20 OMG!! PROHIBITION on ownership/investment. Government tells Doctors what/how much they can own.
Pg 317-318 lines 21-25,1-3 PROHIBITION on expansion - Government will mandate hospitals cannot expand.
Pg 321 2-13 Hospitals have opportunity to apply for exception BUT community input required. Can u say ACORN?!
Pg 335 L 16-25 Pg 336-339 - Government mandates establishment of outcome-based measures which of course forces health care rationing.
Pg 341 Lines 3-9 Government has authority to disqualify Medicare Adv Plans, HMOs, etc., forcing people into Government plan.
Pg 354 Sec 1177 - Government will RESTRICT enrollment of Special needs people!
Pg 379 Sec 1191 Government creates more bureaucracy - Telehealth Advisory Committee. HC by phone.
Pg 425 Lines 4-12 Government mandates Advance Care Planning Consultations. Think Senior Citizens end of life prodding.
Pg 425 Lines 17-19 Government will instruct & consult regarding living wills, durable powers of attorney. Mandatory! See below for more on p. 425.
Pg 425 Lines 22-25, 426 Lines 1-3 Government provides approved list of end of life resources, guiding you in how to die.
Pg 427 Lines 15-24 Government mandates program for orders for end of life. The Government has a say in how your life ends.
Pg 429 Lines 1-9 An “advanced care planning consultant” will be used frequently as patients’ health deteriorates.
Pg 429 Lines 10-12 “advanced care consultation” may include an ORDER for end of life plans. AN ORDER from the Government to end a life!
Pg 429 Lines 13-25 - The Government will specify which Doctors can write an end of life order.
Pg 430 Lines 11-15 The Government will decide what level of treatment you will have at end of life.
Pg 469 - Community Based Home Medical Services/Non profit orgs. (ACORN Medical Services here?)
Pg 472 Lines 14-17 PAYMENT TO COMMUNITY-BASED ORGANIZATION. 1 monthly payment to a community-based organization. (Like ACORN?)
Pg 489 Sec 1308 The Government will cover Marriage & Family therapy. Which means they will insert Government into our marriages.
Pg 494-498 Government will cover Mental Health Services including defining, creating, rationing those services. You’d better speak up now before you are on the “advanced care consultation” list.
Why Every Senior Should Read Page 425 of Health Care Bill
On page 425 it says that EVERYONE on Social Security, including all Senior Citizens and SSI people, will go to MANDATORY counseling every 5 years to learn and to choose from ways to end your suffering and your life. Health care will be denied based on age. $500 Billion will be cut from Seniors healthcare. The only way for that to happen is to drastically cut health care, the oldest and the sickest will be cut first. Paying for your own care will not be an option.
5 SEC. 1233. ADVANCE CARE PLANNING CONSULTATION.
6 (a) MEDICARE.—
7 (1) IN GENERAL.—Section 1861 of the Social
8 Security Act (42 U.S.C. 1395x) is amended—
9 (A) in subsection (s)(2)—
10 (i) by striking ‘‘and’’ at the end of
11 subparagraph (DD);
12 (ii) by adding ‘‘and’’ at the end of
13 subparagraph (EE); and
14 (iii) by adding at the end the fol15
lowing new subparagraph:
16 ‘‘(FF) advance care planning consultation (as
17 defined in subsection (hhh)(1));’’; and
18 (B) by adding at the end the following new
19 subsection:
20 ‘‘Advance Care Planning Consultation
21 ‘‘(hhh)(1) Subject to paragraphs (3) and (4), the
22 term ‘advance care planning consultation’ means a con23
sultation between the individual and a practitioner de24
scribed in paragraph (2) regarding advance care planning,
25 if, subject to paragraph (3), the individual involved has
VerDate Nov 24 2008 00:08 Jul 15, 2009 Jkt 079200 PO 00000 Frm 00424 Fmt 6652 Sfmt 6201 E:\BILLS\H3200.IH H3200 jlentini on DSKJ8SOYB1PROD with BILLS
425
•HR 3200 IH
1 not had such a consultation within the last 5 years. Such
2 consultation shall include the following:
3 ‘‘(A) An explanation by the practitioner of ad4
vance care planning, including key questions and
5 considerations, important steps, and suggested peo6
ple to talk to.
7 ‘‘(B) An explanation by the practitioner of ad8
vance directives, including living wills and durable
9 powers of attorney, and their uses.
10 ‘‘(C) An explanation by the practitioner of the
11 role and responsibilities of a health care proxy.
12 ‘‘(D) The provision by the practitioner of a list
13 of national and State-specific resources to assist con14
sumers and their families with advance care plan15
ning, including the national toll-free hotline, the ad16
vance care planning clearinghouses, and State legal
17 service organizations (including those funded
18 through the Older Americans Act of 1965).
19 ‘‘(E) An explanation by the practitioner of the
20 continuum of end-of-life services and supports avail21
able, including palliative care and hospice, and bene22
fits for such services and supports that are available
23 under this title.
OMG Obama’s going to kill my Grandma!!! Er, wait, no he’s just making sure older Americans are aware of programs like Hospice that have been around for 50+ years.
Wilson raises more than $200,000 after outburst - CNN.com
looks like he raised “200,000” lol
:lol:
:tinfoilhat:
I think Ive used public health care maybe 3 times??? if that? It sucks. Im glad I have a private health plan that I pay for. I dont have to wait 6 months to get treated for an injury.
And thats just with 33 million Canadians. Imagine what the wait time will be like for the US!
Oh and it also sucks paying taxes for all the freeloaders who dont want to work but want health care.
:lol: I have never heard a non-American bitch about the availability of doctors in other countries.
Did you know that if you call for an ambulence in that Shangri-La-like land of Bulgaria :mamoru: a DOCTOR shows up, not a high school kid that knows CPR?
case in point…
Public Health care MRI = 6 month wait
Private Health care MRI = 1 week
Oh and thats if you can find a doctor to refer you. Most doctors limit the number of patients they will see. So there are tons of Canadians without family doctors.
I win.
Hey Fry, JSTANEON is CANADIAN, lol.
Meh, we will see more congressmen doing this as a last ditch effort to raise quick cash. This may get out of hand if there is little/no punishment for the outburst.
:biglaugh:
I was wondering wtf he was winning!
:lol: :feck: :io: