benifits to 180SX Brake Upgrade?

Hey everyone,

Just wondering whats the benifits of the 180SX Brake Swap

i am planing on getting new brakes soon

i was going to go with Bear cross driller and slotted rotors with Hawk pads all around on my 240 with ABS.

but people are telling me 180 upgrade would be better then that ? whats the difference from the 240sx brake setup that makes it so much better…espically if i do with the bear rotor and hawk pads…

for all its worth i have no problems with my stock brakes really i cant even imagine how good they would stop by just upgradeing to the slotted with good pads… i do some drifting with my car and have yet to notice my stock breaks fail on me or anything fade…

so …

a little help on 180 upgrade vs stock 240 with cross drill and good pads

what to do…

i just got some 180sx brakes installed and used stainless steel brake lines, made a huge improvment over my stock setup, i also had stock abs brakes before and these r much much better

My current setup I run is awesome. Z32 alum calipers with blank rotors and HP+ pads. Rear is also z32 calipers except power slot rotors and HPS pads.

I absolutely suggest it. Best street/autocross intended setup you can get.

It just stops… amazing… I can’t explain it until you drive with me or drive it. I also have a 240 thats 100kg lighter due to the many things ive done to it (all weighed and calculated) but… whatever. The way the car should have been if it was a ‘sports car’ of today is with this setup.

I wouldn’t invest in anything else unless I go hardcore and get ultra light alum 6piston calipers and 13-14" rotors. Something I can’t and couldn’t do at the moment. Nor do I really need.

Don’t know about the 180sx setup but jus tthought I’d share my few cents.

From 200-0 its like going 100-0 in so many cars… it just stops as if you hit a wall. My tires lacking grip are more of a concern than brakes. I need wider tires or r compounds so they grip better and don’t just plain lock up lol.

from 120-0 its super easy to lockup but with ss lines and rbf600 fluid the pedal is awesome you can modulate it super great. It’s just really worth it… unless you plan to dish out 2000-3000 for a quality big brake racing kit… and not one that’s just for looks and barely any if any improvments.

300zx swap -> Thumbs up. Totally worth it. Stock brakes feel like suicide on wheels.

Don’t get cross drilled garbage just more prone to cracking. “looks” are for ricers. If you want practicallity go blank or slotted at best but being slotted will eat up your pads fast… The only purpose of it is to always give a fresh slice of pad surface.

what if you only upgrade your front breaks with Z32 and leave the rear stock ? ive been reading about the Z32 swap and it seems the rear is a alot to do most people just do the front in doing this would it not trow the ballance of the car off because the fronts are so good and the rear is not…

all this reading about stuff and seeing how the cross drilled and slotted are alot of “show”…i thought they were actally good heh…

how much can you get the 300zx brakes for anyways?

for front all you have to do is change the lines calipers rotors all useing 300zx parts …right?

if your just doing the front do you need to change the master?

still dont know whats good about 180 breaks now lol

ABS still work the same with 300zx ?

I found this write up about it

Well I did front and rear + e-brake + 300zx mbc + ss lines + rbf 600 fluid = awesome. As I said, brembo blanks front + hp+ pads, powerslot rear + hps pads.

It costs alot you’re looking at about 700+ total maybe, I spent spent spent, so I don’t remember… still a bargain compared to big brake kits…

The thing is, the rears ARE very important, they are the ones that really stop the car and also that keep the rear from not dancing around. Yes the real impact is from the fronts slamming the car, but people don’t realize the importance of the rear.

Also balance is important, it depends on the weight as well. For example a car that’s 50:50 may have front and rear same. Most cars are not 50:50 weight dist It all depends.

Also you don’t want to be just locking up the fronts and having your ass slide around. Kind of useless.

all this reading about stuff and seeing how the cross drilled and slotted are alot of “show”…i thought they were actally good heh…

Not really its a technology that was back in the days when gases were produced. Mostly honda crew still believes that they have an impact now a days. Long story short they crack in intense situations. Stay away from it, save your money.

for front all you have to do is change the lines calipers rotors all useing 300zx parts …right?

The only thing I went an extra step with was getting front and rear 5 lug conversion and wheel bearings. Rear was from 300zx, front was from ichiba.

if your just doing the front do you need to change the master?

Advisable as your pedal will be mushy. Imagine the tiny mbc pushing 6 more pistons in the front and 2 more in the rear. Where do you think all that pressure will come from.

still dont know whats good about 180 breaks now lol

I never looked into the 180sx brakes but if i recall they are 2 piston like q45 calipers… i think… i dont know.

ABS still work the same with 300zx ?

As long as you get the appropriate mbc/lines its all good. I run ABS-less, I don’t like ABS or any other weight heavy things on the car.

Yeah thats pretty much standard, everyone posts that link up, good find by yourself.

so…a few more questions now that i know a little more…

I think i wanna do the upgrade for Z32 in the front ide need stainless lines,the caliper,rotor and pads…from 300ZX to be done.?

and then thats all for the front …about how much $ is that i searched these forums for sale post but i didnt find many prices…

for the rear of the car i am still not sure what i wanna do i mean ideal would be going with 300ZX also in the rear but im not sure if its totally worth it…ive never done brakes before either…but thats not a big deal

i was thinking maybe 180Sx in the rear…Z32 in the front …?

i DO NOT wanna mess withthe ballance of the car and have the fronts all locking while the ass slides out. i want even breaking and for it to be safe…ect

other question …so even in upgradeing just the front i should go with the Z32 master Cyl seems about right i just always get confused becasue of my ABS i dotn wanna screw it up or anything…

im looking to spend 500$ or so but ide not like to go past 600$ atm…

Thanks for the help.

it will cost you more than 600… 180sx wont be a whole lot more braking power over the stock 240 brakes here…

if you want to save for a willwood, stoptech and the likes big brake kit, wait and just stay with what u have stock, get powerslot rotors, get rbf600 fluid, get ss lines, get hp+ pads front and rear and thats it for the street (stock calipers).

it’ll be good enough… it’ll be ‘new’… it’ll still cost you about 500$

30bux for fluid
about 60bux for ss lines
about 100-200 for rotors front and rear stock size.
about 150-200 for pads front and rear stock size.

GT, please, just go with 180sx brakes. If all you mainly do is drifting and not much time attack, you are just wasting your money on Z32 brakes. In my opinion, too many people go with Z32 brakes just because everyone else talks about it. Before I say anything else, i got them for approx $200 for the front calipers + a pair of brand new blank rotors. I then bought brand new HAWK HPS pads from varun. (Go to him for all your Hawk pad needs)

I run 180sx Brakes in the front with blank rotors in the front with stock brake lines and HAWK HPS Pads. Oh and i just use some prestone brake fluid (if it even matters for “stopping power” which it doesnt in my opinion.

They stop awesome. And what’s even better is that i don’t just drive it on the street, I’ve taken it to dunnville and they have proven to be pretty good.

Ask John (Jammin1911) and Varun (Slipperysilvia) how my brakes are and they will tell you how they liked it. Benson (Benson240sx) also runs 180sx brakes and he loves it.

For what you you do with your car, just grab 180sx brakes and Hawk HPS pads. Save yourself some money. You don’t NEED Z32 brakes no matter how good they sound or people say they are. Like you said, you are mostly into drift.

Good luck in your decision.

P.S Ahmed, i appreciate you giving your 2 cents about Z32 brakes (and yes they do stop pretty well), but this guy is asking for advice on 180sx brakes and did you take note of what he does with his car? Telling him to go with Z32 brakes is just making him waste his money. No offence though.

Thanks both of you guys for helping …i have learnt alot just from looking into all this stuff now i knew about brake upgrades before but not much detail

i have a few more questions about 180 sx brakes …just say going 180sx all around do you have to change lines or anything with the e break or master/booster?

is it just as simple as caliper/rotor/pads ?

180sx is better cooling and a bit bigger rotor then from what i understand …

i was also reading something on here…that rear 180sx and stock 240sx ABS rear are the same thing? if thats the case then i would just need the front 180

just wondering what mechinical differences between 180sx and the 240sx ABS brakes…

180 sounds like a more simple upgrade to do since i do drive my car on the street alot more then i use it on the track i go to track days for fun and love to drive my car almost everyday on the roads …but its far from a track car or racecar,full interiour,carpet…ect… and i dont plan on making it a race car or anyhting so Z32 would maybe be some overkill but its still good information to know. just wanna do something to make the breaks better since i do need to do them soon why not make an improvment somehow be it better pads and rotors or an upgrade

It’s no problem at all, I’m just giving you whatever advice I can based on experience.

When you do the 180sx brake upgrade, you just change the front brakes. The rear brakes on a 180sx are exactly the same I guess.

Leave the lines stock, they will bolt right onto the 180sx caliper. However, for a better brake pedal feel, you could get Stainless steel braided lines and apparently those help a little.

The master will remain the same as i’m pretty sure 180sx’s all had the same brake master cylinders as we did, however, 240sx with ABS apparently had a bigger master or a master with a bigger piston or whatever. Someone can prolly confirm that or you can find out by searching.

In my opinion, based on what you are using your car for. Front 180sx Brakes with brand new blank rotors + Hawk HPS pads will be perfect. Keep the rear brakes stock or upgrade them to HAWK HPS or HP+ on the stock 240sx calipers.

You will definitely not regret it. If you live near me, I can take you for a spin in my car.

Oh by the way, the 180sx rotors are much bigger than the 240sx rotors.

I have 16 inch rims and that is how it looks. Unfortunately, i dont have pics of my rear to show you a comparison.

awsome …well i think i will go with 180 upgrade seems like its a pretty good choice…

so when i go to the parts store to buy rotors what do i say i want for a maxima or ultima? same with pads i am going with hawk pads but i guess its not a 240sx ide have to ask for?

i am just reading off wikipedia about the parts…

http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Nissan_240SX_Performance_Modification/Brake_Upgrades

for example …

For the owners of S13s ('89-'94) You can upgrade your stock front brakes to JDM 180SX spec using USDM parts. This upgrades main benefit is the additional mass to the rotor for heat dissipation. The caliper pistons are not so large as to impact braking bias more than a trivial amount. The following will be needed for this swap:

stock non abs s13 brakes VS 180sx style brakes('93-'97) 1st generation Nissan altima rotors. These are 280x22mm and have a 4x114 bolt pattern.

('89-'99) 3rd and 4th generation Nissan Maxima brake calipers

('89-'99) 3rd and 4th generation Nissan Maxima brake caliper mounting brackets

('89-'99) 3rd and 4th generation Nissan Maxima brake caliper mounting bracket hardware kit

('89-'99) 3rd and 4th generation Nissan Maxima brake pads

whats the best rotor to buy. i go into parts store and ask for 99’ maxima rotors?

CAN USE 2000-2003 Nissan Sentra SE-R 11 inch rotors instead of altima rotors and there is no gap, they work perfect and are the same size as 180sx rotors exactly?

so just upgradeing the front with 180 is an ok thing to do i am always worried about messing up the ballance…but i guess its not really giving it more power to stop so it wont mess it up ?

my car being ABS i guess is not an issue either the example in wikipedia is done with non ABS thats why i am wondering…

visually the front rotor will be bigger then the rear rotor that will look a bit strange can you put the bigger rotor on the stock rear 240 caliper or that wont work ?

i know alot of questions buti just like to know exactally what im going to getin gto before i do it and this way i know whats what and dont waste time and money :stuck_out_tongue:

Well if you go with the 180sx brake upgrade don’t expect an upgrade, expect a near improved replacement.

I get brake fade on my setup even (well… after a super extensive journey). Only way to go about of not having something like that + more braking power is with some big rotor big piston lightweight setup (eg; stoptech, willwood, etc…) and again that would require better tires/wider tires/r compounds.

I am pretty sure if i went to rip on the track with what I have now, it wouldn’t be adequate as they would overheat and i would have no other option other than running aggressive track pads from hawk or another brand that does not have initial bite and needs to be warmed up, plus chews through rotors.

Hawk HPS pads suck big time, HP+ is perfect for street imho, no warm up time, and as they warm up they run great while HPS just fade and die as per my experience. The squealing some people complain about is bs, it’s so minor its a no issue and its only a little more money than HPS.

If you’re just replacing and not upgrading with the 180sx setup and not 300zx setup, go at least with HP+ pads and get some quality fluid (not what mark said). Fluid boiling is one of the reasons for brake fade. People undermine and do not realize it is actually one very important aspect of the brake system. It’s the one thing that is used to make the whole hydraulic system to work. There is two things to consider on this part, dry boiling point and wet boiling point, the second being the one to worry about (as these fluids are hydroscopic – absorb water). When it becomes ‘wet’ it boils at lower temps. Water boils at 100celsius. Brakes operate at much higher temps.

So yeah enough ranting. I believe you’ve got enough explained on here. 180sx brakes are just stock brakes in japan slightly superior (negligble if anything).

There’s so many factors… the torque being applied, the traction/grip issues with lockups and actual tires playing a factor on braking. High speed braking vs low speed braking.

And what mark said, I can confirm, ABS mbc is larger and different than non-ABS mbc.

Also if I am not mistaken, 180sx rotors are same size as 300zx rotors except they are 22mm and not 26mm or 28mm in width like the 300zx rotors (thicker/bigger - more cooling capacity less brake fade).

All I was saying is think ahead, do not spend money time and time again… I regret buying 300zx setup, investing in it on top of buying it and conversion… instead of just going with a big brake kit from stoptech or willwood.

I was even thinking of reinvesting once again with caliper relocation kits (running cobra, vr4, 3000gt, 350z track edition rotors) on the 300zx brakes i have but said no to myself, its a waste… and ill wait until i can afford willwood or stoptech 6 piston 13"-14" setup… (which will require me to have 17" rims which i dont want to waste money on either unless they are the right width, offset and ultra lightweight)

But if you never plan to run bigger power/great things with your car go ahead… its a replacement…

I drove a freind’s stock 240 a while ago… couldnt’ believe how dangerous the brakes felt to me compared to mine…

So many times I felt as if I wasted money on 300zx brakes… To me they feel as what the car should have been like in the first place and not an upgrade. S14 in japan and s15 run the same z32/r32/etc… brake setups. It’s not astronomical.

If you have future plans, you’ll regret spending money over and over and over again so many times… that is why i spend time planning things and researching more now and holding myself back from buying on impulse… I was going to recently buy front and rear dc sports strut bars and didn’t…

Also upgrading the fronts with q45/180sx brakes will not affect noticably balance… as it would with 300zx…

Any type of blank rotor should be fine, they usually stock different “grades” at NAPA, cheapest, better, “best”, for the pads, just go to varun and tell him that you want brake pads for 180sx calipers and he’ll know what to give you.

ABS and al lthat doesn’t matter, I have mine removed anyways. If you don’t want abs to work, you can remove the fuse in the engine bay fuse panel.

Ahmed, after reading your post. You might as well tell GT to go buy a different car. He’s just a guy who mainly does drift and mostly street driving, stop making him want stoptech or 300zx brakes. What I hate on son is bad advice like this. I know you are trying to justifiy buying some stoptech brakes for yourself but don’t bring anyone else into it.

At least this dude has been to the track a lot more times than you. You’re saying that you want all these crazy brakes and 400whp when your car is still just a daily driver that’s never been to the track.

I have tested my 180sx brakes at the track, multiple laps at a time, and yes after quite a lot of laps, they started to smoke but that was ONCE when varun was driving and he was braking really hard. The bigger rotor that the 180sx uses definitely helps for brake fade / heatsoak.

I am more into grip and if my brakes could handle several continous laps of gripping, it should be perfect for GT.

But GT, if you wanna go spend that $400, go ahead, it’s your money, not mine.

In my opinion, everyone on this board has one thing in common, to get the most “hardcore” shit that they will never use.

I.e
Hey, i wanna put a cage into my car.
hey, i want 300zx brakes.
Hey i want 17x10 inch wheels with the widest tires i can get
Hey, i want megan track coilovers or “stance” since its supposed to be the BEST coilover you can buy in SON’s eyes.
hey, i want full multilink
hey, i want a racing seat
hey, i just want 400whp, that should be good enough for me.

And what do they do with their car? They just bring it to the Bing’s meet once a year to show that they have all that done to their cars. Typical hardparkers.

GT, give varun a call (416-910-5550) and ask him about Mark’s (Fobwall’s) brakes at Dunnville and what he thought of them. And at the same time, you can order some 180sx pads from him. But don’t forget to find yourself a set of 180sx calipers first.

I’m not saying that my brakes are the best, but i’m saying that they are probably the best bang for your buck and most practical for what you do with your car.

LOLLLLLLLLLL ‘bad advice’ on son.

Wow thats coming out of you, where you never give advice except counter arguments against things you don’t have, never will have. That is the only advice you give , it’s always a “you will never need that, you ricer”.

Last time i checked your car handles shit compared to mine and it’s got coilovers, it’s got strutbars, it’s got lighter and wider, wheels, it’s got wider tires, it has a manual and an sr (which again should make it lighter) its also stripped like mine.

Your car should handle alot better than mine, but why doesn’t it? Cause you can’t drive shit, and funny thing is, I still have an automatic which I can’t wait to get rid off to fully exploit the car, as opposed to forcefluly downshift into 3rd, 2nd and 1st through the auto stick, which is slow and can damage the tranny, but so far so good. Well built.

Btw you’re a hardparker yourself, i came to like <5 meets. I am not building a car for you or anyone else. I opened the hood one time, and told its all stock except the intake which doesn’t do anything except make noise. Turns out most of the guys are not assholes in real life and you’re too much of a quiet guy compared to your dissing manners on son.

Just because you don’t have something, or never will have something, it doesn’t mean it’s useless and only for ‘oh you will never use that lolzz’.

I don’t consider 180sx/q45 or stock brakes adequate, not even 300zx brakes are adequate, they are to me the way the car should have been stock and new s14 years and s15 are stock with them in japan btw. Woopie do?

My father’s family taurus can brake better than a stock s13. What did you say when I said that a long time ago. Oh it’s a new car of course. Well guess what, I don’t want to be braking worse than a 2003 taurus. lol.

Your argument is always “you don’t need it, i dont have it, im fine” well good for you. Why own a corvette z06 or z07. To show off? I don’t think so. Not in my opinion. It’s to have a better handling, better accelerating car for one self.

“Have a different car”, nope, but just make the cars we have better for ourselves. I’ve decided to not sell my car or part it out to get another car, instead I just want to build it up and that’s it. I was going to go for a rx7 or s2000 and go from there, but nope… i already am into my car as it is. My dreamcar would be a 911 turbo or gt3, or z06, or the upcoming gtr, but nope, I’m sticking with what I have.

You were even against me having my 300zx brakes. As if it’s some massive upgrade. Please man. What bullshit. You were telling me you don’t need it even for your SR. Sorry but going ‘pshht pshhht pshhhht’ to 60km five times a day sure as hell doesn’t need even stock brakes.

And when it comes to brakes, can never have enough brakes, I’ve been saved thank God from so many situations where idiots in front of me smashed their brakes and spun out and thank God I was able to brake. Or even a while ago this one guy eratically moved to the left lane and almost had me hit him, thank God I had descent brakes and descent suspension to brake and move out of the way. Stock suspension and stock brakes would have had me killed, sliding, flipped over, etc… where human reaction isn’t enough if the car just won’t be able to react fast enough either.

Being on the cheap, gets you no where either. I cheapened out when I was getting 300zx, instead of getting something new. I should have at least gotten brand new willwood arizona kit. It’s super cheap and super good :slight_smile: Whoever has it had nothing but great things to say about it. People who talked crap about it, just heard from a person that heard from another person rumor crap.

http://www.arizonazcar.com/240sxbrakes.html

They are ultra lightweight (which is actual performance) huge rotors especially thickness (forget brake fade) and of course more and smoother torque and pedal feel. Definetely a massive improvment on almost 20 year old 300zx and especially 180sx brakes.

795$US + shipping is pretty much what I spent on my 300zx setup… and more in the long run. Instead what you would get for that money is, 4pot aluminum calipers, rotors (two piece), ss lines, pads, everything brand new, not used or cheapend out on. And it’s 4 lug, so no need for even 5 lug conversion (although that’s something i want because of wheel offset choices, and not honduh choices).

All I was saying is, if he wants to spend money time and time again and make mistakes time and time again, go ahead, because 180sx is stock replacement in my opinion JDM tyte yo… 300zx is just ‘above stock’, but not massively an enormous upgrade as they’ll still fade. If he is doing an upgrade go 300zx with HP+ pads and ss lines, good brake fluid (something you said you shouldn’t care about, which is idiotic, fluid is important).

Whatever… everyone’s on the damn cheap on this forum, that is why everyone thinks ‘stance is the best coilover on son’, its cause its the best cheapest priced coilover that’s available. Plenty of japanese and european coilover systems out there that are better but more priced.

lol, if you have to bash my car to make yourself feel better, then keep bashing me. But i didn’t know that having a manual car makes your car handle better. That’s something new.

I never said I was a good driver. In fact, i suck at driving, and I tell that to everyone I know. I’m pretty sure some of my friends on the board will confirm that for you.

My car also handled like shit for the longest time because I did not have an alignment done.

But ahmed, i’m not going to argue with you. Your car is a lot faster, handles a lot better, and stops a lot faster than me. You are also a pretty good driver, I’d compare you to Paul Tracy.

Alright guys…i apericate the help no need to argure about each others cars though or driving skill or whatever…i dont really care about that at all

overall i think i am going to get some 180SX brakes

Z32 seem like a good choice also but im not into changeing the master ect…plus i planed to spend about 500 all done.

getting a big brake upgrade is not needed for what i want i mean to obtain best of the best yes it is a good idea…but i dont need that.

180sx seems like a good bang for the buck with a bit better then stock

1 question though …so the front rotor will be bigger then the rear wont that look a little funny ?

thanks for both your guys help and maybe other people learn about it to by reading this…now i guess i gotta post WTB 180 brakes:P

and again …

99 maxima pads with 97 altima rotors,180sx calipers…hook right up to 240 brake lines (SS optional) done and done …seems pretty straight forward :smiley:

and again …the me having ABS in not an issuse they work with ABS no mater even if the car they come off of is NON ABS car?

how do i tell when i buy a set the guy is selling me 180 brakes and not just 240sx brakes lmao

^^^most cars I see have bigger front rotors than the rears.

It has to do with the weight balance, most cars tend to be nose heavy.

By the way 300zx NEW parts (frickin GREAT deal I would just have it with different pads, and blank or slotted instead of drilled but these are brembos… other than that cool, still i wouldnt mind it, sick deal):

http://forums.son240sx.ca/showthread.php?t=27371

  • Front Big Brake Conversion Complete 300zx TT New! 650$

.2 Caliper 300zx TT 96 4 pistons 30mm ( Most biger ) Aluminium New!
.2 Disk 300zx Z32 BREMBO Cross-Drilled /Slotted ( 280mm x 30mm ) ( driled 4x114.3 )
.Pads 300zx Pbr Metal Master
.Stainless lines 240sx to 300zx
.all the pin, shim and other