//\ interesting stuff
Ya its interesting stuff but the biggest problem is Insurance Companys. Soon as you tell them you have a Cage or want to Cage the Car, the jig is up! And really the only way around that problem is to have the Vehicle appraised and then Insured on its value because the Cage then becomes a part of the Vehicle but tech that way, you are paying extra per month on the policy in order to have a Cage…
My Agent does Insure me when the Cage is in BUT the reason he does is I have told him more or less its for track use only and I only put it in before I goto the track as well as to promote the business some what so I can get it from point A-B and show it off perhaps. But in the long run, if the Cage were not removeable then he would not Insure me.
The other thing he was very strict about is… IF I got into an accident, even if at first there is proof its not may fault. Well because the vehicle is Caged and more or less appears as a (race car) they will re-look the situation every possible way they can to see if they would nail me perhaps with speeding or following to close or even say street racing etc.
But… like most, they do not inform their Insurance if they get a Turbo or $2000 Rims so most would not bother to metion a Cage but if they ever got into an accident they would face being droipped instantly and loosing coverage, so if they hurt someone they would be looking at quite a huge bill.
Insurance Companies… our only weakness, lol.
Please cite the HTA Regulation that specifically deals with safety equipment, in particular roll cages. There is a regulation that deals with seat belts but it says nothing about roll cages or roll bars.
Also, if you can, please show me the list of designated testing organizations referred to in any Ontario statute or regulation.
mike i think the point is that a catch-all clause will still net you a ticket. the law is not about who is right… the law is about who can prove they’re right.
you may not be speeding but you can still get a speeding ticket and you may still have to pay it even though you may not have been speeding.
jeff is pointing out a rather open-ended piece of legislation that a police officer can you to inconvenience you.
Okay… I have already posted all of this… but once again
Regulations, safety devices[/b
- (1) The Lieutenant Governor in Council may make regulations,
(a) requiring the use or incorporation of [b]any device or any equipment, in or on any vehicle or any class of vehicle, that may affect the safe operation of the vehicle on the highway or that may reduce or prevent injury to persons using the highway, and prescribing the specifications and regulating the installation thereof;
(b) designating devices and designating an organization to test and mark its approval of any device so designated, and prohibiting the incorporation or use in or on a vehicle of any device so designated that is not marked as approved by the testing organization;
They do not go as far as giving “Roll Cages” its only section like they would a “Seat Belt” because in reality 100% of cars HAVE SEAT BELTS, so to compare something like that to a Roll Cage is just plan stupid as maybe 5% of people out there have one maybe in their daily driver?
I also stated that the tech guys @ TMP can certify the Cage by determining it is of proper build and made to proper specifications. I’m sure the guys @ CSCS and others can as well since once you hit what 11 sec ? you must have a Cage, so you must have someone to inspect them. Their are Targa Officials who work out of Toronto with people prior to heading to Newfoundland. ALL the MTO is looking for is proof from a professional 3rd party that the Cage is Safe.
IF! you want would like to get into the really fine ways of testing a Cage then sure… mind you this only applies to International Racing such as the WRC and their are only a hand of the machines to test the Vehiles not to mention you have to pretty much wreck one in order to test it but yea… http://www.safetydevices.com/content/view/15/35/
The above link even goes onto state that pre Jan 03 even for the International WRC all they did for Cage Certification was prove it was of proper build and to proper specifications.
I do not know how much further detail or proof you require but this is seriously getting ridicules. IF you think the HTA is actually going to have writin words with (Roll Cages) under safety devices, it will NEVER happen. The section I posted from Part 102 is it… That referes to Roll Cages as a “Safety Device which may prevent injury”. But if you would like to argue that a Cage would not fall under that category then by all means…
My point is there is no specific legislation the officer can use against you.
The only thing he could forseeably do is pull your car off the road as an unsafe vehicle… and that is a harsh fuckin penalty.
What part of “102. (1) The Lieutenant Governor in Council may make regulations,” is unclear?
Is it the “may make”? Or is it the “regulations”?
Because “regulations” has a specific meaning in this clause. It’s not referring to rules of cage design requirements. It’s referring to the R.R.O. (Revised Regulations of Ontario).
I looked through the R.R.O.that fall under the HTA and cannot find anything to do with safety equipment (other than specific provisions for seat belts).
My point simply is that this law does not apply to you or me. In other words, you can’t get a ticket for it.
I repeat. You cannot be given a ticket for “violating” section 102(1) of the HTA. This is because you or I cannot violate it.
Where do you guys find all this stuff, lol.
This is good info people may want to know before installing a cage in there car.
In the niagara region I’ve seen 8 sec pro street cars full tube chasis and roll cages, parachutes, 15" slick with grooves cut to resemble some kind of tread with big f@#kin’ blowers sticking out the hood and the cars are plated and insured for street use which means it had a safety inspection at one time or another
James
NCC Performance
i will avoid the bickering and just ask my question it’s scary enough…
I am not knowledgeable when it comes to roll cages/bars, etc… but I am interested in one.
My car is half stripped now, rear seats, carpets, and other trash from half of the car backwards is all gone…
My goal is for time attack and road racing, not interested in drifting…
I have been told that when building a cage one should know what they are building their cage for. For instance… a cage for drag racing, a cage for drifting, etc… would be different from one another (I don’t know I just heard)… thus I am wondering if I want to do grip racing, what kind of cage design should I look for?
I will keep the car on the road, however I am gearing it towards grip racing/ time attack… what are my options.
I’ve read earlier in the thread the cusco cage sucks… apparently… and I’ve read elsewhere custom ones are cheaper and better (makes sense, since usually one pays for brand name than product more).
In a nutshell, I’m basically wondering what is doable for me if I want to do grip racing/time attack… I intend to keep the front two seats, the dash, and side door panels (although I might make custom ones).
I am interested in it being light obviously, but rigid, stiff and strong … and for the intended purpose.
Tell me where to begin … and what’s available and how.
where to begin? decide if you want to eventually compete in Solo or any other racing bodies and have a cage built to suit those specs.
Failing to do so could quite possibly lose you a fair amount of money in the long run.
By and large the difference in cages would be a result of different sanctioning bodies, and therefore different regulations and requirements on a cage. If there were one sanctioning body over all types of racing, the cage design from event to event, in the same car, would be realtively the same.
First figure out which sanctioning body u will be running under, get a copy of the rules or send me a link to that page with cage design specs and we can go from there, Some rules will exceed others so if u plan on being competetive in other series you will want to compare rules and use the one that exceeds the others…
Thanks James
NCC Performance