well, i figure it is stupid to keep my ideas and information about saabtuning from a crowd who could enjoy and use it.
first of all, I want to let everybody know that i will not keep a secret or lie about what my car will be, come summer/fall 2007, when my car is road-going again. i want to share with the people in my area a car that few ever get the pleasure of being in or around. It will be the only one like upon completion and will compliment the already well diversified car crowd in WNY
to begin with i will be starting with a very advanced turbo system, with technology that advanced engine tuning and created an uproar in the turbo community. The system, Trionic7, was created to eliminate the age old problem with front-mount turbo charging systems, that is lag. what is accomplished is by this is a flat torque curve that arrives quickly in the rpm band creating power on demand in any gear. at low rpms in any gear the turbo spool is incredible(stock it has been shown to complete the hustle from 50-110mph in 5th gear in the same time as a 911 carrera). Though, the turbo is quite small by most standards it will hold a peak boost of about 16-18 lbs.(this is the same turbo as in a stock 02-04 WRX{my stage 3 wrx was boosted to 18lbs on the same turbo}) this elimination of the lag is created by the T7 software using advanced engine timing,a/f mix and a small turbo boosting considerably.
the engine is a DOHC’d 2.3 liter I-4, similar looking to a large honda 4 cylinder. the car is stock right now and dyno’d 218FWHP and 258or9LB/ft TQ.
The engine will be gas flowed/ bored/stroker and completely rebuilt to the specs of 2.5 or 2.8 liters and be fitted with larger and stronger pistons/valves/ more dynamic cams and ported intake system. the boost will be achieved with a GarrettGT35 or GT42 depending upon the results of my contact’s testing in sweden. The setup will be similar to a drag car built by a swedish saab tuner named maptun.
My goal with the car is to build something no one has ever seen, and show it to present the car community with a unique highperformance platform that rarely gets credit or credibility due to one small, easy-fixed problem, that is torque steer. But trust me, all areas of the car will be fully treated and addressed to achieve the ultimate machine that is a viggen fighter jet.
sorry, i just had nothing to do and was making my plans and creating the schedule for the transformation of the car because it will be sitting for possibly over a year.
i will have a job, this spring i will be pulling factory 3rd shifts then all summer i will do the same up through next summer, so that will be some good cash. no vacations, no breaks, just money.
----i am hoping to see numbers close to theirs using a conservative tune so as to not explode the engine. it has been shown hold in excess of 500whp and 600lb/ft TQ…but i am gonig to tone that down a bit, so it will be around 350-400whp and 450-500lb/ft TQ.
At the heart of the matter is Saab’s fascinating, tiny 2.3-liter inline-4 powerplant, whose rating at 230 horsepower suggests a typo until it is experienced. We’ve seen this motor before: in the 9-5 Aero sedan (reviewed here October '99) and the 9-3 “Viggen” coupe (January '00). So the word is already out about the proprietary variable boost technology that Saab dubs High-Output Turbocharging (H.O.T.). What bears repeating is that this minuscule motor impersonates V8s twice its size thanks to a 32-bit engine management computer known as the Trionic 7. In a world where 16-bit processors are still commonplace, Saab puts four times the number-crunching power to the task of not only making big horsepower but also civilizing it. In simplest terms, Trionic 7 monitors load conditions, driving style, and even altitude to regulate continuously variable turbo pressures from 15 psi to 20 psi. Trionic’s deft manipulation of an electronic throttle banishes the traditional bane of turbocharging, dreaded “turbo lag,” to near nonexistence. For 9-5 Aeros with an optional automatic transmission, the telltale snap of a turbo’s heady rush is further attenuated by the hydraulic torque converter. But it’s not for me, thankyouverymuch. Along with this Aero wagon’s standard five-speed manual comes an “overboost” mode that permits up to 20 seconds of surcharge power, raising the rated 230 horsepower to 236 and, even more importantly, the 258 ft.-lbs. of torque to 274.
It does sound like Anti-Lag with the software drop in timing. The deal is (for those who don’t know), you combust gas in the turbo exhaust housing as well as the in the chamber to get the turbo to spool faster quicker. Hotter exhaust temps yield higher exhaust gas velocity. The caveat is most turbo’s can’t take this abuse for too long so best to use sparingly or your shaft seals and bearings will quickly deteriorate.
yea, sort of, but it cant jsut be anti-lag, because you are right, it does break turbos down over time, this(2.3t saab) may do it, but to a lesser extent. because these(viggens and 9-5s) have been shown to last over 200Kmiles and still boost fully/correctly and run strong… my friend has an 86 SPG900 that has held 21psi and put out 260whp for over 3 years and he purchased it stock at 190k miles and has since put it well over 200K at 21psi.
Obviously they aren’t the same thing, Anti-lag is from a dead stop where from what you are describing, it sounds like timing tricks in the maps to get similar effects as anti-lag. If it works, nore power to you…
idk, why dont you buy one for $69 from the back of your car and driver…
the system is crazy advanced, otherwise saabs would be running around like hondas…
anyway…ive been looking for “the scientific” on Trionic7…so bear with me…im learning just as much as you guys are…
so is this actually a misfiring system? Basically doing exactly what rubicant said. If so, you are gunna get pulled over like a motherfucker, however, they sound fucking sweet.
The Trionic 7 system is a pure airflow (mass) related system, boost (mbar) is not used (only for backup functions). (The only systems known to me using both (airflow and pressure) are Bosch ME7 and 9). Therefore the boost pressure cannot be specified and changes everyday, depending on atmospheric pressure and on intake temperature (hotter=more boost). So if you start in the morning with an intake temperature of 40°C, the requested airmass say 1000mg/comb (milligrams per combustion), you could have say 1900 mbar boost (abs). After driving a while in the traffic, the intake temp might raise to 60°C and the boost goes up to 2000 mbar on still 1000 mg/comb. Lower density of the air is corrected by the higher boost. However, this doesn´t mean that you get out the same power!
Hotter air is more knock sensitive (less efficient), the VE (volumetric efficency, basically the filling rate of a cylinder) is lower (due to the increased duty cycle of the turbo) and the ignition is reduced. These are basic functions.
The adaptions, boost or fuel are not very “long term”. In fact, they are adjusted all the time, constantly when you drive in the “adaption windows”. The boost adaption is not really power affecting. On steady load, the PID (Proportional-Integral-Derivative control) will take care of any kind of positive or negative adaption on boost. So the power result is not affected. But on transients (short acceleration) you “feel” it: Negative adaption will cause that you never reach the target boost in the short term (it is used to prevent “overshoothing” the request).
The fuel adaption (mult) however is affecting the power output. Now, if you have a car that runs “lean” in the closed loop (the lambda integrator has to add fuel to get lambda 1), you will have a positive fuel adaption. This % value of added fuel will be added on the request in the open loop (out of lambda control). Richer mixture = lower output.
So essentially it has a lot better handling of evironmental changes, basically a purely dynamic fuel system controller. Sounds interesting but I think they could have gotten a lot better results with the addition of a variable valve lift head. The Mitsubishi Evolution 9 is proof positive of such an addition in a boosted environment.
sounds like a nice project u got lined up tho!
