McLaren Excluded from 07 and 08 Championships

One of the key submissions to the World Motor Sport Council on Thursday came from Ferrari driver Kimi Raikkonen, we can reveal.

The Ferrari driver stated in writing that while he was at McLaren from 2002 until 2006 the team systematically listened to Ferrari’s radio transmissions, which are supposed to be scrambled.

This was put to Ron Dennis in Paris on Thursday, and reportedly a long silence followed before he came up with a reply.

Intriguingly, the Kimi evidence was not part of the report released by the FIA today, and thus has not reached the public domain until now.

ooooooooooooooooooooooooboy. That can’t be good. :lolham:

Ironically in July Mika Salo revealed to a Finnish newspaper that when at Ferrari in 1999 he regularly received transcripts of Mika Hakkinen’s radio conversations.

Unfortunately for Salo he was driving a Ferrari at the Spa 24 Hours the week that story emerged. A “correction” was soon sent from Maranello explaining what the Finn had meant to say was that in those primitive days sometimes teams accidentally overheard the conversations of rivals…

:uhh::uhh::uhh::uhh::uhh:

www.autosport.com

By Jonathan Noble Friday, September 14th 2007, 13:36 GMT

The FIA has published accounts of “systematic” contact between McLaren chief designer Mike Coughlan and Ferrari’s Nigel Stepney - evidence that led the governing body to severly penalise the Woking-based team.

In a 14-page document issued at the Belgian Grand Prix, the FIA details how the World Motor Sport Council reached its verdict at its hearing on Thursday.

As was expected, the evidence revolves around an email exchange between McLaren test driver Pedro de la Rosa and world champion Fernando Alonso, plus logs of calls and SMS messages between Coughlan and Stepney.

In the emails, extracts of which have been published, de la Rosa talks about information coming from Stepney.

On March 21 de la Rosa wrote an email to Coughlan stating: "Hi Mike, do you know the Red Car’s Weight Distribution? It would be important for us to know so that we could try it in the simulator. Thanks in advance, Pedro.

“P.S. I will be in the simulator tomorrow.”

Coughlan replied to that email with a text message with the details that were required, although in the end those settings were not tried out.

On March 25 de la Rosa then sent an email to Alonso setting out Ferrari’s weight distribution to two decimal places on each of Ferrari’s cars for the Australian Grand Prix.

Alonso then replied under a section headed Ferrari: “Its weight distribution surprises me; I don’t know either if it’s 100 percent reliable, but at least it draws attention.”

De la Rosa then replied: “All the information from Ferrari is very reliable. It comes from Nigel Stepney, their former chief mechanic - I don’t know what post he holds now. He’s the same person who told us in Australia that Kimi was stopping in lap 18. He’s very friendly with Mike Coughlan, our Chief Designer, and he told him that.”

The evidence then details emails from de la Rosa discussing a flexible wing, aero balance, tyre gas, Ferrari’s braking system and the team’s stopping strategy.

Furthermore, the FIA examined reports from the Italian police of call logs between Coughlan and Stepney.

The evidence said: “In total, at least 288 SMS messages and 35 telephone calls appear to have passed between Coughlan and Stepney between 11 March 2007 and 3 July 2007.”

The World Motor Sport Council found that:

"- Coughlan had more information than previously appreciated and was receiving information in a systematic manner over a period of months;

"- the information has been disseminated, at least to some degree (e.g. to Mr. De la Rosa and Mr. Alonso), within the McLaren team;

"- the information being disseminated within the McLaren team included not only highly sensitive technical information but also secret information regarding Ferrari’s sporting strategy;

"- Mr de la Rosa, in the performance of his functions at McLaren, requested and received secret Ferrari information from a source which he knew to be illegitimate and expressly stated that the purpose of his request was to run tests in the simulator;

"- the secret information in question was shared with Mr. Alonso;

"- there was a clear intention on the part of a number of McLaren personnel to use some of the Ferrari confident information in its own testing. If this was not in fact carried into effect it was only because there were technical reasons not to do so;

“- Coughlan’s role within McLaren (as now understood by the WMSC) put him in a position in which his knowledge of the secret Ferrari information would have influenced him in the performance of his duties.”

I’m sure more will be released soon.

Fyi, you sound like fools claiming this was a Ferrari conspiracy.

Also, rumors are abound that Alonso tried to blackmail Ron Dennis into making him the #1 driver over this.

[quote=“MPD47,post:22,topic:35301"”]

I’m sure more will be released soon.

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Apparently Monday is now the release date of the info, they’ve delayed it for some reason.

[quote=“MPD47,post:22,topic:35301"”]

Fyi, you sound like fools claiming this was a Ferrari conspiracy…

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Really?

Well then fools love company because practically everyone reporting it is thinking the same thing. Representation on the world council isn’t being made up. Ferrari is the only tean represented and Jon Todt played a major role in pursuing this. Why spend all this effort chasing McLaren when you have a security breach in your own house? Compare this to the only remote equivelant, MotoGP where all the manufacturers are represented (MSMA) and have a say, not just one.

But there’s no possibility of a conspiracy, right?

I mean this whole debacle was started by a Ferrari employee who set the whole thing in motion, yet somehow this is McLaren’s fault? :bloated:

Hell, Stepney should be considered a hero to Ferrari for finding a way to hand them the 2007 constructor’s championship. Maybe they should put him back on the payroll :shrug:

[quote=“MPD47,post:22,topic:35301"”]

Also, rumors are abound that Alonso tried to blackmail Ron Dennis into making him the #1 driver over this.

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Welcome to post #19. And if this rumor turns out to be true, Fernando Alonso will be cast in a whole new light. How this will affect is driving career remains to be seen, but if sentiment around the pitlane is true, there are a lot of people that have taken a new disliking to Alonso.

By Biranit Goren Saturday, September 15th 2007, 13:00 GMT

FIA president Max Mosley has questioned McLaren team chief Ron Dennis’s integrity in his dealing with the governing body during the spying affair - but Dennis himself has defended his actions by insisting he was truthful throughout.

Mosley recounted the events that led the FIA to contact the McLaren drivers and request their collaboration, which resulted in new evidence submitted to the World Motor Sport Council against McLaren.

And the FIA president believes Dennis was not telling him the whole truth on the affair.

Speaking on ITV today, Mosley said: "On the morning of the Hungarian Grand Prix, Ron rang me and he said, ‘I’ve just had Alonso in the motorhome and he says he’s got information and he’s threatening to give it to the Federation.’

"So I said, ‘What did you say Ron?’ He said, ‘I said, go on and hand it over.’

"I said, ‘Ron, you said exactly the right thing.’

"And then Ron said, ‘But there isn’t any information.’

"So I said, ‘So it’s an empty threat?’

"And he replied: ‘Yes, a completely empty threat. There’s no information, there’s nothing to come out; I can assure you that if there was something, Max, I would have told you.’

"Now this was a week after looking me in the eye in the World Council and telling me there was absolutely nothing wrong and everybody had done exactly as they should do, so I believed him.

"I’ve known Ron for 40 years; it’s very difficult for me, when somebody I’ve known for 40 years looks me in the eye and says, ‘Max, I’m telling the truth with complete sincerity’ - you believe him.

"It was only when I got the list from the Italian police [showing] 323 SMS phone calls going over a three-month period between Coughlan and Stepney, [that I concluded] there had to be more to this.

“You don’t get 300 messages arranging a visit to Honda. This is something serious. At which point, I sat down and wrote the letter to the drivers, and the rest is history.”

Dennis quickly responded to Mosley’s accusations, defending his actions and stating at the time of speaking with Mosley, he was telling the truth based on what he himself knew at the time.

“I was a little surprised by what Max said,” Dennis told ITV. "I am working hard to get closure on a very unpleasant experience that McLaren have had.

"I don’t want to get into the detail, but I do want to address one thing, and that is that when someone asks me a question - and I’ve answered some difficult questions - at the time I made those answers I told the complete truth.

"At the point of the first hearing, when I was asked the question did I know anything more, the truth was, I didn’t.

"The emails that passed between our drivers were as big a surprise to me when I heard, as anyone else - and as I said, if they existed, what I said to Fernando was that he must give them to the FIA.

"I just want to be very clear that at no stage did I ever say any lie to anybody.

“I put my integrity above everything. I just want to be very clear about that particular point.”

www.autosport.com

By Alan Baldwin Saturday, September 15th 2007, 12:46 GMT

McLaren boss Ron Dennis has defended Fernando Alonso against suggestions the Formula One champion should be fired for his role in a spying scandal that cost the team a title and $100 million.

Revealing how a row with the Spaniard on the morning of last month’s Hungarian Grand Prix triggered a phone call that led to the loss of all McLaren’s 2007 constructors’ points and a record fine, Dennis made clear on Saturday he had only one aim.

“My job is to win the world championship. My job isn’t for people to love and hug me,” he told British reporters at the Belgian Grand Prix after being asked directly why he had not fired his driver.

"If I have difficult relationships with people, I have difficult relationships with them. You don’t take your guns out and shoot people every which way.

“It’s not a love-in. I want to have positive relationships with my drivers but it’s difficult sometimes.”

While Dennis would not go into details of their meeting in Budapest, he said Alonso had mentioned e-mails in his possession that could incriminate the team in an investigation into leaked Ferrari data.

British newspaper reports on Saturday accused the 26-year-old of demanding at the meeting that the team either make him their number one driver or let him go, and threatening to go to the governing FIA.

The Guardian quoted Alonso’s manager Luis Garcia denying the reports as “complete rubbish”.

The Spaniard, reported to be seeking a return to Renault, had been stripped of pole position and demoted five places the day before for impeding 22-year-old British rookie teammate Lewis Hamilton in qualifying.

Alonso’s relationship with the team had already turned sour by then over their refusal to favour him over championship-leading Hamilton.

“Fernando arrived, pretty upset by many things. I’m not going to give you the detail,” said Dennis.

"In a conversation that took place he said ‘I have something in my e-mail system which is from one of your engineers’.

"(McLaren chief executive) Martin (Whitmarsh) and I looked at each other and Martin said ‘Fernando should inform the FIA’.

"When Fernando left, I phoned the FIA. I told them what happened and put the phone down.

“Half an hour later, Fernando’s manager came back and said ‘look I’m sorry, he was angry blah blah blah’ and retracted everything,” said Dennis.

The Briton said he again rang the FIA and after the race Alonso came to his office and apologised for what had happened.

At the end of the month, the International Automobile Federation (FIA) wrote to the McLaren drivers asking them to hand over any information they had about Ferrari technical information obtained from now-suspended chief designer Mike Coughlan.

The FIA on Friday published e-mails from the team’s test driver Pedro de la Rosa and Alonso, evidence presented at a hearing in Paris that imposed the sanctions on McLaren.

Dennis likened the Hungary incident to a domestic row when one partner says something that they did not mean and then regretted.

“That is the benefit I am giving to Fernando,” he said. “My objective is to win races. I believe that if someone says things, and subsequently retracts them and apologises, I move on.”

Dennis also dismissed a suggestion that Alonso’s behaviour towards him had been the most extreme he had experienced from a driver in 40 years in the sport.

“It’s the most extreme thing that you know about,” he said. “I could tell you some things…I would like you to understand the nature of competitive animals. They know no limit.”

Finally people are starting to see alonso for the fagboy he is. I think I’ve hated him more than Speed the past few years.

http://img1.putfile.com/main/10/27618324893.jpg

Holy crap. I feel really bad for Ron Dennis now. Fucking Alonso should be slammed.

Gotta love the Italian Police getting involved, protecting their national asset :slight_smile:

This reminds me of when Aryton Senna died, they tried to put Willams on trial for causing his death (not sure if they charged him with a degree of murder or not)

[quote=“Rx3,post:26,topic:35301"”]

Holy crap. I feel really bad for Ron Dennis now. Fucking Alonso should be slammed.

Gotta love the Italian Police getting involved, protecting their national asset :slight_smile:

This reminds me of when Aryton Senna died, they tried to put Willams on trial for causing his death (not sure if they chargged him with a degree of murder or not)

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There was a trial, I believe it was for negligence, or manslaughter, cant remember which. Italian Police going after Stephney, fine, but the Williams matter was bull shit, as would them going after Coulghan as they stated they wont.

http://www.fia.com/mediacentre/Press_Releases/FIA_Sport/2007/September/190907-01.html

http://sports.yahoo.com/nascar/news?slug=ap-nascar-juansworld&prov=ap&type=lgns

Interesting read since Montoya obviously has insider knowledge being a former member of McLaren.

I think that was more enlightening than the past hundred articles I’ve read…very interesting interview.

There’s also Raikonnen saying they listened to Ferrari Radio and Salo saying the same about Ferrari listening to McLaren. Blah blah blah.