mikes going to own the 1003 challange with that damn car… and probably with the baby seat in it still
im with mike.
even tho 100 octane is easier and safer to do with a good intercooler setup, its just as easy to keep your meth filled and get a good pump, like the ones mike sells, with a good intercooler. i fail to see how its really that unsafe or a bigger pain. for those who drive their cars a lot, meth seems more practical than buying drums of gas all the time.
you say potato, i say pototo.
i didnt read everybodies responses, but my thinking goes like this:
i have my car solid with the intercooler alone on 93octane. i have it tuned so im not going to detenate, not even close to a hint.
im planning on adding a MAP referenced injection system in the future, with a standalone FMU and timing advance box so i can switch to a meth tune on the spot. other turbo builds like mine are able to add over 50rwhp because of the meth. why:
-you can add TIMING, which is alot of freakin power on turbo cars. right now i keep my timing extremely conservative, keeping me safe, but losing power, and curve
-it will run cooler, which in turn will…
-allow me to run more boost safely
i will never fill my car up with race gas, and i will never make it so i have to reflash my computer whenever i want to change my fueling methods…thats just me
My answer to the original question is get a fmic and no dsmlink doesn’t allow you to vent your bov.
In my setup with an evo3 I have instant 25psi after 3k. The upgraded 4inch thick bar and plate intercooler with a custom air duct is not adequate enough to cool the incoming heat/air. That instant change in temperature is almost impossible to tune for in my scenario. With retarding timing a whole shitload and spraying additional fuel and reducing boost to 17psi I can run straight 93 with little knock. So I spray meth starting a 7psi and full on by 12psi to eliminate detonation. If I didn’t have such a quick spooling turbo and wasn’t pushing it way out of the efficiency range I wouldn’t run meth.
Its not so much easier but better. The pumps aquamist sells are good and set up for meth but there kit other than the controller, nozzle and pump needs improvement. But they seem to be a good company and learn from there mistakes. Plus they do offer ss braided hoses. Meth can be unsafe as in my case I will see a whole lot of knock if there isn’t a nice glass of meth in my intake when boost comes on. Otherwise byebye ringlands.
I like this discussion, should be in a new thread though. All this guy was asking was could he get the same results from a meth/water kit that he would see from a bigger intercooler. The answer is yes you could, you will decrease air inlet temps with a meth/water kit, which is what a bigger intercooler will do also. There are many variables to weigh when making a decision on what to use though, but that is the simple answer.
That being said I would go with a larger FMIC before a meth/water kit. A big ol FMIC is a no brainer, bolt it on and forget about it. You can think about a meth kit later in the game.
BTW methanol has an octane rating of about 140 not 100. That would make sense since thats what alcohol burning dragsters use.
There is a lot of ignorance in this thread. The best mixture to run is generally in the 1:1 alcohol:water range. This will depend upon the setup and the octane of the “base” fuel. Some setups should run straight water. The water, as has been stated, is not a fuel. It’s primary purpose is to cool the intake charge. Water has a very high heat of vaporization. Methanol’s is also high but 10-20% less than water. There are some chemical reactions which occur in the combustion chamber using water that promote more complete and more rapid oxidation of the fuel. I do not know how much this adds in terms of hp, but it can’t hurt. Water has no “octane” rating of it’s own because it is not combustible. But it SIGNIFICANTLY adds to the detonation resistance of gasoline when introduced into the combustion chamber. This is what allows higher boost on low octane pump fuels.
From the “Gasoline FAQ” http://www.faqs.org/faqs/autos/gasoline-faq/part3/section-1.html
7.13 What does water injection achieve?.
Water injection, as a separate liquid or emulsion with gasoline, or as a
vapour, has been thoroughly researched. If engines can calibrated to operate
with small amounts of water, knock can be suppressed, hydrocarbon emissions
will slightly increase, NOx emissions will decrease, CO does not change
significantly, and fuel and energy consumption are increased [113].
Water injection was used in WWII aviation engine to provide a large increase
in available power for very short periods. The injection of water does decrease the dew point of the exhaust gases. This has potential corrosion
problems. The very high specific heat and heat of vaporisation of water
means that the combustion temperature will decrease. It has been shown that a 10% water addition to methanol reduces the power and efficiency by about 3%, and doubles the unburnt fuel emissions, but does reduce NOx by 25% [114]. A decrease in combustion temperature will reduce the theoretical maximum possible efficiency of an otto cycle engine that is operating correctly, but may improve efficiency in engines that are experiencing abnormal combustion on existing fuels.
Some aviation SI engines still use boost fluids. The water-methanol mixtures
are used to provide increased power for short periods, up to 40% more -
assuming adequate mechanical strength of the engine. The 40/60 or 45/55
water-methanol mixtures are used as boost fluids for aviation engines because
water would freeze. Methanol is just “preburnt” methane, consequently it only
has about half the energy content of gasoline, but it does have a higher heat
of vaporisation, which has a significant cooling effect on the charge.
Water-methanol blends are more cost-effective than gasoline for combustion
cooling. The high Sensitivity of alcohol fuels has to be considered in the
engine design and settings.
Boost fluids are used because they are far more economical than using the
fuel. When a supercharged engine has to be operated at high boost, the
mixture has to be enriched to keep the engine operating without knock. The
extra fuel cools the cylinder walls and the charge, thus delaying the onset
of knock which would otherwise occur at the associated higher temperatures.
The overall effect of boost fluid injection is to permit a considerable
increase in knock-free engine power for the same combustion chamber
temperature. The power increase is obtained from the higher allowable boost.
In practice, the fuel mixture is usually weakened when using boost fluid
injection, and the ratio of the two fuel fluids is approximately 100 parts
of avgas to 25 parts of boost fluid. With that ratio, the resulting
performance corresponds to an effective uprating of the fuel of about 25%,
irrespective of its original value. Trying to increase power boosting above
40% is difficult, as the engine can drown because of excessive liquid [110].
Note that for water injection to provide useful power gains, the engine
management and fuel systems must be able to monitor the knock and adjust
both stoichiometry and ignition to obtain significant benefits. Aviation
engines are designed to accommodate water injection, most automobile engines are not. Returns on investment are usually harder to achieve on engines that do not normal extend their performance envelope into those regions. Water injection has been used by some engine manufacturers - usually as an expedient way to maintain acceptable power after regulatory emissions baggage was added to the engine, but usually the manufacturer quickly produces a modified engine that does not require water injection.
awsome thread lots of good information