ROFL
lol ibtl
I watched and listened to the disagreement for a while and was fascinated to see that the argument seemed to split between those who had some engineering or math background, all of whom said the airplane would takeoff and fly without any problem; and those with some other background, who visualized the airplane as having to push against the conveyor in order to gain speed.
I like to call them internet engineers.
As plane gets propelled forward by turbines, independent of wheel speed:
Plane maintains 1mph:
Wheel speed = 1mph (ignore the fact that wheel speed should be a radial dimension, not 1mph. It doesn’t matter for theory purposes.)
Treadmill speed = -1mph
Resulting wheel speed (plane is still moving at +1mph because turbine’s don’t care what’s going on at the wheels) = 2mph
resulting runway speed = -2mph
resulting wheel speed = 4mph
resulting runway speed = -4mph
resulting wheel speed = 8mph
resulting runway speed = -8mph
resulting wheel speed = 16mph
resulting runway speed = -16mph
resulting wheel speed = 32mph
resulting runway speed = -32mph
resulting wheel speed = 64 mph
resulting runway speed = -64 mph
resulting wheel speed = 128 mph
resulting runway speed = -128 mph
resulting wheel speed = 256mph
Keep in mind this is just the control system/wheel response due to the fact that the turbines are maintaining the plane at 1mph. In fact the plane is accelerating so all the number should be squared, but we’ll continue with the 1mph theory
resulting runway speed = -256mph
resulting wheel speed = 512mph
resulting runway speed = -512mph
resulting wheel speed = 1024mph
etc etc etc…
Wheel speed approaches infinity, wheel bearings melt, wheels fall off plane crashes.
Therefore, IT DOES NOT TAKE OFF. 
it is not the jet that causes the air to move over a wing, oh my fucking god, plz diaf, 0mygodhi2u, wtf, die, just please die, the jet causes a force to move the plane…
you are right about the AOA, it is also dependent on what you consider positive, when we did the lift experiment in Thermofluids the leading edge of the wing up was positive, down was negative.
Some really needs to find that article I was talking about earlier, Damn Second Law, Leave Mr. Bernoulli Alone, it discusses the principles of AOA and the fluid motion over the wing
ignore the rant, he has been corrected already
i think that if this was actually a feasible thing to do that the tires would fry themselves as soon as the aircraft got up to take off speeds. I dont know if im picturing things just right in my head or not, but i cant quite pinpoint in my mind what would happen. The more i think about the more i think that the treadmill example is lacking. In the treadmill example, the treadmill is going at a steady rate. But in the airplane example, the belt has the ablility to match the speed that the wheels will be spinning at, so as the plane goes faster and faster forward, the wheels will begin to spin more and the conveyor belt will spin faster and faster along with the wheels. So will the wheels REALLY be able to advance past the speed of the belt?(given the belt is perfectly exact with the timing of the movement of the wheels) This is very complicated and i dont think its as simple as everyone is thinking it is. Ive been thinking about it all day and using my skateboard example on the ppl mover as an example. Obviously if the ppl mover stays at the same speed u can push through it. But if its accelerating, then i think that it WOULD hold you back. Like i said, im not sure and would really have to see it, but i dont think that the plane would be able to go fast enough to take off, although i DO think it would move forward somewhat. The addition of friction here is ultimately the problem. If things are gonna move as fast as they would in the example, then it will indefinitely play a role.
You are thinking about it in the wrong terms. You are thinking about the plane as a whole moving against the treadmill. The only thing that the treadmill affects are the wheels. The plane is moving according to the air and the speed of their turbines.
2 entries found for indefinitely.
<b>in·def·i·nite</b> [](https://secure.reference.com/premium/login.html?rd=2&u=http%3A%2F%2Fdictionary.reference.com%2Fsearch%3Fq%3Dindefinitely) ( P ) [<b>Pronunciation Key</b>](http://dictionary.reference.com/help/ahd4/pronkey.html) (n-df-nt)
adj. Not definite, especially:
- Unclear; vague.
- Lacking precise limits: an indefinite leave of absence.
- Uncertain; undecided: indefinite about their plans
is that what you ment??
I cant believe this is still going on. Take the airplane and lift it, with a crane or something, so the wheels are off the ground. Now spin the shit out of the wheels with whatever you can. Go ahead. Spin them 70 kajillion rpms. Really when you think about it, the conveyor is just spinning the wheels. It is doing absolutely nothing to hold the plane back. The second you turn on the jet engines (and release it from the crane for those of you who want to get really literal) it is going to propel forward.
-ment
suff.
-
Action; process: appeasement.
-
Result of an action or process: advancement.
-
Means, instrument, or agent of an action or process: adornment.
[Middle English, from Old French, from Latin -mentum, n. suff.]
Is that what you meant? :wiggle:
There are 2 answers.
- The plane will take off.
- I’m a fucking retard.
I understand it’s a confusing question and you can wrap your head around it backwards because you are slow, but still, you have to eventually listen to the arguments that are being provided (that are actually true) and realize that you need to stop spewing crap from your mouth.
To the people that think the plane won’t take off, can you explain how a plane flies at all? Because by your argument, the plane needs the wheels, or the ground, or some other bullshit to move forward, but last time I flew, I’m pretty sure the wheels were stored inside the plane, some 35,000 feet above the nearest ground.
Now, since I know you all hate it because I’m always right, and as such, refuse to listen to reason when I try to school you, take a moment and take it from someone else…
:lmfao:
The problem that I think everyone who thought it wouldn’t fly (myself included)had was the idea that the treadmill would not cancel out the forward motion of the plane. Once I understood that the wheels were not a factor and came up with my rope analogy, I was able to wrap my head around the concept. I’m a marketing guy, not an engineer so I need to visualize things.
I didn’t read the whole thread but the plane will not take off.
In order to have lift, you need more than thrust. You need the air to flow over the wings. That’s why there are flaps. Without the proper air flow, the plane will be unable to lift.
Now, being on a conveyor belt, if the belt is move at the same speed as the wheels, the plane will be in a stand still. You can can definitely apply the same concept to a treadmill or on an escalator/moving sidewalk. If you’re walking at the same pace as the escalator or moving sidewalk, you are staying in one motion. If this is too complicated for you, take a RC car. If you’re applying forward power at the same velocity the moving sidewalk is coming towards you, you will not move. On the other hand, apply more power, more than the sidewalk, you will reach the opposite end eventually.
This concept can be applied to a plane. It is the same concept, just on a larger scale. If the plane is move forward while the belt is moving in opposite with the same velocity, the plane will appear to be staying still. If the plane can apply more thrust, thus moving it faster than the belt, and can gain enough momentum to have the proper air flow, it will take off. Thrust alone does not induce take off.
Once the plane is in the air, it has the engines to propel it forward, which will keep it in the air. The wheels are no longer needed once the proper speed is reached.
It’s ok, marketing guys are excused from trying to solve problems involving concepts that are more than 2 sylabuls. :mamoru:
uh oh
:sigh:
When will people figure out that walking on a treadmill involves creating forward motion in an entirely different method than an airplane moving forward.
Yea, a car on a treadmill wouldn’t ever go anywhere, but guess what, an airplane isn’t a car you dumb shit.
ur thinking of it in a perfect world man. Also in this example, it is impossible for the wheels to move faster then the belt, thats the only way it can move on the belt without dragging the wheels. The key here is that the treadmill is ALWAYS moving at the same speed as the wheels which means that it will always just want to stand still and then friction comes into play and will hold the plane back. Put more thought into it, its not an easy problem
But the wheels dont propel the plane. Think about this: If you put a jet engine on the back of a car, will it do a burnout?