Writeup of Nelson Ledges FunDay, 9/17/2011

NYSpeed Automotive
1

First, reserving this space to write something more detailed for when my mind is not wiped from 120+ miles on track and getting up at 5am to drive 3 hours there, go lapping, then 3 hours home. Someone mentioned it being a fast track, they are very correct. It’s far from simple though. I’d get a couple corners “just right” per lap, but couldn’t seem to string together one lap with all good corners. By the end of the day I was averaging over 70mph though according to the data logger.

For now I’m just going to thrown up a quick video of a few laps, one of the few where I cracked 120 on the back straight (120.9 on data logger). That is an insanely fun course. Expect something more eloquent tomorrow.

720P HD AVAILABLE IF YOU WATCH ON YOUTUBE!

(My friend John went with me and rode shotgun, so that’s the conversations you’re hearing)

EDIT: 9/19
Ok, a little better review. First, it’s about 3 hours from Buffalo and a really easy drive. 90 West to the Youngstown exit (#228), 11 south to 82 west to 422. 11 and 82 are both divided highways and 422 is a divided parkway. By the time you get off 422 onto 2 lane roads you’re only a couple miles from the track. 11 is under construction right now and 1 lane in several spots but being so early in the morning to be at the track by 8:30 it wasn’t an issue. And unlike NY, OH leaves the speed limit 65 in the one lane sections right up until you get to the section where workers are out. :tup:

The track itself is a little rough but nothing that bothered me or upset the car. There are subtle elevation changes and several corners have proper banking. Unlike Dunnville which seemed to have a bunch of the same too slow corners Nelson has lots of fast sweepers with enough subtle differences in banking and apex that none of them feel the same. Even after 5 twenty minute sessions I left knowing there was still a ton of time I was leaving on the course, which makes for a fun and challenging day. I can’t say enough about how fun this track is to run. Even after a boring 3 hour highway slog home I needed a couple drinks and some hot tub time to drain out the adrenaline and get to bed.

The $130 FunDay included an ambulance on site, all corner worker stations staffed and a track recovery truck. Happily none of the emergency or recovery services were used and the corner workers had a quiet day with only a couple spins and one minor off track excursion. Myself I managed to get through the day only dipping one tire slightly off on the inside of turn 1. Nelson has a snack shack that was open during the day with your typical griddle cooked track foods. Free air was also available but the fuel pumps that were on site were not open. I ended up having to go get gas after my 4th session, causing me to miss my groups 5th session. I still got in a 5th session with my group but skipped the final session of the day where they ran a mixed A and B group. I had just come in from my last session when they announced the mixed group and thought it would be pushing my luck asking my basically stock car to run what would be almost a 40 minute session. This didn’t bother me at all because after 5 twenty minute sessions with nothing by a stock seatbelt holding me in place I was borderline deliriously tired.

Being a Nelson newbie I did take my first session in the training group. Basically groups A and B ran, then they ran a group just with the newbies (two of us) where we followed the track instructor for 2 laps then had the track to ourselves for the rest of the 20 minute session while the instructor observed. After the session we did about 15-20 minutes in a classroom and were told by the instructor that he was confident in rolling us into the B group. The rest of the day ran only groups A and B. I only ended up giving point by’s twice while overtaking lots of times but without race rubber I didn’t think I was ready to play in the A group.

I’m really tempted to try and get one more day in there before the season is over, especially since I got a coupon for $30 off my next FunDay for completing the training class. They have FunDays scheduled for the 16th and 22nd of October so depending on the weather I may try and make one of those.

2

Looks like an absolute blast. Man I would so love to do a track event if I just had something worthy of tracking :shock:

3

Nice! I miss Dunnville so much. I knew this summer I most likely wouldn’t make it to any track day but next summer for sure.

4

Nelson made me miss Dunnville a lot less. Had way more fun running around Nelson. Lots of much faster turns vs a bunch of small straights connected with far to sharp and similar corners.

Another vid, got the lap timing working.

https://youtu.be/u44Ng_pufNs

5

Glad you had fun. I miss going to Nelson a lot. Dunno if you want any critique or not, here’s what I saw in a few laps if you care. Your line through the final complex 11-13 is good, you can be even earlier on the apex in 13. Your line through the entire place looks good, however your turn in on most corners there is a bit early, especially in 1. Wait a hair longer to turn in and keep the apex at about the same point and you’ll carry more speed into 2. You want to make that more of a Double apex than a turn, straight, apex, (1-2) if you can. The last two things are you’re consistently off the apex in the Kink, which is hurting you a lot, but with street tires etc, I understand being tentative through there completely. Also, track out slightly less in the carousel before making your second turn into the apex to hit the back straight, despite the camber, it’s pretty greasy out there. Keep it about 2ft off the center line on the track.

6

Thanks for the tips because I’m definitely going back there. Carousel is one of those turns that is so challenging to get just right. And the kink… I knew what I wanted to do but it was a problem of having the balls and timing to do it at 90-100 mph.

The turn just before oak tree I kept telling myself I could carry more speed through but couldn’t seem to get my mind to commit to it all day. Everytime I’d end up braking the same amount.

For a track that doesn’t look that technical there sure are a lot of challenging turns. I got $30 off my next funday there for completing their “school”. School was following their instructor for a 60ish mph lap, having him watch me for a session, then about 15 minutes of classroom time. It was nice to have someone who really knew the track go over it though.

7

Nice write up, that is a quick course, and like you said, it really looks like it takes guts to go flat out. I am definitely more interested in going there

8

Very cool stuff. Looks like a blast. :tup:

9

Any time I have a bad lap or feel that I want to make my turn in much later (for example in turn one and two) I just take it slow the next lap to get a feel for how the car feels with that line.

JayS If you plan on going to the event on the 15th there I would be very interested to see if the line I run in my car would benefit you. My line might be a bit different because I am front drive. Much of what MPD suggested is stuff that I have picked up from my day there last week. Especially turning in a bit later at 1 it really sets you up nice for turn 2. I still have trouble with 13 though I have not quite figured it out so I just take it nice and slow so I don’t destroy my LF tire. Glad to hear you had fun. Hopefully it was a less eventful day than when I was there last sunday.

10

One of the best pieces of advice I ever got to find the fast line/semi-correct line…Pick a higher gear like 4th and run the entire track in just that gear for a lap or two. It forces you to maintain what speed you have seeing as you’ll have shit acceleration, which in turn typically seems to give you the race line. Once you got that line, apply speed.

11

There’s certainly truth in this. When I was going through video and got the lap timer working I noticed some of my best times were when I got stuck behind a track prepped Miata. Since he had so little power carrying speed was huge for him, and since I was behind him not romping on the throttle so much I’d end up carrying more speed too.

12

Well, you followed rule #1 for tacking a DD: Be able to drive the car home.

Agree with everyone else:
-Turn in later for turn 1, spend less time at the inside of the track
-Turn 2 use all that extra paved section, don’t drive toward it, when you start taking 2 fast enough you will NEED it
-I overbrake for Oak Tree too, but it’s nice when I get into late braking contest to have a little extra left. It’s actually a lightly banked turn.
-Carousel has always been a pain for, especially the middle. Always feels like 8/10ths as the car doesn’t want to take a set. Double Apex and aim for that concrete patch inside apex on exit.
-Kink, you have 20 mph on me be before it, and then 20 mph less going through it
-12-13, everyone says take 12 fast and give up a little for 13, I say give up a little for 12 and take 13 fast. (You want to spend the least amount of time at the slowest corner).

What distance does your track timer give for Nelson, I know that it is less than their advertised 2.0 miles.?

13

Ok, updated the first post with a better review.

I’ll have to get back to you on how many miles it is for one lap because there was a bug in the timer software. For some reason the start/finish trigger wasn’t working so I was getting one 19-20 minute “lap”. I was able to set a start/finish point in Dashware to get the timer working so I’m sure one of the gauges can show distance. I’ll play with it tonight and worst case I’ll take a lap’s time vs average speed and just calculate out the mileage. As for the kink, that was clearly a case of balls being < skill and car. I knew the car could take it faster, I knew I was capable of driving it faster if I would just turn in a little later and carry a little more speed, but self preservation kept kicking in causing me to brake more than I needed. At 120mph that turn is coming up at a speed I’m not used to judging. :slight_smile:

14

Awesome! Wish I had my Mustang here…would love to hit up one of those October events as I’ve never had my car on a track with turns.

How did the GTO feel out there?

15

Where’s the Mustang?

The GTO felt great out there. I’ve said before that it’s a little awkward to autocross with but really comes alive on a road course. It’s very planted and stable. If anything I’d like to dial in a little more oversteer because at the limit it starts to push. I had started to swap out the rear springs the night before the event but the rubber bushings for the rear shocks are seized on the shaft and I was afraid I was going to destroy them getting them off. Since I had no backup I decided to wait until after the event before I got really aggressive trying to get them off. Before I do anything to change the understeer issue I’ve got to see what fixing the soft and sagging rear springs does.

16

In Minnesota…I did a swap with my dad for the summer as I drove the '55 back here:)

17

Looks like a good time :tup:

18

Looks like you didnt share your laptimes in harrys, what was your best lap? The video turned out great, the overlay you chose is much better than what I used.

19

The lap times were broken in Harry’s. I was getting one 20 minute lap. Another guy there had the same problem after he deleted his unspecified track he created with just a start/finish trigger and downloaded the Nelson Ledges track from the server. I’m going to email them tonight about it. I did figure out how to set a start/finish in Dashware so I could see the lap times via the video but haven’t gone through all the sessions yet. Fastest I’ve seen so far was a 1:24.

Overall I’m still really impressed with the combination of the GoPro and Harry’s Lap Timer. Next time I’ll just create an unspecified track and set the start/finish trigger myself.

20

So was your video from the gopro with the harrys overlay? I gave up on dashware, I kept running into issues with the trial version so I didnt bother purchasing. I just use my gopro without any overlay.