Rendell FTL

Sweet…I say get some of the deadbeats off of welfare…just the piles of shit that work the system…it is there for a reason not for people to live off it their entire life(people who have a disability are another story)

http://www.postgazette.com/pg/07036/759551-85.stm

Rendell to ask sales tax increase
Allegheny County would rise to 8 percent; property tax to fall
Monday, February 05, 2007

By Tom Barnes, Post-Gazette Harrisburg Bureau

HARRISBURG – Facing “an extraordinarily difficult budget year,” Gov. Ed Rendell is expected to propose increasing the 6 percent state sales tax to 7 percent when he unveils his 2007-08 budget tomorrow.

The sales tax in Allegheny and Philadelphia counties, already at 7 percent, would go to 8 percent.

Over the course of a year, the move would raise about $1.4 billion in additional funds for the state.

Sen. Gibson Armstrong, R-Lancaster, who heads the Senate Appropriations Committee, said yesterday that Mr. Rendell recently told him that he wants to increase the sales tax. The governor would use some of the additional revenue for property tax relief for homeowners and the rest to offset other rising costs, such as medical assistance for the poor.

Two Democratic officials who asked to remain anonymous, one in the House and one in the Senate, said they’d also heard about the higher sales tax plan.

Mr. Armstrong said higher taxes will be a tough sell in the Legislature. Many of the 55 new House and Senate members ran on a no-tax-increase platform last year, he noted.

“I think a sales tax increase will be extremely difficult for people on both sides of the aisle to vote for,” Mr. Armstrong said. “I don’t think legislators from Pittsburgh and Philadelphia would be for it. Their areas would go to 8 percent.”

Sen. Jay Costa, D-Forest Hills, said, “I heard there could be something along those lines in the budget, but we need to see how the additional tax revenue would be used before considering whether to support such a measure. It’s imperative that most or all of it go for property tax relief.”

Sen. Sean Logan, D-Monroeville, said there is only one way he might support a sales tax increase – if all the additional revenue is used to lower property taxes. A citizens group called STOP, with strong ties to the Monroeville area, has been pushing for the total elimination of property taxes.

The only positive aspect to the sales tax, Mr. Armstrong said, is that people have discretion over whether they buy big-ticket items, and thus pay more tax.

But many critics said the sales tax poses a heavier burden for lower-income people.

The House Finance Committee chairman, Rep. David Levdansky, D-Forward, said money has to come from somewhere to cover rising state expenses in fiscal year 2007-08, which starts July 1.

“This is going to be an extraordinarily difficult budget year,” he said, with an additional $1.7 billion needed just for rising medical assistance and welfare spending for the poor. Another problem is that the current 2006-07 budget won’t produce much of a surplus, he said, in contrast to significant surpluses in the last two years.

Rendell press secretary Kate Philips refused to comment yesterday, but according to legislators and staff members, Mr. Rendell wants to use about half of the additional sales tax revenue, or $700 million, to reduce property taxes, with the rest going for rising state expenses, such as medical assistance for the poor.

Under a law enacted last year, $200 million from the state lottery is being used to extend rent/property tax relief to more low-income senior citizens, but middle-income homeowners haven’t gotten any property tax relief yet. Mr. Rendell thinks that up to $1 billion in relief will become available in about two years, once all 14 slot machine casinos are fully operating in the state.

House Democratic leader Bill DeWeese has previously proposed increasing the sales tax to either 6.5 percent or 7 percent, as a “tax shifting” idea to lower property taxes. The idea seemed to have some support among Democrats, who now control the House by a slim 102-101 margin.

Mr. Rendell is not expected to propose expanding the base of the sales tax by taxing items that are now tax-exempt, such as food and clothing. Some House Republicans tried to do that last year and it failed.

A higher sales tax won’t be Mr. Rendell’s only revenue-raising idea tomorrow. To expand health care coverage to the uninsured, he has already called for a higher cigarette tax and a first-time tax on cigars and smokeless tobacco.

And that’s not all. A recent transportation funding report called for the state to spend an additional $1.7 billion a year to improve state roads, bridges and mass transit. Mr. Rendell is expected to propose a series of revenue-raising options to deal with that problem – but not a further hike in the sales tax.

One of the options could be the sale or long-term lease of the Pennsylvania Turnpike, which the governor has said could fetch anywhere from $2 billion to $30 billion.

Budgeting for 2007-08 is also complicated by the ongoing phaseout of the capital stock and franchise tax on businesses, Mr. Levdansky said. That tax, now 4.9 mills on a company’s physical assets, is scheduled to drop by 1 mill this year, which will cost the state $200 million, he said.

“Without much of a surplus on June 30, plus the loss of that tax revenue and rising medical assistance costs, we are going to face a very challenging budget year,” he said.

:down:

when will they learn… less taxes = more consumer spending = more tax revenues

would you rather have 8% of 75 or 7% of 100

Rendell press secretary Kate Philips refused to comment yesterday, but according to legislators and staff members, Mr. Rendell wants to use about half of the additional sales tax revenue, or $700 million, to reduce property taxes, with the rest going for rising state expenses, such as medical assistance for the poor.

Not sure how I feel about this one. They are actually proposing a tax shift - shifting the burden from the property owner to the consumer and generating the same revenue.

This would lower mortgages and rents. So, buying power would not really be decreased. But it would definitely encourage you to buy property instead of retail goods.

I guess I would believe it if they proposed the property tax DECREASE first.

It’s still “cheating Peter to pay Paul”. Consumers make up more of a number of Pennsylvanians, and more tax revenue is generated through purchases other than real estate. It would be smarter to actually lower property taxes by a small margin and lower sales taxes together.

The decrease in both taxes would more than make up for the lost tax revenues by creating more business, and spurring an economics growth. But then again certain political parties only see economics one way… tax tax tax

While I don’t agree with what Rendell is doing, you are simply spouting economic theory that one would learn in a simple college level economics class. Just because a 1 or 200 level class SAYS that reducing taxes would spur economic growth, in actuality there are far more issues pertinent to it. So please, don’t just come out with a gross generalization that says “Lower Taxes! If you do, we’ll spend more!” because that is rarely, if ever, solely the case.

Makes sense to me.

This is classic Democrat tax-and-spend thuggery. Let’s stick in casinos, then we’ll raise your taxes too. Great!

I’ll tell ya what…lower taxes and I’ll save more! :ugh2:

Actually I’m spoutting off trickle down economics, which is hardly entry level. I’m spoutting laws of ecomoics not theory, take a look back about 20 years or so, and see what happend to the economy after taxes were reduced. You’ll notice nothing but economic growth.

Easiest way to create a government surplus is reduce government spending in areas where it’s not needed currently, and reduce taxation.

Give me a list of courses you took and what university you attended, and I’ll tell you exactly how knowledgable you are in the realm of economics. Also please state real life experience with economics in a business environment, and how taxation has affected you, your co-workers, your employer, and employees.

Trickle down economics is most certainly an entry level theory. Anything you learn in a non-economics based major is entry level. Then again, if that is what you want to call what you just typed, then very well :ugh: Just because you read “The Wealth of Nations” doesn’t make you an economist :rofl:

So, if you want to discuss what you are trying to talk about, which is supply-side econ, then please, go right ahead. But remember who coined the term Trickle-Down econ, it was Reagan’s budget director, and well all know how well Reaganomics worked for this country.

So yes, trickle down is great! Let’s reduce the taxes on corporations and the rich, that will help us the most. What a great idea! Wow!

And please, I know exactly how knowledgable I am in the realm of economics. I deal with economics every day, both in government and private business entities. I don’t need to sit here and glorify or rationalize myself in front of you, of all people, in a realm that I am completely comfortable in and more than well versed in.

And also, how are you going to tell me how well versed I am in econ based on university and classes taken? You’re a cell phone salesman with a lying habit. Simmer down.

Actually, sorry not in cellular, been kind of out of that for some time. It also was a great income, when I got into management and recruiting, so it definitely shows your ignorance to the world.

Yes, tax breaks for the corporations and rich most definitely benefit the world more than it would for someone like yourself who is probably in a lower bracket.

If I own a company, and I am the beneficiary of a tax cut. What’s that mean to me? It means I have more revenue to reinvest back into my business, which in turn could allow me to expand, open more jobs, and be more productive into the economy. That’s common sense.

Last time I checked, Reagan was the reason we seen any economic growth in the 1990s. If you feel Clinton spurred any growth then youre sadly mistaken. A President cannot grow an economy in a year, nor can he destroy it. Affects of a President take years to be seen.

Another thing we need to get rid of are Unions… all of them. Parasites to our Nation and the reason for outsourcing. Hell, I don’t blame corporations for getting away from Unions. Worker at a Ford plant last year made $73/hr to ensure lugnuts were tight enough after vehicle production. $73/hr for that bullshit job, just because of his time in? Unions, protecting the unskilled worker for far too long.

So don’t even lecture me on economics boy. Until you get your head out of your ass, and don’t take every thing, word for word out of a text book, get out in the real world, make a decent income, own property that you pay taxes on, manage actual employees who have families to support, then you can actually contribute a useful opinion on the economy.

Until you fully contribute, keep your mouth shut

:rofl: :rofl: :bowrofl: Wow. It’s almost incomprehensible that you could be that stupid.

Back away from the Republican rhetoric, and realize that Reagan single handedly drove this country into the immense trade deficit with his Reaganomics.

The fact that you can even attempt to argue that point is pure insanity.

And listen here mother fucker, you don’t know a fucking thing about whether I own a house, property, a business, or any of that.

I manage employees every day that look to me to ensure their lifestyle and ability to live.

I don’t have to lie to get away with anything on this board. People on here know exactly what I do, what I run, what I own and what I do.

You are a known liar and someone who thinks they can somehow intimidate me by simply stating an economic THEORY and then having absolutely nothing to back it up outside of a guy making big money tightening lugnuts.

Hopefully you rationalize and argue as well as you fuck, and we won’t ever have to worry about little liars like you running around in this world.

You know absolutely nothing about anything on how our system works.
I know more about you than you think. I’m not going to fall to your level of name calling, it just shows how small of a person you really are. You don’t own anything. Does that mean you can’t have your own opinion? Of course not, develop ideas all you want. But I’m sorry kid, you’re incredibly dumb when it comes to this topic.

I don’t usually get involved in these threads, nor am i going to get involved in your pissing match with ZO6. Also, i do not normally pull out the old fart factor, but in this case i will make an exception. I have to disagree with your opinion here 442, I lived through Reaganomics. I also lived through the Carter years(bought my first home during the Carter term). Reagan did a lot of shit i did not agree with, but his economic policies worked. The revenue flowing into the Government coffers doubled between 1980 and 1990. Same thing on a smaller scale when JFK did it. Some of the profs at Pitt may not like this concept (my son goes to Pitt, i know what some of the profs are like), but the facts speak for themselves. Problem is, an out of control congress spent all the damn money.

Which brings me to the original posting on this thread. Fast Eddy is going to fuck us once again. I cannot believe that this thug got elected again. One of the reasons (there are many) that health care costs are spiraling is Government money. When the Government pumps $$ into something, there is no incentive to control costs and spending. Tell someone that their health care is free form the government, then they will run to the ER if they have the sniffles. Tell them that they have to cough up 100 bucks and they will take sudafed until they feel better. So Eddy wants to dump more money into this black hole?:finger2:
Secondly, the property tax decrease is nothing but Bullshit. Raise the sales tax and give PARTIAL property tax relief? Right. In 5 yers the property tax will be right back where it is today, PLUS we will have the increased sales tax. The only RIGHT way to do a tax shift is E-LIM-I-NATE property taxes. Forever. Make them go away. I would support that 100%. Raise it 1-2% and eliminate ALL sales tax exemptions. (the state spends millions on exemption compliance that is a waste…no exemptions, no need to spend that money). There have been studies that illustrate that the property tax could be eliminated with this scenario. If you want to see school district spending brought under control, then eliminate the property tax.
AS to the state budget, thats also a bunch of bullshit. CUT THE FUCKER! Stop spending (wasting) so much damn money. There is NO reason for the rate of spending increases to outpace inflation every single year.
ARRRGGGHHH…this shit makes me crazy…fucking politicians

my hats off to you sir, bravo

here is the problem with the trickle down effect.
on paper it looks good…but in the real work it doesn;t always work out as planned

you stated…

the KEY word in this statement is COULD

& the problem right now is that with the state of our nation & economy , people don’t want to expand, invest etc…

so in that situation what do you do…because its whats happening right now…the rich are getting richer the poor…poorer & middle america is carrying the burden of the country.

But middle America has ALWAYS carried the burden. It is OUR hard earned dollars that douche bags like $pendell confiscate and redistribute to deadbeats, and to his connected buddies.

then you limit your ability to take on more business. If you don’t take on more business you can lose customer base. Lose customer base, you can run the risk of going out of business. If you can’t expand or keep up with certain demands in “some” industries, then time to move on. Which is why trickle down is a great system to spurr economic growth.

I don’t know which industry you deal with, but my customers are all engineering, IT, cad/design, and manufacturing based, and I’m not seeing any issues with them expanding, at least in this geographic.

But I’ll humor you… in a situation like you describe is where another Republican idea should come into play. Standard tax rate, no more brackets.

Yes, the poor will pay more, but arent they not the biggest beneficiary of government programs? If you take more from the kettle, you should throw more (% wise) in. They’ll still be ahead of the game.

Or those who just barely make more than a qualifying amount. Well, thats where the American Dream comes in. Get to work an hour earlier, make a bit more, work harder, get noticed and get a promotion. If you can argue that logic then there is no helping you (not you, but you understood).

It’s not fair to those who made something of theirselves to give more of a % of their hard work than those who did not. Everyone has the capability, it’s just those who have the will to make it happen.

:rofl: @ Blue the economist.

Trickle down economics is bullshit. If you cut corporate taxes, corporations may or may not reinvest. They may or may not raise their wages.

If you want to get money into the hands on the consumer, there are far more direct/successful ways to do so.

That being said, taxes aren’t the problem. Its the government’s out of control spending.

ending welfare and mandating biofuels so that our farmers are growing our energy (vastly increasing the tax base, ending demand for mid-east oil, ending farming subsidies) would do far more than any tax cut on any level.

lol @ your rich, suburban ass talking about the American dream. and lol @ “raise the taxes on the poor”. If they’re depending on govt handouts, what makes you think they can afford to pay higher taxes.