Hardly. My pre auth was denied 5 consecutive years in a row despite the same diagnosis of a lifelong condition. Each time purposely stalling out the process because the longer they can go each year not providing me the medication (and making me sick) the more money they save. Why make doctors go through pre-auth processes year after year in the first place, other than to deny rightful care and save money? The government may be inefficient, but they’re not actively opposing you.
Tell me again about how bad your pre auth denial is?
And no, the the money you save from not having to pay for health insurance isn’t going to come close to the amount you’re going to be taxed under Bernie. First of all, that employer paid health isn’t just going to magically show up in your paycheck because you company is going to have it’s taxes hiked 2-3x as much as the big tax hike individuals are going to get hit with. It’s a 15.3 TRILLION DOLLAR tax hike. If you’re currently a contributing member of society expect that your spending power is going to take one hell of a hit when prices go up to cover all the new taxes.
I love how as soon as someone brings up math the liberals either go silent or change the subject and yell really loud to distract people away from the actual question.
Don’t you dare say something like that, lol. They’ll respond with a mean meme!
Agreed. It’s really annoying, and that’s coming from a Bernie supporter.
I have a hard time with many of his ideas simply due to the fact that there is an astronomical cost involved. But guess what, not one of these politicians are peddling a plan that could actually work (or pass) within the potent fog of congress. They will all be diluted or completely dropped. That being said, I’m more interested in someone’s character when they run for office. Bernie seems to be the one who truly goes to work because he wants to make the country better for his fellow man. Hillary and Cruz are almost certainly self serving.
Trump vs Sanders would be an awesome slap in the face to politics in general so that’s what I’d love to see happen.
Hahahahahhahahaha you honestly believe that most employers of for profit companies will see that extra $5-10k and think, hey we should just give this to the employee? No way. Maybe some smaller shops but for most larger corporations, their staff is suddenly not getting even half that as a raise. Just like when a president cuts federal taxes and the states still bone us by raising their rates so we still pay the same.
Joelster > this thread
Joelster for prez, independent party! Ill be your VP.
Especially when you take into account all the new taxes they’ll be paying, so they won’t actually be saving 5-10k/year per employee.
- Senator Sanders (I-VT) would enact a number of policies that would raise payroll taxes and individual income taxes, especially on high-income households.
- Senator Sanders’s plan would raise tax revenue by $13.6 trillion over the next decade on a static basis. However, the plan would end up collecting $9.8 trillion over the next decade when accounting for decreased economic output in the long run.
- A majority of the revenue raised by the Sanders plan would come from a new 6.2 percent employer-side payroll tax, a new 2.2 percent broad-based income tax, and the elimination of tax expenditures relating to healthcare.
- According to the Tax Foundation’s Taxes and Growth Model, the plan would significantly increase marginal tax rates and the cost of capital, which would lead to 9.5 percent lower GDP over the long term.
- On a static basis, the plan would lead to 10.56 percent lower after-tax income for all taxpayers and 17.91 percent lower after-tax income for the top 1 percent. When accounting for reduced GDP, after-tax incomes of all taxpayers would fall by at least 12.84 percent.
http://taxfoundation.org/article/details-and-analysis-senator-bernie-sanders-s-tax-plan
On the topic of health insurance cost vs economic viability:
I have 12 employees currently and am interviewing for more, and I definitely factor employment taxes and health insurance costs into their total gross pay. If I pay you $50k/yr, I owe roughly 7% back as employment taxes which is government mandated, adding $3,500/yr. If I then pay for 100% of your mid-to-high tier health insurance plan, I’m out another $5,000/yr or so. Therefore, it costs me $58,500 roughly to employ a $50,000 annual employee before I give them a 3% 401k contribution benefit. As a business owner, if I am not profitable, I employ no one, so I need to factor their total gross cost into my expenses or it would be entirely irresponsible economically. So, yes, if it was legal (it is currently not) for me to negotiate with an employee to forgo health insurance or to buy a cheaper plan in exchange for higher salary, I would gladly do that because I can add that assumed benefit to the employees salary and it may not change my total gross cost. Don’t be blind to your employer being a human being too regardless of size.
That said, if Bernie’s plan gets passed, my health insurance cost per employee turns into a percentage of revenues which would more than triple my health insurance cost per employee at my company’s size currently and theoretically would be worse in the future (do the math, it’s all public). Therefore, my total gross cost per employee would increase to around $70k instead of around $60k providing what is likely worse care over the longer run (ie: England’s doctor strikes), before I even get hammered on the additional income taxes instated. My economically viable market rate adjusted salary for the employee that I might hire at $50k gross salary right now would fall immediately to $40k gross salary, but with McDonalds paying $15/hr in this Bernie-land scenario, there would be massive inflation in the wage base and your money will be worth less since basic goods and services (ie: food, rent, utilities) will increase in price due to larger demand and higher operating costs, plus my skilled tech employees would be making hardly more than they would be burger flippers. The only other action is to keep my salaries competitive even though it is far more expensive to do so by raising salaries to compete with market wages in low-skill fields, but in order to do that, I’d need to raise the pricing for my company’s services 25-40% which would have a massive negative impact on the local businesses who pay me to do their marketing and thus feed further into the cycle of inflation.
That’s before my income tax bracket would be pushed from what currently is over a 35% effective rate to easily 50-70% effective rate under the Bernie proposals, but I’ll ignore that for now, because somehow that’s the least damaging part of this entire discussion even though it’s still overwhelmingly damaging.
Get some skin in the game, hire some people and provide some jobs and you might see things differently. I was raised poor as fuck in a Democrat heavy blue collar family with nothing and decided not to repeat that behavior. I dropped out of college to save on debt and started my business instead because I didn’t feel like staying poor. I had to work more than a few 80+ hour weeks along the way to get even this far, but hard work pays off. Punishing economic creation and viability will stifle you whether you want to do what I’ve done or whether you want to work for someone whether you believe it or not. You may just not be able to see it from where you sit today.
This seems to be the thing all of my pro Bernie friends lack 
This is the crux. I don’t fault Bernie supporters for not seeing things the same way as I do, they’re voting for their own self interests the same as I am. But they’ll never see things differently because they’ll never stop listening to the people telling them that they “can’t.”
Seriously well spoken, and while I don’t have the same number of employees, I’m in exactly the same position you describe.
Yep. This is what a lot of people don’t see behind his speeches.
Very well put. The thing that pisses me off is that his plan wants to give free college to everyone but leaves people behind that have worked through and made it. I can’t get on board with that when people who worked their lives to build up a successful life still get punished for doing too well and not being able to write off student loan interest and seeing the loan practices allowed. Why not fix what people are being screwed by first is my thought. I have worked hard my whole life but now I am getting more and more screwed for doing well by people who decided to not work as hard as I did. Fuck that. I don’t mind assistance and help and social programs unlike some of the GOP policies but there needs to be some middle ground.
But where’s Joe with a comeback meme?
Joe, can you explain post #210 please? Bernie said everything would be great! Everything is supposed to be free so why would Josh have to pay so much as a business owner? Is he part of the EVIL 1% rawrr!
live now on wben
… and nothing ground breaking said
I only have two kidneys. I haven’t heard of these fellas.
Trump is terrifying for the same reasons I think Obama is terrifying: the expansion of executive power. “If you won’t do what I want, then I’ll do it myself!”
Anyway, when Bernie is president what will you all major in when you go back to school for free? I’m not sure yet.
Here is another case of Bernie.
Verizon workers are on strike. 40,000 workers mostly in the union for their older telco/copper business.
Bernie is on board saying Verizon is the worst company, doesn’t invest in anything, doesn’t want to negiogate and give people proper pay… Here is Verizon’s CEO response with facts and a pretty interesting viewpoint and reaction to this…
https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/feeling-bern-reality-facts-verizon-moral-economy-lowell-mcadam
I’m not here to get involved in a political debate, I have no interest in doing so, but this article is garbage.