America needs to learn from Australia

Excerpts from an on going debate in Australia .
This is true and can be checked at

Muslims who want to live under Islamic Sharia law were told on Wednesday to get out of Australia , as the government targeted radicals in a bid to head off potential terror attacks.
A day after a group of mainstream Muslim leaders pledged loyalty to Australia and her Queen at a special meeting with Prime Minister John Howard, he and his Ministers made it clear that extremists would face a crackdown. Treasurer Peter Costello, seen as heir apparent to Howard, hinted that some radical clerics could be asked to leave the country if they did not accept that Australia was a secular state, and its laws were made by parliament. “If those are not your values, if you want a country which has Sharia law or a theocratic state, then Australia is not for you”, he said on National Television.

“I’d be saying to clerics who are teaching that there are two laws governing people in Australia : one the Australian law and another Islamic law that is false. If you can’t agree with parliamentary law, independent courts, democracy, and would prefer Sharia law and have the opportunity to go to another country, which practices it, perhaps, then, that’s a better option”, Costello said.

Asked whether he meant radical clerics would be forced to leave, he said those with dual citizenship could possibly be asked to move to the other country. Education Minister Brendan Nelson later told reporters that Muslims who did not want to accept local values should “clear off. Basically people who don’t want to be Australians, and who don’t want, to live by Australian values and understand them, well then, they can basically clear off”, he said.

Separately, Howard angered some Australian Muslims on Wednesday by saying he supported spy agencies monitoring the nation’s mosques.
Quote: “IMMIGRANTS, NOT AUSTRALIANS, MUST ADAPT. Take It Or Leave It. I am tired of this nation worrying about whether we are offending some individual or their culture. Since the terrorist attacks on Bali , we have experienced a surge in patriotism by the majority of Australians.”

“However, the dust from the attacks had barely settled when the ‘politically correct’ crowd began complaining about the possibility that our patriotism was offending others. I am not against immigration, nor do I hold a grudge against anyone who is seeking a better life by coming to Australia .” “However, there are a few things that those who have recently come to our country, and apparently some born here, need to understand.” “This idea of Australia being a multi-cultural community has served only to dilute our sovereignty and our national identity. And as Australians, we have our own culture, our own society, our own language and our own lifestyle.”
“This culture has been developed over two centuries of struggles, trials and victories by millions of men and women who have sought freedom”

“We speak mainly ENGLISH, not Spanish, Lebanese, Arabic, Chinese, Japanese, Russian, or any other language. Therefore, if you wish to become part of our society … Learn the language!”
“Most Australians believe in God. This is not some Christian, right wing, political push, but a fact, because Christian men and women, on Christian principles, founded this nation, and this is clearly documented. It is certainly appropriate to display it on the walls of our schools. If God offends you, then I suggest you consider another part of the world as your new home, because God is part of our culture.”
“We will accept your beliefs, and will not question why. All we ask is that you accept ours, and live in harmony and peaceful enjoyment with us.”
"If the Southern Cross offends you, or you don’t like “A Fair Go”, then you should seriously consider a move to another part of this planet. We are happy with our culture and have no desire to change, and we really don’t care how you did things where you came from. By all means, keep your culture, but do not force it on others.
“This is OUR COUNTRY, OUR LAND, and OUR LIFESTYLE, and we will allow you every opportunity to enjoy all this. But once you are done complaining, whining, and griping about Our Flag, Our Pledge, Our Christian beliefs, or Our Way of Life, I highly encourage you take advantage of one other great Australian freedom,
‘THE RIGHT TO LEAVE’.”

this is RETARDED!!!

probably one of the dumbest things ive read this week.

makes no sense…

this goes for this article & for america…they say they don’t want a “theocratic state”…they they go on & say that austraila was founded & based on christianity… so is America… well guess whats a therocracy.
when we can’t seperate church & state then that is like a theocratic state

maybe we can kick all the catholics out of america…that would be great.

why is there alway enough religion to insite wars but never enough to instill tolerance?

like i always say…

“please god, save me from your followers”

It’s not about kicking anyone out. It’s about people adapting to America, rather than America adapting to the people that come here.

Maybe you’re right…we should just tolerate everything right to our demise. Look at all the great things Islam has done for the middle east…
http://www.newsmax.com/archives/articles/2005/6/24/101032.shtml

i’m not pro islam… i’m anti religion period…i’m tired of christians thinking they know everything & push thier religion on everyone.
I live here & i feel i have the right to have my own beliefs…I have already freed my mind , if you want to live in society as a religous zombie so be it but don’t try to force everyone else to be.
i feel that religion has its place & like the bible/qu’ran is used as a learing tool, but to many people get stuck in the religious rut & don’t move on…it kinda like a grown adult still believing in santa…sure its fun for kids & you use santa as a method so your kids are good…but @ some point you have to lean & move on & realize that its not about that…the holidays is about the spirit of giving & family.

i don’t think that religion has a right to control people, long time ago sure…because there was no law or government…people used religion as a form of control…but its 2007 those days are over.

christians wanting muslims to adapt ot leave is the same thing to me as hetrosexuals wanting homosexuals to adapt or leave or whites who say “go back to africa”
its the same thing

isn’t it hipocritical as a chirstian to not be tolerant of others?..

its also funny how chirstians like to paint everyone with the same brush.
except their own.

just cause a terrorist is a muslim doens’t mean they are all bad.

wasn’t the oklahoma city guy a christian?

what about all the child molesting priests?

li don’t even know how they can still be in business… religion is a business
if employees started molesting children in a target stores i bet target would go outta business… looks @ chi-chi & that was just food problem…look @ imus & that was just a bad joke…molesting priests have ben popping up for years & catholics are still going strong.

thats how much they control things…they are above the law…they have thier own little country with a form of theocracy

It was not my intention to begin a religious debate, but let me assure you that Jesus and Santa are much different. I am sorry that you’ve had such a narrow and seemingly negative view of the Christian religion.

I freely admit that I am a Christian, but nowhere in this thread before now have I said that I am.

Your historical perspective is flat wrong. Jesus was crucified by the government. One did not replace the other. We have always had both.

“The Holidays” as you call it, only exist because of religious history. Christmas and Easter each celebrating different parts of Jesus life aren’t about “family” they began because of Jesus. It’s a great time to be with family, but you can’t change the origins. Of course there are other holidays, but those are both rooted in Christianity.

You can rest on one mid 20th century ruling about the separation of church and state, and try to ignore the founding of the country, but that doesn’t change the fact that the majority of the founding fathers were Christians.

I am pretty tolerant. I only take issue with the fact that people think it’s a good idea to change this country to accomdate some new-comers. People have been adapting to live here for centuries, look at the rich history at Ellis Island, if you haven’t been there, it’s a great tour, I learned a lot.

Read up on Islam, it is not a tolerant religion. I’m tolerant, but I’m not stupid.
Have you ever seen a Christian strap a bomb to himself, and blow up a train full of people, hoping to be with 72 virgins?

You disagree with all religions…and you trust the government???:eek3:

I encourage anyone who has come here, and dislikes the way we do things, to leave.

You won’t see me moving to India, and telling them to stop worshipping cows.

i’m not anti christian either…i’m just don’t like when people take it so serious…like you said to strap a bomb to themselves to blow up a bus or bomb an abortion clinc in the name of christ…its all crazy.

& as far as santa it was just an example… its a story that we use as a form of control just like the bible…but with santa @ some point you come to see the realization…but most people never free thier mind from religion.

& yes i know about islam, i also know plenty about christanity(went to a religious school during my childhood)…i try to have an understanding of all forms of religion.

my histrical perspective is wrong?? really… let me ask you this then.
was jesus the only “christ” or “messiah”

let me ask you this…if i write a book & then years later you write a book & the story is the same or very similar…its that coincidence?..or did you copy?

lets looks @ some history
1200BC there was virishna…born from a virgin, threatened by government, given gifts @ birth(franken-whatever, etc…) performed miracles & was curcifed between 2 theves on a cross…hmmm coinsidence?

Budha Sakia, Odin, Hesus, and many ther all have the same or simlar stores.
Krishna was like 3000 yrs before Jesus, carpenter father, virgin mother crucifed between 2 thieves, blah, blah, blah.
now christianity is the newest out of all these religions…so let think about this…

i think Horus is the earliest…hes the egyptian christ…similar story
hes the eye on top of the pyramid on the dollar bill

my point is…religion has its place in the growth of a human, but @ some point i feel that you need to free your mind…staying in the rut & taking it to serious is the cause of these psychos killing people in the name of god, christ, allah, etc…

Yeah…I was with the article until the whole “THIS NATION IS A NATION OF CHRISTIANS!” thing at the end.

Most of the American founding fathers were actually deists and not traditional Christians anway.

the US was a nation founded by Judeao-Christian values. I apploud the Australians.

By your logic Showtime, does that mean it would be ok to go over to Iran and tell them they are horrid for not practicing Christianity, or Judeaism?

you’re misunderstanding me…

i don’t have a problem with people practicing religion but i do have a problem with people taking it to serious…i think its a useful learning tool i just think @ some point you have to see beyond it & move on. its like going to school/college @ some point you’re done & you have to move on & become an adult & get a job.

taking it to serious meaning all aspects from: blowing something up int he name of your god, to controlling what you eat (no pork) (no meat on fridays), etc…

i do not think a religion should run a country.
i do not think religion should be in public school

i think that article is hyopcritical…they say they don’t what a theocatic state but @ the end they show how they are a form of it…just based on christanity & not islam.

on a side note… my belief requires me to eat meat on fridays …perferably hotdogs.

Well you think I should give up on Christianity when I “grow up.” I don’t think a person has “grown up” until they understand their maker and his teachings. Clearly we are at opposite ends of that issue.

If you don’t believe in God or religion, then on what basis do you make most of your decisions? Tasty foods and nice boobies? That’s probably all I’d be worried about if I weren’t a Christian.

Why not just scrap the rest of the Bill of Rights while you guys are at it. :rolleyes:

This is a country for everyone, it isn’t yours to tell someone who can enter and who can not. The government has the proper channels for this.

i never said i don’t believe in a higher power.
i have my own belief system…if anything my morals are based on “christian like” morals just due to the way i was rasied.

i’m just throwing out questions here…some may apply to you some to others.

do you think all tracks lead to the same ending, just different paths?

if you’re christian and you’re anti islam, anti jewish, etc how do you know your right & they are wrong. how do you know they are going to your hell & your not going to their hell?

also no one ever said anything about me bringing up that the jesus story in christianity is very similar to older christ stories in other religions?? what do you make of that…were they that many people who became christs & they all when through the same thing.??

see we are sort of on the same wave length…
i have an understanding & i understand the teaching
i think you use religion to do this… to learn & understand…

like @ some point you should see that the bible is a tool used for learning to make yourself a better person…its not non-fiction

its the same reason parents teach children fables… the boy who cried wolf, etc… you learn from it

i think everyones grander purpose in life is to become a christ or “christ like”… help others, teach, be a good person, & the ultimate…self sacrifice…not to be confused with death which is the extreme used it the stories.
but self sacfice can be anything from giving up your bus seat to a woman or older person, to risking your life to save someone in danger…

i fell that the bible & other religious tools(books, churchs, etc…) are used to help everyone achieve this goal…but most people never get that far to realize it.

No.

First, I’m not anti-(insert any religion).

To answer your question, I don’t know, you tell me, do you think my odds are better if I blow myself up in search of 72 virgins?

I’ve learned about the World’s major religions and made a choice. I like to eat cows and pigs, often on Fridays.

I have no idea what you’re talking about in this one. You said religion was like believing in santa, so I made the point that Jesus and santa are far different.

If there’s an example of someone like Christ in another religion, please share it.

We are not on the same wavelength.

so you don’t beleive in islam & you don’t beleive in catholic religion

see post #9 is all there…you must has skipped over it

see you think the bible is fiction…

so its ok to make fun of someone or call them crazy cause they think that when they die they get 72 virgins, or the light of the universe/spirit is in the belly of buddha, etc…

but its OK to believe that jesus was born from a vrigin, we came from 2 people…adam & eve, & that a man built a boat & put 2 of every living thing in it, etc…

seems very hyporcitical to me.