Can I build a 1000+ Horsepower engine? Apparently so.

NYSpeed Automotive
41

[quote=“Marcus,post:38,topic:24902"”]

Do you know why TT Vipers run 0-60 in 2.8 seconds? 0-100 in less than 6? Because they get traction.

[/quote]

where they running slicks? ive seen TT vipers launch like a bat outa hell too…but thats because they were setup for the track. on the other hand ive seen several roll vids of 1200 whp tt vipers that cant pull 700whp cobras and the such until a higher mph.

i also seem to remember filming from firehawk853s car when he was on low boost, and the gentleman in the 800-whp srt10 couldnt pull away with 200 more whp, in a car weighing 1000 lbs less, with “better suspension.” of course driving ability is a big factor, and going from stock power to over a 1000whp is a HUGE leap, and a HUGE learning curve. believe me, i know. its not like hes gona jump in there and know how to handle that power right away.

42

[quote=“turbo ls1 ss,post:41,topic:24902"”]

where they running slicks? ive seen TT vipers launch like a bat outa hell too…but thats because they were setup for the track. on the other hand ive seen several roll vids of 1200 whp tt vipers that cant pull 700whp cobras and the such until a higher mph.

i also seem to remember filming from firehawk853s car when he was on low boost, and the gentleman in the 800-whp srt10 couldnt pull away with 200 more whp, in a car weighing 1000 lbs less, with “better suspension.” of course driving ability is a big factor, and going from stock power to over a 1000whp is a HUGE leap, and a HUGE learning curve. believe me, i know. its not like hes gona jump in there and know how to handle that power right away.

[/quote]

Keep in mind the 20" rims with 14" of rubber touching the road.

3 seconds is achievable on street tires with no suspension tweaking. I have seen on video 1.9 seconds with a viper setup for race.

43

Nice patting yourself on the back n all but where’s the dyno sheet? I would like to see some weight to stand behind your thread. Good job tho. How many miles are on the car now?

44

[quote=“POOPRA,post:31,topic:24902"”]

If your building the bottom end why would you leave the top end stock? I dont know much about vipers but why not at least upgrade to a more agressive cam while its all apart.

I love the idea of 1,000rwhp on pump gas.

[/quote]

It was the owners personal call… I tried to sway him, but it was out of the current budget, as my internals were almost double the cost of the “standard” viper stuff. It leaves much on the table for the future too. but honestly, I would rather see the car with a built bottom end than a built top end…on an OEM bottom.

BOOM!

45

[quote=“turbo ls1 ss,post:32,topic:24902"”]

cool. will u be racing it at all?

[/quote]

We’ll see… I am not putting the cart before the horse. I have quite a bit more riding on this than anyone can imagine. I most likely will, but it will be few and far between. Quite honestly, taking a chance racing this car is about the most unintelligent thing I can do at this point. Crashing/severely damaging this car would quite litterally ruin 2 years worth of work, and an unbelieveable amount of time I have put into it… its not like I can just go re-order parts and have them in a few days to repair it. I am talking MONTHS to get parts, even though they are all designed, and MONTHS to rebuild it… not to mention the costs, I dont even wat to go there.

And the insurance company would laugh at me, for sure.

WAR THEY’LL PAY FOR A STOCK ENGINE

(I am loving the war statements right now… I am behind the times…hahaha)

46

[quote=“13005TEDGP,post:37,topic:24902"”]

Speaking of…Back in Jan. I went to a Toronto car show (custom cars) and I saw a Viper with TT’s I think they said it was 1500hp…u know anything of them Dan? (I know they’re in CAN.) Just curious

[/quote]

I have a feeling I know which car to which you refer, and if its the one I am thinking of, they blew the engine in it last summer… and it is the most goofy TT setup I have ever seen.

And right after they rebuilt the engine, they almost lost it again due to them using Crower Roller Rockers, which everyone who is anyone KNOWS you DO NOT USE on the Viper.

I also dont believe it put down NEAR 1500… I think around 1000-1100 was its max last I heard?

47

[quote=“Final GTS,post:45,topic:24902"”]

We’ll see… I am not putting the cart before the horse. I have quite a bit more riding on this than anyone can imagine. I most likely will, but it will be few and far between. Quite honestly, taking a chance racing this car is about the most unintelligent thing I can do at this point. Crashing/severely damaging this car would quite litterally ruin 2 years worth of work, and an unbelieveable amount of time I have put into it… its not like I can just go re-order parts and have them in a few days to repair it. I am talking MONTHS to get parts, even though they are all designed, and MONTHS to rebuild it… not to mention the costs, I dont even wat to go there.

And the insurance company would laugh at me, for sure.

WAR THEY’LL PAY FOR A STOCK ENGINE

(I am loving the war statements right now… I am behind the times…hahaha)

[/quote]

not being a wise-ass, but whats the point of having the toy if you arent going to play with it? show customers your dyno sheets? you’re right, thats a large sum of money. i can’t imagine putting all that into something, just to look at it… but i guess thats me, and this is you.

i dont necessarily mean go out and race other cars on saturday nights, but at least be able to go out and open it up on a sunday cruise

48

[quote=“Inn-Tune,post:40,topic:24902"”]

Good work!

Or I could put an AEM EMS standalone on it right now. :slight_smile: With what you’re doing now and your future plans to go TT I think it’s a no brainer.

[/quote]

Thats true, but I would prefer to avoid it if at all possible. (and I would install it myself, lol) It has many upsides, but MANY downsides, especially in a Plug-In state like NY. There is also no TRUE PCM for the SRT-10 from AEM, it is a hack-job wiring harness to get the PCM for the Gen-2 cars to work. Not being OBD2 compatible is a big problem in our cases, as well as the entire car being controlled with a BUS system, gauges and all… which ONLY the OEM PCM has the capability of supporting.

By utilizing the OEM PCM w/HPT, I can tune for all vacuum and scale the injectors, the “piggyback” (really an in-line) handles boost/timing under boost, and an AEM P&H driver allows it to handle any injector type. Its a first, and it DOES work fine, but without HPT support, it has limited capability up to 72 lb injectors.

49

[quote=“turbo ls1 ss,post:47,topic:24902"”]

not being a wise-ass, but whats the point of having the toy if you arent going to play with it? show customers your dyno sheets? you’re right, thats a large sum of money. i can’t imagine putting all that into something, just to look at it… but i guess thats me, and this is you

[/quote]

The name of the game is MAKING MONEY. Kinda hard to make money if I crash it and have nothing to show… is it not? I will be playing with it, but doing it this soon in the game is not smart, when there are no readily available examples of the car other than THIS one.

You are still looking at this from a weekend racer perspective. I am looking at this from a BUSINESS and BUILDER perspective.

50

[quote=“turbo ls1 ss,post:41,topic:24902"”]

where they running slicks? ive seen TT vipers launch like a bat outa hell too…but thats because they were setup for the track. on the other hand ive seen several roll vids of 1200 whp tt vipers that cant pull 700whp cobras and the such until a higher mph.

i also seem to remember filming from firehawk853s car when he was on low boost, and the gentleman in the 800-whp srt10 couldnt pull away with 200 more whp, in a car weighing 1000 lbs less, with “better suspension.” of course driving ability is a big factor, and going from stock power to over a 1000whp is a HUGE leap, and a HUGE learning curve. believe me, i know. its not like hes gona jump in there and know how to handle that power right away.

[/quote]

  1. Of course you are going to need some type of slicks with the profiles that Vipers run on their tires. we NEED those rim sizes just to clear our brakes!

  2. Jerry’s car has TWENTY INCH RIMS on it, with STREET TIRES, and a ROAD RACE suspension. Um, DUH?

  3. Your chance of ever seeing a Viper on the street around here with a serious drag suspension/tire setup is very slim. Its not what the car was designed for, it takes away from the look of the car, and it wont handle as well. Nobody is serious enough in the Viper club about racing to give up all those things to go to a drag suspension. Its not like the cars couldnt take a turn in the first place…leaving us open to a drag suspension to get something out of it.

51

[quote=“Marcus,post:42,topic:24902"”]

Keep in mind the 20" rims with 14" of rubber touching the road.

3 seconds is achievable on street tires with no suspension tweaking. I have seen on video 1.9 seconds with a viper setup for race.

[/quote]

True, but thats with certain road racing tires, and they have a SHIT lifespan, and high cost.

And you had better be good. very good.

Short times in the Viper arent that hard to make “awesome”… but the cars transfer weight back to the front quickly due to being a true road race suspension with short travel, long wheelbase, etc. In other words, easy to launch, tough to keep planted.

52

Idk, don’t really seem to impressed putting 1000 hp out of a 8 liter engine…

I guess good work you had the money to drop into it…

53

[quote=“ILCisDEAD,post:52,topic:24902"”]

Idk, don’t really seem to impressed putting 1000 hp out of a 8 liter engine…

I guess good work you had the money to drop into it…

[/quote]

lol on pump gas…and streetable…:cjerk:

54

Very impressive. Has HPT planned on doing the SRT-10 or is this something you approched them with and are asking them to do? Is there a release date planned for there software or are they not even sure if there going to support it yet?

55

[quote=“kingsario,post:43,topic:24902"”]

Nice patting yourself on the back n all but where’s the dyno sheet? I would like to see some weight to stand behind your thread. Good job tho. How many miles are on the car now?

[/quote]

I dont have the most current DS, just the preliminary one. As funny as it sounds, the tuner ran out of ink…you can actually see it on the scan. The first set of numbers came in at high 800s, before final tuning and final plug change, with the still-lingering fuel problems. (attached)

car (engine) had 600-700 miles on it before tuning, no idea how many since.

56

[quote=“articzap,post:54,topic:24902"”]

Very impressive. Has HPT planned on doing the SRT-10 or is this something you approched them with and are asking them to do? Is there a release date planned for there software or are they not even sure if there going to support it yet?

[/quote]

They have been planning Dodge support… it was slated for release end of 2006, but got pushed off. The current whispers are mid-2007 release.

57

[quote=“ILCisDEAD,post:52,topic:24902"”]

Idk, don’t really seem to impressed putting 1000 hp out of a 8 liter engine…

I guess good work you had the money to drop into it…

[/quote]

LOL, yep. not impressive at all… that an otherwise STOCK engine except for rotating assembly just made TT-like numbers with an SC, which has never been seen before without other work, be it heads, cam, etc… on pump gas no less, and not maxed out.

This thread is not about max power, this thread is about an extremely efficient rotating assembly that is doing exactly what I said it would for almost a YEAR before it made it into a running, tunable FI car. That engine is only running 15 PSI… uh, port the heads and crank the boost? of course it will put down an even more astronomical amount of power, but thats not the point.

And your second comment makes it look as though you didnt even read the thread… this is NOT about my car directly, but rather about my project/package indirectly.

58

Yep read again, how about some info on what you did? I’m actually quite curious. Its just hard to be impressed when you say

" MONTHS OF WORK, a 2 year project"

great thats time you spent into it. how about a little bit on the theory

59

[quote=“Final GTS,post:48,topic:24902"”]

Thats true, but I would prefer to avoid it if at all possible. (and I would install it myself, lol) It has many upsides, but MANY downsides, especially in a Plug-In state like NY. There is also no TRUE PCM for the SRT-10 from AEM, it is a hack-job wiring harness to get the PCM for the Gen-2 cars to work. Not being OBD2 compatible is a big problem in our cases, as well as the entire car being controlled with a BUS system, gauges and all… which ONLY the OEM PCM has the capability of supporting.

By utilizing the OEM PCM w/HPT, I can tune for all vacuum and scale the injectors, the “piggyback” (really an in-line) handles boost/timing under boost, and an AEM P&H driver allows it to handle any injector type. Its a first, and it DOES work fine, but without HPT support, it has limited capability up to 72 lb injectors.

[/quote]

I know you have your own shop. I only said that because I didn’t think you did tuning. You said someone else tuned this car…

[quote=“Final GTS,post:20,topic:24902"”]

According to the tuner who did the tuning, it is by far the highest horsepower he has seen yet for the given mod set

[/quote]

I tune cars all day for a living and I know how HP Tuners works since I use that as well. If you make the harness for the AEM EMS the right way you can remove the AEM quickly once a year for inspection on your car. I’ve done it before on another car that required the stock ECU to remain in the car for tranny control etc. that wasn’t supported by AEM for that application. The owner put the wiring back to stock in about a minute and passed inspection no problem. You can do a hack job like you said, but you can also do it nicely with quick disconnects. It just takes a little extra time to make and then it’s easy to go back and forth once a year.

After using both systems I’d rather have an AEM EMS in the car for your application and since it’s available now. Just trying to help man…

60

[quote=“Inn-Tune,post:59,topic:24902"”]

I know you have your own shop. I only said that because I didn’t think you did tuning. You said someone else tuned this car…

I tune cars all day for a living and I know how HP Tuners works since I use that as well. If you make the harness for the AEM EMS the right way you can remove the AEM quickly once a year for inspection on your car. I’ve done it before on another car that required the stock ECU to remain in the car for tranny control etc. that wasn’t supported by AEM for that application. The owner put the wiring back to stock in about a minute and passed inspection no problem. You can do a hack job like you said, but you can also do it nicely with quick disconnects. It just takes a little extra time to make and then it’s easy to go back and forth once a year.

After using both systems I’d rather have an AEM EMS in the car for your application. Just trying to help man…

[/quote]

Mike- Dont get me wrong, I wasnt coming after you or anything if thats what you thought. I tune, but this car is actually FAAAR away from here. I build Vipers from the ground up, including both Drivetrain and EMS/other electrical systems.

Its just that in a Viper, its easier said than done. Sure, you can EASILY hook up an AEM with the right harness, but swapping back to stock to pass inspection is NOT possible on a setup like this, without running both an AEM and leaving the piggyback in the harness for the swapback, and needing doubles of the wiring for both systems and what they control. I would still require the PWM outputs of the AEM just to make the car RUN (PWM controlled fuel pumps) not to mention the 02 sims, missfire codes, and fuel trims, injector swaps (which would be incorrect anyway due to diff pressures, P&H vs Sat., and pump design)… Quite literally, it would be a MESS to try and swap back, just to make it pass- thats why I am trying to avoid the swap back by making the OEM system work around the new designs.