I went ahead and bought a replacement Clutch Slave cylinder from Napa (cost $35 after tax - not bad).
Unfortunately it came with a pushrod that looked to be 1/8" longer then
the stock pushrod and I had a hard time getting the new one to fit so I
went ahead and used the stock
While I was down there, I got rid ofthe dampener. Ok, so everything was
bolted up and I went ahead and opened the bleed valve and poured in the
clutch fluid at the cylinder.
I let it gravity bleed (i.e. let gravity push the fluid down out the bleeder
valve). After that was done I closed off the valve and the clutch pedal
had instant pressure. At which point I bled it and now the clutch pedal
was acting just right.
I rolled the car out to drive and it drove normally. I did a couple hard
launches and it pulled fine. I didn’t drive out far cuz I wasn’t sure still.
Finally before I put it in garage I came to a stop, and tried to go again.
I let off the clutch in 1st gear, and car didn’t move one bit. It just sat
there. I kept revving (car was in gear, and clutch was engaged) and
it didn’t move. I had to push it in.
So what’s up? My clutch really gone for good? How come it lets me drive
for a bit? Mind you I hadn’t driven the car in a few days so is that normal?
That it would let me drive after a few days of rest?
I have the same slave cyl and I used the pushrod that came with it without any problem. I am a little concerned with the fluid running down your flex line though unless thats just splash over from bleeding. To me it almost looks like your leaking.
Step 1: Take the slave off, right off. Put it in gear, make sure nothing is around you or jack up the back too… Crank it over and see if the tires move (this would be better if you put it back on the ground because then it will load up the clutch and see if it slips, up to you).
If they turn you need to figure out why the clutch fork is not comming back all the way, probably due to the slave cylinder being out of adjustment or needs to be bled properly, something making it not come back far enough. For some reason I remeber the rod that goes into the slave actually going both ways, but one way it does not go in all the way, which would make it stick out… double and tripple check that. I imagine this is what is causing the issue, if not, move on to step 2.
Step 2: Fool around with the clutch fork, pull back the boot and try and look to see if it came out of where it is supposed to be, wedging the release bearing or something… could be a couple of things here, just check it over as best you can, even get a prybar on it and see how it moves with that. You want a smooth motion obviously, you should be able to feel the pressure plate hit both of its extremes. If something is messed up, move on to step 3.
Step 3: Drop the tranny, pull off the clutch and flywheel. Go buy a new clutch and surface the flywheel, once you have it off you do not wnat be be doing it again.
It should take you less than an hour to figure out whether or not the tranny needs to come out. After you eliminate the clutch it self you can concentrate on the actuating side of things. It is much easier working “backwards” like this IMO.
Just to get this straight and so we understand each other… There is no slave on, you put it in gear, crank it over (doesn’t have to start but sounds like it is for you) and it doesn’t move AT ALL? Not even a slight lurch, then stops? I gotta say, if that is the case something is really not good. I mean there is bad clutches, then there are sweet country clutches like it sounds like you have. Quite odd given that you say it was launching fine before you shut it off for a bit.
It’s not something like a broken drive shaft or input/output shaft of the tranny is it? While you are under there moving the fork around, grab the drive shaft and spin it in neutral. You should see the tires spin, obviously. Then put it in gear, you should not be able to spin it, in any gear (same as you already did but now with hand force instead of with engine force). really twist it too, put a wrench on it and see if you can hear the clutch slip. EDIT: Since you will need the tires off the ground anyway, jack it up and do step 1 again first, see if you can get the wheels to spin at all. IF they even a bit then you will know something major like the crank isn’t broken as I go on to say is a possibility* If nothing happens still then try it by hand as I say above…
If you can turn the shaft by hand and the fork checks out, drop the tranny, something is really fucked.
To be honest the only things I can think of that would have those characteristics would be a broken crank, input shaft or output shaft… Reason being is that since you say it had just launched properly and then nothing it leads me to believe the clutch was/is engaging, but something else isn’t there… It could be that you glazed or got metal to metal on the clutch though from the last run, then after it cooled down any amount of friction it had was gone, I would expect it to get better with cooling though, unless it fused together (thinking as I type). In any case, see what you can do with the fork, then see what happens with the driveshaft and let us know…You’re on the right track now for sure. (you just saved numerous bleeding operations and pedal adjustments )
If I had to guess now I would say the clutch is toast and the symptoms are just a bit off what I would expect, not something terminal. Open mind… never assume anything… for all I know there is no diff anymore (you would notice that when you grab the driveshaft, I hope)
I have seen this before. The preasure plate is pooched. When you take your trany out look for some proken springs, I will bet you a beer you find some. It is not that big of a deal. Its not to hard to change the clutch. Your disc/friction surface may still be good though.
Thanks for all the info guys, especially Nave. Can’t wait to get home
tonight to see what I find.
I’ve been told it’s most likely the clutch or PP so I hope Chris you are
right. Next time I see you, i’ll buy you a beer.
Justin, i’m gonns start checking the things Nave suggested and then slowly
start taking the tranny apart.
I don’t have much free time during the weekday (maybe 2hrs or 3 at
most) so I’m gonna do it little by little and hopefully have the tranny out
somewhat by weekend.
I’ve been told the worst part is getting the tranny back in. I’m gonna need
some help there. Thanks for the offer and I’ll be sure to take you up on it. :fingersx:
I would agree that the pp is quite possibly the problem, but you should never assume anything until all the evidence points to it. Time and time again people assume things and then the unthinkable has happened, which would only have taken 2 min to check, instead they spend hours to find out they were wrong. In your case you really dont want to overlook the simple stuff. Always work general to more refined, WAY quicker.
The issue that leads me away from the pp a bit is the lack of movement of the car at all. I would expect it to at least try to move forward, or freewheel the tires in the air. I would also expect a pp that launched properly before to at least move the car a bit. Full clutch to nothing is difficult, but possible I suppose. Just a little explanation as to why I said do things the way I did.
Here’s exactly what went on after I replaced the slave and bled the
system.
I went to reverse. Reversed fine. The clutch seemed to be grabbing
a little early and a little stronger then before. (Either that or the fact that
I hadn’t driven the car properly in almost a few month makes it feel weird).
I reverse and then I stop. Put it in 1st. I ease off the clutch and I feel a
little buck. I can feel it at the pedal a bit. At which point I just push the
clutch down and put it in neutral again.
I then try again in 1st. Car takes off normally. i drove around my block,
going only as high as 2nd gear. Seems good. I stop fully.
Put it in 1st again. Once again I feel that weird buck. I do the same
as before and I’m moving just fine. This time around, I went around
a corner in 2nd gear and floored the gas somewhat (tires were spinning
heavy, squealing, I could smell rubber).
I come to a full stop. This is when I tried to put it in 1st and felt
ABSOLUTELY nothing. Car wouldn’t move one inch. I had to push the
car back in the garage.
I really wana work on the car now but the fuckin weather has just made
my day somewhat pissy. Bah!
You may have said it earlier, and it doesn’t reall matter much, but why did you replace the slave? Was it leaking or something or did someone just tell you that it was the problem?
I did mention earlier that with the old slave, after I fully drained the
system (let all the old fluid drain out), I wasn’t able to get any pressure
after I re-filled it/bled it.
It just wouldn’t build pressure and so I replaced the slave. When I
replaced the slave, as soon as I filled up the system, there was pressure.
Plus, doesn’t hurt to spend $35 (after tax) on a 13yr old slave cylinder.
I’m sure the spring in that cylinder will lose its tension over time.
Sounds like you just didn’t get all the air out, but I agree it was worth the change anyway. Usually they leak before there is an issue, just pull back the rubber round the shaft and look for fluid. Same thing on cars that have wheel cylinders, drum brake setups that is. All the slave is is a cylinder with a shaft and seal, no spring. The spring action comes from the pressure plate, though sometimes there is a pedal return spring on certain cars. I seem to remember seeing one before on another car, but it may be that it was a cable clutch, not hydraulic.
Though it is a bit late now, you don’t have to drain the system fully before you put in new fluid. Same thing goes with brake systems. If you want to change the fluid just keep bleeding it until clear fluid comes out of all bleed screws. On most cars you will have to take the bleed screw right out and make sure the holes in it are clear of shit, use the appropriate drill bit, one hole is in the end, the other comes in from the side. Losening rusted bleeders is another whole story, many tricks there but if they were at all tight I just replace them, cheap insurance for next time. Essentially you do not want to introduce any air into a hydraulic system, especially willingly, some of them can be a bitch to get it all out.
)
