Good question. I’m expecting the “society doesn’t tip fast food” puke. Friggin sheep.
I always tip, but i charge on how far away the store is…if its less then a mile, you’ll usually get 2-3$ :nod :
A pretty girl at a diner will make more than double the wage working half as much as a typical worker at any sort of retail position. It’s easy to average 100$ a night for 4 or 5 hours, without the 3$ or 4$ an hour (tax) pay.
That is a very decent wage.
By some of the logic going around here, if somebody at any job doesn’t make 15$ an hour, should be tipped to reach that average. As a rule of thumb, all low paying jobs are physically and or mentally hard especially when dealing with customers.
On the similar note, I’m very interested in hearing waiters who chimed in this thread, would they tip fast food workers?
+1 to that ;D
Shawn - I have to respect your opinion because it is in fact an opinion. However I disagree with you. We all know this by now however.
Here is why you are fundamentally wrong. If a server was paid an acceptable wage and it was this way across the board in every country, you would recieve the least amount of service because to the server, you are no better than the person sitting next to you. They will be getting paid the same amount whether they serve you with excellence or not.
By keeping it the way it is now, servers have to compete to receive a good tip. They will treat you with good service if they want a decent tip. They can choose to serve you poorly and get tipped poorly or they can serve you well and receive a decent tip. Any logical person will serve you well with the hope of receiving a decent tip.
Simply put: It is the way it is. There are a lot of things that each person in this world dissapproves of however there is nothing you can do to change it, other than change your personal habits. Eat at a buffet, eat at a fast food resturant or just dont eat at all if you have such a problem with the system.
Vlad- To answer your question. No, I would not tip a fast food worker. The reason for this is that they are not actually serving you the same way a server from a regular food establishment would serve. On top of that they are paid a wage to perform the service that is accepted by society. And stemming from what I stated above it is why the kid behind the counter could care less if you get pickles or don’t. He is going to make the same irregardless. Now if he was receiving a tip for every burger made, you can bet your ass that the quality of that burger and fries would be much higher than it is otherwise.
Like I said, you can choose to tip or not. It is up to you. Personally, I think it speaks about who you are as a person.
For example, the other night I served a very nice couple. $60 check. They left me $32 for a tip. If I ever see them again, I would give them better service over the couple who wouldn’t serve me as well. I also gained a certain respect for them and their understanding. As for the person who decided to leave 10%, I have no respect. The resturant appreciates 18% at minimum. I don’t care if they don’t have enough money or they are struggling. They shouldn’t have come to a resturant where the dinner is worth half of the welfare check. If you want mediocre service and want to pay a shitty tip. Go to Friendly’s or some other shit hole.
V
Five Lessons About How To Treat People
– Author Unknown
- First Important Lesson - “Know The Cleaning Lady”
During my second month of college, our professor gave us a pop quiz. I was a conscientious student and had breezed through the questions, until I read the last one: “What is the first name of the woman who cleans the school?”
Surely this was some kind of joke. I had seen the cleaning woman several times. She was tall, dark-haired and in her 50s, but how would I know her name? I handed in my paper, leaving the last question blank. Just before class ended, one student asked if the last question would count toward our quiz grade.
“Absolutely,” said the professor. "In your careers, you will meet many people. All are significant. They deserve your attention and care, even if all you do is smile and say “hello.”
I’ve never forgotten that lesson. I also learned her name was Dorothy.
- Second Important Lesson - “Pickup In The Rain”
One night, at 11:30 p.m., an older African American woman was standing on the side of an Alabama highway trying to endure a lashing rainstorm. Her car had broken down and she desperately needed a ride. Soaking wet, she decided to flag down the next car.
A young white man stopped to help her, generally unheard of in those conflict-filled 1960s. The man took her to safety, helped her get assistance and put her into a taxicab.
She seemed to be in a big hurry, but wrote down his address and thanked him. Seven days went by and a knock came on the man’s door. To his surprise, a giant console color TV was delivered to his home.
A special note was attached. It read: “Thank you so much for assisting me on the highway the other night. The rain drenched not only my clothes, but also my spirits. Then you came along. Because of you, I was able to make it to my dying husband’s bedside just before he passed away. God bless you for helping me and unselfishly serving others.”
Sincerely, Mrs. Nat King Cole.
- Third Important Lesson - “Remember Those Who Serve”
In the days when an ice cream sundae cost much less, a 10 year-old boy entered a hotel coffee shop and sat at a table. A waitress put a glass of water in front of him. “How much is an ice cream sundae?” he asked. “50¢,” replied the waitress.
The little boy pulled his hand out of his pocket and studied the coins in it.
“Well, how much is a plain dish of ice cream?” he inquired. By now more people were waiting for a table and the waitress was growing impatient. “35¢!” she brusquely replied.
The little boy again counted his coins. “I’ll have the plain ice cream,” he said. The waitress brought the ice cream, put the bill on the table and walked away. The boy finished the ice cream, paid the cashier and left.
When the waitress came back, she began to cry as she wiped down the table. There, placed neatly beside the empty dish, were two nickels and five pennies. You see, he couldn’t have the sundae, because he had to have enough left to leave her a tip.
- Fourth Important Lesson - “The Obstacles In Our Path”
In ancient times, a King had a boulder placed on a roadway. Then he hid himself and watched to see if anyone would remove the huge rock. Some of the king’s wealthiest merchants and courtiers came by and simply walked around it. Many loudly blamed the King for not keeping the roads clear, but none did anything about getting the stone out of the way.
Then a peasant came along carrying a load of vegetables. Upon approaching the boulder, the peasant laid down his burden and tried to move the stone to the side of the road. After much pushing and straining, he finally succeeded. After the peasant picked up his load of vegetables, he noticed a purse lying in the road where the boulder had been. The purse contained many gold coins and a note from the King indicating that the gold was for the person who removed the boulder from the roadway. The peasant learned what many of us never understand - “Every obstacle presents an opportunity to improve our condition.”
- Fifth Important Lesson - “Giving When It Counts”
Many years ago, when I worked as a volunteer at a hospital, I got to know a little girl named Liz who was suffering from a rare and serious disease. Her only chance of recovery appeared to be a blood transfusion from her 5-year-old brother, who had miraculously survived the same disease and had developed the antibodies needed to combat the illness. The doctor explained the situation to her little brother, and asked the little boy if he would be willing to give his blood to his sister. I saw him hesitate for only a moment before taking a deep breath and saying, “Yes, I’ll do it if it will save her.”
As the transfusion progressed, he lay in bed next to his sister and smiled, as we all did, seeing the color returning to her cheeks. Then his face grew pale and his smile faded. He looked up at the doctor and asked with a trembling voice, “Will I start to die right away?”.
Being young, the little boy had misunderstood the doctor; he thought he was going to have to give his sister all of his blood in order to save her.
it has nothing to do with being a sheep, it has to do with being respectful, being a sheep is letting the govt. slowly overpower you and take your guns away a lil law at a time, or raising fuel prices for what reason? (its warm out…price goes up, its cold out…price goes up, hurricane price goes up, sky is blue price goes up)
Your previous post suggests otherwise? Maybe you calmed down?
Did it ever occur to you that other jobs are fulfilled by people who are not tipped and the world goes on? You are speculating but what if people just did not go to that establishment anymore perhaps the service was not adequate?
OK. I am not sure your point. I think we all understand how this works.
I’ve acknowledged that it won’t change. I have accepted that. I have no problem tipping. I just do not want to tip people like you. Those that feel that they are obligated to be paid. Why don’t we setup a Communist system so everyone gets paid the same? This way we can have people working mediocre jobs who have nothing to strive for because they will always be compensated? Sounds fair right?
They aren’t? I am sure plenty of diners have people who buy a dish and receive a dish but they are obligated to tip per your logic?
Sheep.
Yep. A person who wasn’t given a gift in life. A person that earns his paycheck. It’s funny how you feel the need to judge people because on their ability to give you money. Reminds me of welfare to be honest.
What a bunch of bullshit
As long as we keep having a calm logical discussion about this, I will enjoy the debate, I know Shawn will keep it civil, and honestly I agree with him on the theoretical side of the tipping. I will tip every time, that’s just the way things are, I agree, but… Shawn is trying to dissect the reasoning behind it and I see his point.
Quality service should be guaranteed at the entrance to an establishment, not determined on how much the person will pay.
How is this for an ideological comparison.
You walk into McDonald’s, you sit at a table. There are more staff running around, it takes you longer to get your food, because they have to take down what you want. The kitchen makes you (fast) food, you get it brought to your table, and then you leave a check instead of cashing out at the register.
Would you tip then?
If anything the service quality just decreased, the restaurant had to pay more for more staff and it took longer to get the food.
wow you both have good points :number1
I am calm. It’s just a discussion as you pointed out.
I am trying to dissect it but it’s getting annoying because people aren’t reading/listening. I am not using big words either. I can take this a step further and discuss how wrong it is for a person working at Red Lobster or serving drinks shouldn’t be making $20-$30 an hour. Furthermore, how this actually supports people being content being a food server/pizza boy because the job pays well and, based on many in this thread, that pay is guaranteed. I’ll take it a step further and say that some of these jobs should be done by the retarded. WalMart does that all over America. Let’s force people to more onto more important roles in society and give those unfortunate the ability to do those jobs that they can do.
I can support these ideas in many ways but that would bring the forum base to an uproar. 
DING DING DING DING DING
I’ll let others discuss this. I am following your logic.
my friends and i usually tip very very well, mainly cuz i’m an pain in the ass and so are my friends. but there have been times where i haven’t tipped much not because things were late of the food sucked, i know that’s not their fault, but it was jsut the way they treated me. also though i was a delivery driver for a local pizza place for 2 years so i enjoyed a nice tip(which rarely came) but i’d rather tip a person more for driving their own vehicle to my house and getting it there on time than i would some1 who takes it from the cooks and walks it to me. now i know some of you may say that its not fair a server is a hard job, but not round here there’s days when i not only delivered but washed dishes, helped the cooks, picked up the place while the waitresses watched everything and continued to not clean the plats like their suppsot to. anyways i’m done rambling on about things that made me mad so i’ll jsut say that i’ll agree with you who do tip, and i’ll agree with you who don’t cuz some ppl just don’t desirve it
I understand your argument Shawn and Vov but I am personally biased because I am in the serving profession. And trust me I make a paycheck, that is my part time job, actually a lot of my colleagues who all have college degrees still serve part time becuase it really is good money.
You can not get angry with me for personally wanting to better my life. It is what most of us are out to do. I worked 40 hours a week at $15 an hour, after tax and benefits brought home $450 a week. As a server I make that in a single weekend, working a total of 15 hours. Total for the week I make anywhere between $500-$800 bring hom, depending on the season and on how many hours I work, which is never more than 20 at that job. I also tip where ever I go. I beleive that I am rewarding the person for the work they provide.
Let me put this is a different perspective:
There are many ways for a person to receive pay:
1- Salary
2- Hourly Wage
3- Commission Only
4- Tips Reported and/or Wage Only
Shawn- You get paid a paycheck. At your age I will assume it is a Salary check. I get paid also. Not with a paycheck but with cash or credit from my customers. Basically as a server you are a salesperson. You are there to sell food. As a reward you allotted a tip or “commission”.
Under your argument, you would not be allowed to tip anyone for anything. Pizza delivery, Cab rides, Limo rides, etc.
You would also have to argue that car sales persons would should not receive a commission. That is how they get paid. As a server, tips are how I get paid. You get paid from the income earned by the company you work for is the form of a paycheck. We all get payed in different ways, and to say thay a server does not work hard enough to receive your “hard earned” money is just not logical. Although I understand where you are coming from, it just dosnt work.
I don’t recall being angry at all. Please review the thread. You are the one that appears to be hot headed over an opinion that differs from your own. You need to get used to this because we live in a diverse world.
It’s a free country. If someone feels the need to tip than they can/should tip. IMHO, they should NOT be obligated to tip. You are employed by the establishment and should be paid accordingly. The level of service (in a perfect world) should not change nor should the product/service purchased change.. It should not be the responsibility of the consumer to pay you $X because you feel you deserve it. The rich people next door owe me nothing. Please re-read that. I am not saying you shouldn’t be tipped. I am saying that it is at the discretion of the consumer not you.
Sorry, if you disagree with that.
Also, I said no tipping shouldn’t be allowed as a discussion because I think I have an argument to that. That’s another discussion as you can barely understand what I am saying here. No offense.
Unfair comparison. I just bought a brand new car yesterday. I didn’t slap the guy a $50 on the way out. Toyota, I assume, paid him accordingly. Interesting concept? See above.
I did not say they did not earn my “hard earned” money. I said my money is for me to determine where it goes, not yours. You are not obligated to a penny of it unless I say so.
I’m very surprised to see you bring up the salesman analogy as I was going to use it, but decided against it.
Since you have gone that route, let me make a direct comparison.
A salesperson - telemarketer for example connects people to the corporation and sells them items to make commission. The more they sell the more they make. Simple. However there are people who hang up on telemarketers, waste their time, or buy the smallest package available, but does that give the right for the telemarketer to go back to the corporation and tell them to junk mail the people who hang up, prank call the people who waste the time, or provide lower quality service to the people that “only buy” the lowest package?
This is not personal against you, it’s a discussion of your career and how other people observe it.
You seem to almost contradict yourself when you say that you’re very well off working less then typical job at 15$ an hour 40 hours a week, and then later saying that you work very hard and people who tip less than 10% get no respect from you.
Why does a person working for 10$ an hour, who worked 5 hours to make 50$, minus taxes is left with 40$, who wants to spend it on dinner for himself and his date, has to give a 10$ tip (more then an hour work) for somebody who is better off then him, and took a total of 25 minutes of the servers attention.
I am surprised as well because it’s a crappy comparison.
The guy at the Toyota dealership “sold” me a car. The guy at the burger shack took down my order and brought me the fucking burger. I didn’t go to the burger shack debating if I wanted a burger.
A server job is a minimum wage job, you accept that by signing up thats the default. Anything over that you make as a tip should be a god send and a server should be happy for every dollar.
Disclaimer : Once again, I tip, Shawn tips, we agree with Tipping and this is not against any member in specific or anybody at all in specific.
I know what your arguing. You think a server should not feel like that $10 bill in your pocket is theirs just becuase they serviced you. You are right. We/I do not feel that your are obligated to give me the $10 bill, however I am hoping that you give it to me on the basis that I serviced you in a manner enough to suit your needs. But in a society where it is "expected’ that you tip, you are at a dissadvantage if you do not tip becuase you will be treated with a less amount of service. That is your argument. I really do get it and it is well founded.
You can see where I would get defensive to someone saying we don’t have an obligation to a tip. It is how I pay my bills and how I survive at this point in my life. But you are right. You should not be Obligated to tip just to recieve good service. To me though tipping is a way of life in almost any society and although your argument is well founded, in my opinion I think that it is actually a benefit to have it set up the way it is.
Did we just come to a conclusion we can all agree? :wow
Ah. I think you just pulled a hondalover.
I am completely lost due to this 180 degree turn.