Lemon Law ?

NYSpeed Automotive
1

Have a quick lemon law question. I’ve read what the conditions are for being able to file for lemon law, and I meet them, but I am confused on the definition of “Warranty”.

Is this a dealer specific warranty, or is it the warranty coverage on my car (36,000 miles bumper to bumper, 60,000 power train etc.)?

I’ve had to take my car in 4 times now for the rear diff (the fourth being today) and I want to bitch to at least get a loaner vehicle. I really have no interest in lemon lawing my car because I have no real issues with the vehicle except for the dealers lack of action to fix this problem.

2

slight update… now I have been called back that the reason I am getting vibration in the rear is because my rear swaybar endlinks are bent and it looks like my car was taken off of a jump… LOL.

Few things that piss me off about this, one I can tell for a fact that this is the exact same symptom of rear vibration as the last time my rear diff was bad, secondly, this repair is not covered by my extended warranty that I purchased because it is not a factory defect. Thirdly, and most importantly, I bought this car at Northtown, which is where it is at for service and I know for a fact I never jumped the car, or bottomed out especially anything that would have hit that hard. So only logical conclusion to be had here is that I was sold the car this way, and that whatever visual inspection was done before selling to me obviously was not done very well. So now they wont even look at my rear diff, and they want me to pay $260 for swaybar endlinks.

:wtf:

Is there any way that I can try to argue that this damage was certainly done before buying the car? I am not trying to be a dick and bring my car in saying I didn’t do anything to it when knowing full well I did. Something like this you would notice happening…

3

good luck…I only have problems going through Ntown Subaru…

took mine out to west herr and got a much better reception/result from them on any/all the problems I had with my heap

4

Kartboy rear endlinks are $100 bucks and are much better than OEM’s. If you HAVE TO replace your endlinks, replace them with those to prove to them that it’s not what is making the noise.

edit: Does $260 include labor?

5

Tell them you’ll pay the $260 if they agree that if it doesn’t go away they’ll refund your $260 and cover everything under the extended warranty.

6

[quote=“Z man,post:4,topic:30043"”]

Kartboy rear endlinks are $100 bucks and are much better than OEM’s. If you HAVE TO replace your endlinks, replace them with those to prove to them that it’s not what is making the noise.

edit: Does $260 include labor?

[/quote]

So your going to tell the dealership to put in non OEM parts…to fix issues…

lol

7

[quote=“JoesTypeS,post:5,topic:30043"”]

Tell them you’ll pay the $260 if they agree that if it doesn’t go away they’ll refund your $260 and cover everything under the extended warranty.

[/quote]

actually this is still covered under powertrain (the rear diff), the bumper to bumper is the extended…

My original question still stands though on whether or not I can lemon the car “if” this is the rear diff again which I know it has to be from the symptoms. I wasn’t going to even consider lemon-ing it but if I get sucked into having to pay for this I may consider it just to stick it back to them.

[quote=“Z man,post:4,topic:30043"”]

Kartboy rear endlinks are $100 bucks and are much better than OEM’s. If you HAVE TO replace your endlinks, replace them with those to prove to them that it’s not what is making the noise.

edit: Does $260 include labor?

[/quote]

This is what I will do - well actually I may end up getting a full rear swaybar kit… IF this is actually true.

I am more-so pissed that I was sold the car in this condition when there is supposed to be an inspection (which by the way is why they are telling me this is why they know I did it). There is no way I did this without noticing it…

edit: and I sure as hell hope that $260 includes labor !

8

I’m saying to put them in himself to eliminate the noise. If he’s going to replace endlinks to prove that they’re not what’s causing the noise, might as well replace them with better ones for cheaper.

Unless they agree on giving you your money back if they replace them and it doesnt fix the problem. That’s better.

9

Did you first report the problem when the car was less than 2 years old and with fewer than 18k miles?

New Car Lemon Law
This law gives the consumer the right to receive the necessary repairs free if the problem is covered under the new-car warranty and is reported before the car is two years old or passes the 18,000-mile mark.

If the dealer can’t fix the defect after four tries, or if you haven’t been able to drive the car for 30 or more days because of the issue, you are then entitled to either a replacement vehicle or a refund of your purchase price―your choice.

The defect must also substantially impair the value of the vehicle to the consumer to qualify under this law. If you opt for a refund, the manufacturer may adjust the amount based on how many miles of service you did get from the car.

This law covers leased vehicles as well; you’re entitled to a refund of the down payment plus the lease payments you made, minus any service fees charged as part of the lease agreement.

What If a Dealer Refuses to Repair the Car?

Once you notify the dealer who sold you the car about the car’s defects, they should make the needed repairs. If they refuse, after seven days you can notify the manufacturer of the car (in writing, sent via certified mail) of the dealer’s refusal.

At that point, the manufacturer has 20 days to begin the necessary repairs. If the defect is not fixed, or the manufacturer also refuses, you are then entitled to a replacement of your vehicle or a refund of the purchase price.

Also, the NYS DMV licenses dealerships and repair shops. They are who you complain to. Dealers and shops do not like to have complaints against filed against them at the DMV. Among other things, if the DMV sees fit to investigate, the shop must shut down during the investigation. Talk to the DMV, get the complaint forms, make Northtown aware of the path you are going down, and file the complaint if necessary. Don’t bluff, just give them the chance to apease you. My future mother-in-law was dating a local supreme court judge something-or-other and this was the advice he gave her when she was having ongoing clutch chatter problems with her new Subaru. It works.

10

[quote=“Z man,post:8,topic:30043"”]

I’m saying to put them in himself to eliminate the noise. If he’s going to replace endlinks to prove that they’re not what’s causing the noise, might as well replace them with better ones for cheaper.

Unless they agree on giving you your money back if they replace them and it doesnt fix the problem. That’s better.

[/quote]

Yea, I will go with what Joe said, if they deny that I will replace them myself with something else… all though who knows that may void my entire warranty… :bloated:

11

The Consumer Protection Board in Albany can also give you some good guidance. Don’t hesitate to give them a call.

http://www.consumer.state.ny.us/default.htm

12

[quote=“BikerFry,post:11,topic:30043"”]

The Consumer Protection Board in Albany can also give you some good guidance. Don’t hesitate to give them a call.

http://www.consumer.state.ny.us/default.htm

[/quote]

Cool man :tup:

Depending on how it goes when I go back in to pick it up I will look into this

13

From what I have experienced in the past it takes three times for the same problem to occur and try to have been fixed to be able to request Lemon law paper work from that dealership or by mail. Here is your time period:

“(2) “Motor vehicle” means a motor vehicle excluding off road vehicles, which was subject to a manufacturer’s express warranty at the time of original delivery and either (i) was purchased, leased or transferred in this state within either the first eighteen thousand miles of operation or two years from the date of original delivery”

As long as you had some sort of warranty in effect at the time of the first initial issue then you qualify for the lemon law

What I would do:
Do not buy any aftermarket or install any aftermarket stuff to cover your ass if need be
Fill out the Lemon Law application
File complaint with Better Business Bureau http://lemonlaw.bbb.org/
File complaint with attorney general http://www.oag.state.ny.us/

I’ll be honest with you Jim, I looked at your car a week prior to you buying it. I was told by a friend of mine that works there that there were “many issues” with this car when it came into the dealership.
G/l dude

14

[quote=“jrod0187,post:13,topic:30043"”]

From what I have experienced in the past it takes three times for the same problem to occur and try to have been fixed to be able to request Lemon law paper work from that dealership or by mail. Here is your time period:

“(2) “Motor vehicle” means a motor vehicle excluding off road vehicles, which was subject to a manufacturer’s express warranty at the time of original delivery and either (i) was purchased, leased or transferred in this state within either the first eighteen thousand miles of operation or two years from the date of original delivery”

As long as you had some sort of warranty in effect at the time of the first initial issue then you qualify for the lemon law

What I would do:
Do not buy any aftermarket or install any aftermarket stuff to cover your ass if need be
Fill out the Lemon Law application
File complaint with Better Business Bureau http://lemonlaw.bbb.org/
File complaint with attorney general http://www.oag.state.ny.us/

I’ll be honest with you Jim, I looked at your car a week prior to you buying it. I was told by a friend of mine that works there that there were “many issues” with this car when it came into the dealership.
G/l dude

[/quote]

This is the fourth time it has been in for the rear diff, so that is why I think it should qualify - and i’ve had the manufacturers warranty in place which has been what is covering this everytime it has been in.

First time in, the rear diff was vibrating, service person that did the 30K maintenance used the wrong weight gear oil.

Second time in, rear diff was whining, this was a month after the first one. They said they did not hear anything despite the fact it was ear piercing between 65-70 mph which i told them.

Third time in, waited another month on the whining and took it back in. This time they magically heard it… :bloated:. Ordered a new diff, but instead of replacing it they only replaced the bearings.

Now this time, it has been vibrating for almost 2 or 3 months, I just did not feel like dealing with the stealership, finally decided to take it back in, and the “it looks like it went off a jump” story came into play.

As for aftermarket, I have exhaust, that is it, and I will take it off if it helps my case. Also I would really like to know what the status of the car was when it came in if you friend does not mind… because I wonder if one of the issues was damage from whatever “jump” it was taken off of before I bought it. I don’t expect a used car, let alone a used STi to not be beat on, but these problems are something I would not expect.

15

ugh sounds shitty, call subaru of america and at least have them document this.

16

well. i jumped my black sti on a daily basis and i never had any dif problems. but a few control arms bent.

17

Jim I’ll help you out the best I can, I know a few people including the service manager Chris at NT. Im actually seeing a friend of mine today that works there, i’ll mention something to him.

All I can remember was your car was on the lift getting ready to be picked up the following day and me being told it had some problems including the rear diff. I would have assumed these problems would have been fixed.

18

Used? Good luck lemoning it. Did it have less than 36k when you bought it? If so you had 90 days or 4000 miles to bring the diff problem to them.

Used Car Lemon Law
Your protection under the law when you buy from a New York dealer extends to used cars as well. The dealer must provide a warranty on the vehicle that covers at least the engine, transmission, drive axle, brakes, radiator, steering, alternator, generator, starter, and ignition system (not including the battery).

Under the warranty, the dealer must either repair the defect or reimburse you for the repair costs. The length of the warranty depends on how many miles are on the vehicle when you buy it:

36,000 miles or less: 90-day or 4,000-mile warranty
36,001 miles to 79,999 miles: 60-day or 3,000-mile warranty
80,000 miles to 100,000 miles: 30-day or 1,000-mile warranty
A dealer does not have to warrant a vehicle that sells for less than $1,500 or whose odometer reading is more than 100,000 miles.

The Used Car Lemon Law entitles you to a replacement vehicle or refund if the dealer is unable to correct the problem after three repair attempts or the car has been out of service for 15 days.

Fight the good fight, but you’re probably fucked. The diff is not specifically stated as being covered, and I’m guessing it was more than 90 days or 4000 miles after you bought the car that you brought the problem to them. Good luck.

19

Jim - I just took a look at your car.

Your rear sway bar is flipped, and the endlinks are bent. This is a common problem with impreza’s which are driven aggressively. Fortunately, it’s an easy problem to fix (beefier rear endlinks) and the only damage that is sustained is by the endlinks. Your rear-end response should be horrific, maybe you didn’t notice. You’ve got to get new endlinks for sure.

edit: It looked like this:

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y216/BRADLEY1997/Picture437.jpg
Picture437.jpg800×600

20

[quote=“Z man,post:19,topic:30043"”]

Jim - I just took a look at your car.

Your rear sway bar is flipped, and the endlinks are bent. This is a common problem with impreza’s which are driven aggressively. Fortunately, the only damage that is sustained is by the endlinks. Your rear-end response should be horrific, maybe you didn’t notice. You’ve got to get new endlinks for sure.

[/quote]

cool thanks, saves me some time :tup:

weird wonder how that would have happened. Now, you say this is a common problem, IE a part defect, so why would this not be covered?? Did you happen to see if the swaybar had any scrapes like the tech had said?

edit: any documentation as to it being a common problem/defect? if so this should just be covered regardless of anything on my warranty…