Sigh. Automotive unions had their place and time, which has been long gone. There is substantial initial cost for companies like GM to open a plant overseas. They can only bleed for so long, before companies research, calculate payback and execute moves like that. Had the UAW started being reasonable 10 years ago, this discussion wouldn’t exist. GM is like a glacier (as are most big companies), they don’t make changes on a whim. It took years of abuse by the UAW to get them looking overseas, and it would take allot for them to stop.
It’s a world market. I deal with people all over the world, who look to my company, and America in general, as the global technology leaders. Americans is becoming and will continue to prosper, not because of our cheap labor costs.
If you are a non-union or union worker with a mastered skill (mechanic, welder ect…) you will not be hungry.
As for the rest of your thread, GM doesn’t owe the community or workers anything. They are a business!
What about the people who squeezed out a couple of
kids before they should have and missed their opportunity for school? Or the people who did’nt grow up as priviliged as you?
What if everybody was skilled? Who would cut your grass or mop the floors?
my sense of humor can be dry and ambiguous, thus i clarify that “why dont i try shoveling dirt/asphalt on a hot day?”… because i went to school, used my brain, learned a skill. but in all seriousness an undergraduate degree is a joke, professional school is where its at. for all the time and effort you put in to studying it would be insulting to earn anything less than $100/hr, so why pay someone who “busts their ass” $50/hr when there are other people qualified to do it for less? Yes i understand there are other fields where people slack off, but perhaps thats because their level of responsibility is much lower. I dont earn close to either of the aforementioned salaries but i work 12hr shifts in the ER and if you sit down 3-4 times during your shift its “slow”, its a busy job and if you mess up you dont stop the assembly line, you get a committee review because someone dies. So the take home message is: kids go to school so you don’t have to shovel dirt/asphalt on a hot day.
IMO… nobody should be able to get a comfortable job in unskilled labor… they should be paid shit $10-$15 an hour but given opportunity to advance via. school or apprenticeships.
having the unions negotiate these crazy pay rates is the same thing as telling your 16 year old kid to go get a job while giving him a corvette and spending money. where’s the motivation!!
While your are right you would be still making 8$ an hour, (maybe more, who knows), the cost of living wouldn’t be going up like it is. You said yourself, that the number of people dependent on the US auto industry is huge. The raises the union got for it’s employee’s weren’t free. If they were, wouldnt you think that Delphi would be losing money, therefore have stopped this before it got this bad? No, because they saw the ability to make the money elsewhere, as shown by the cost of cars, and living in general going up equivalently with the raises. Why do you think you are just as well off now (now being before the pay cuts) as you were in 92.
I’m not going to say unions are their to protect the lazy, instead they are their to offer indefinite job security. Unions give people a false sense of security, as shown in the auto industry. They give people the mentality that they are worth more then they actually are. The job you do, that the union protects for you, could just as easily be done by someone else in another country that needs the job, for much cheaper.
and before you say anything, i was a member of the UAW for 3 years (only worked at the hall in lockport, nothing major but i paid my 8$ a week for dues for the 6 hours a week i worked) Also, my mom is the union steward for SEIU in newfane (dont remember number), uncle is the 686 pres (last i heard anyway), and my best friend’s dad is also a UAW committee member. I have heard all sides of the union debate, but nothing that convinces me.
I also feel that America is past the industrial phase (obviously) and is ready to move into a more “service” (read: higher education) oriented economy. Their will still be the mcjobs of course, but not like there are today.
I’m not going to read everything right now, for i am too lazy.
One quick point… Even though wages are $15-$25/hr (dependent on trade) the company pays nearly 3x’s this for the insurance/benefits/union.
somebody on the line making $50K/year is costing AAM nearly $150/year just because they are union. Keep the wages the same, remove the uniong and AAM literally cuts their labor costs in half.
That alone is enough of a reason to delete the unions from the equation. (not to mention being held accountable for job performance on not being protected by the union where it’s almost impossible to ge fired)
maybe if i had your engineering degree/job id be driving ferrari? smart people know how to budget money. I also own a very nice house. Doesnt mean my work/wages are fair. seriously.
So - what are your feelings on illegal immigrants in the American workforce?
If the majority of the american workforce is being pushed up and into the skilled work section - who is going to work the 10s of millions of unskilled jobs?
I’m not saying people should start at the top, I’m saying you should be properly motivated to want more… by not overpaying people doing basic shit. I’m not casting an age, race, or background into this matter.
Doesnt mean my work/wages are fair. seriously.