again… i dont care or live in other cities. the benchmark should be against itself. Downtown is NOT a clean place compared to a clean place! i dont hate it… i hate that people dont give a shit about the real problems. I live and work in the city, many in this thread do not. they only see what they want. out of the problems i mentioned the roads are the only ones that effect me. i’m not out for myself, i thinking about whats good for the city residents as a whole. the suburbanites love to come to the city and use its resources and just turn a blind eye to what its like in the 88 neighborhoods. take a problem like Mccardle roadway…pittsburghs solution is to block it off for 4 years then re-open it with metal plates over the holes. No where to park in oakland? lets take away several hundred parking places and put in a merry-go round and some benches when a fuckin park is about 200 yards across a bridge. zip cars…what a grand failure. i could keep going. love the city hate its politics and leadership and direction.