Ok this is an interesting topic that i have wanted to bring up for a while now because i have been asked at least 10 times by 10 different people to have this type of arrangement with them.
the funniest part is that people seem to have a strange idea of what sponsorship actually is and who deserves it.
Are people really under the impression that just having a nice car means that they should get parts for free?
Jeez, there are people (sasha, tons of Drift Mania drivers etc.) that with major promotional backing (promo videos, ACTUAL COMPETITION EXPERIENCE and RESULTS among other things) that cannot get sponsors for parts or cash, not even partial sponsorships.
I’d like to hear from people on here who have sponsorship aspirations and from people like the guys from Intense, Varun, Dan etc who likely get asked for this type of stuff on occassion… lets hear from both sides of the fence.
I never approach someone for sponsorship unless I feel it is in their best interest and that they will gain just as much if not more from me as I gain from them. People dont give handouts, so what makes one think they would with racing?
Even when you feel someone would benefit from sponsorship, convincing them of that is very difficult, and unless that person has an avid interest in racing its often impossible.
I have however been talking to Stance more in depth lately bing i’ll talk to you more about it on msn im hoping to make something of it
its an interesting issue, and no i am not mad at anyone for asking me about it, if anything i am flattered that people think i am capable of even doing it.
fact is though that seeking sponsorship is more of a pull than a push strategy. by that i mean you cant make people give you stuff, you have to make them want to give you stuff.
Well, my company is only a few months old and I have already sponsored someone. I’ll let them describe the details is they choose but basically, they have the ability to do my business some good…and I have the ability to do them some good.
There was a discusssion as to what out relationship looks like and how each of us can benefit. I beleive this sponsorship deal for me is cheap abvertising. I know this person will whore me and U2Ndyno.com so as long as I get some mileage out of it…I’m cool with sponsorships.
That being said, the conversation we had was not as friends…it was had as business associates. It was handled professionally, and as Bing suggested, I was convinced that this sponsorship is a good thing for my business.
I cannot even imagine how many people have asked me to sponsor them for Powder Coating. And the funny thing is, most of the people who will approach me are people I have never even done business with and they basically do not even have any type of “sales pitch” I guess as to why I should sponsor them. They just want their shit Coated for FREE.
Then I have customers like Donavan from Vibrant Performance as well as Anna from SGR who bring me loads of work, both have very nice vehicles, but neither had asked for any type of sponsorship so I took it upon myself to offer them each a Sponsorship as they are stand up people who deserve it.
Dan,
Something to consider, and please don’t take this the wrong way, is that it should typically be easier for a business offering a SERVICE (As opposed to a PRODUCT) to hand out a sponsorship. Especially as the Owner AND Operator it’s easy to donate your time and use of your equipment because you have little or no absolute cost “per session” or however you dyno people call them ((edit: I just realized I have no idea if this is true. Does a dyno have any consumables?))
I don’t mean to say for a second that you don’t have as many costs as others, we all know or have a good idea of how much you money you need to put in to something like you are doing just to START doing business, let alone all of the costs of maintaining the business. But basically when it comes down to it, if you’re sitting at home one night 6 months from now, and the dyno is in where it sits when it’s not in use there is very little absolute cost involved for you to go do some pulls for somebody.
I guess my point is, it’s a lot easier for someone in your position to benefit from a sponsorship than it is for someone in bings position to benefit from sponsorship as he has an up front cost per product.
I hope none of this came out the wrong way, I tried my best for it not to
well its unbeleivable how people think that sponsorship means free parts… the best i can do with the couple of my sponsorships is cost. so what happends is the company sells me the parts at their cost for me to promote it and for them to be able to use the picture of my car on their site.
and ive noticed alot of people asking for sponsorship have cars close to stock and are all beaten up. i dont even know how they can have the balls to ask for sponsorship. obviously on a company side of things they want to sponsor a car that stands out and that is extremely nice and is always a bonus when they race/drift because there is usually more media there like photographers, mags and videos that way there product will be seen elsewhere as well.
Well - the inverse can easily be argued in that Bing only needs to shell out money if and when he recevies an order. He theoretically NEVER needs to have any out-of-pocket expense. I, on the other hand have a very expensive piece of equipment that not only depreciates by the second, but also costs me interest on my financing. Therefore, I would argue that any use of my equipment that does not pay me back some $$ is costing me double…
And to think that service companies do not have any “cost per session” as you put it is rather naive. Bing has units of inventory, I have units of time…
But all of that is completly moot in this discussion. If a person is looking for a sponsorship deal and can not convince me that my time is worth something…they will not get recognized.
As an aside, most parts sponsorships in Canada are not what you think they are. Very few people ever get anything for FREE. At best they are products sold to sponsored individuals at a deep discounts or straight cost…not handouts
And no John, I would never take your comments the wrong way…it’s a good discussion and something I hope potential folks looking for sponsorship take note of.
from being exposed to the bike scene for a while now, the best “sponsorship” i have seen is Prodeal, cost - 10 or 20%. But most of the time it’s cost.
People are cheap, everyone wants something for nothing, if anyone has worked in retail before they know exactly what i’m talking about, it’s a shame. All you can really do is tell them to bugger off and ignor it.
As far as sponsorship for nice cars whatever, i have one of the most unique cars in the country and even with that behind me there is slim to no chance that i would beable to round up any sponsors. And i don’t deserve sponsors either for that matter.
Another thing worth mentioning is that everyone wants to promote their companies and wants to be associated with people that are doing great or interesting things.
So in that sense every company is looking to sponsor someone, somehow.
The question is one of ‘fit’. Or, do you fit what the company is looking for?
In my eyes there is nothing too impressive going on in Ontario these days, with the exception of what sasha is doing. All of the drift series’ are lackluster compared to DM. Car shows are so 90’s. As such, it is going to be real hard to make a car in our community stand out anyways. There are very few cars that ‘fit’ what companies are looking for… someone who really truely stands out.
One thing i will say is that instead of coming out and trying to obtain the sponsorship first maybe try and provide the benefit… then get the sponsorship.
For example, i didnt give anything to Automotion, they bought it all. Then they get my parts in a major magazine… So guess how enthusiastic i would be about working more with them. They show proven results. In my eyes it would be far far more beneficial to align myself with someone like that. More interestingly though is that they dont really even need my help, i have to go and try to let them associate with me. Strange eh?
In sum, in this ontario market you are going to have to work doubly hard to get you and your car to the point where people are going to be real enthuiastic about working with you. You cannot expect to get anything for free, at best you could expect higher than usual discounts.
Maintaining the relationship is a whole other issue
I totally agree. In some cases thou I can do better then cost (thou I then lose money) so it must be something worth while (in my eyes).
One case thou, a gentlemen ask if I would sponsor both him and his “show” team which consisted of 5 other people. So I told him “since he/they had never gave me any business before and this would be our 1st dealing” that I would give them 20% off for starters and depending on how much work they would bring to me, I would then give better and better deals etc etc… Well that did not interest him at all as he wanted everything for free or not at all.
Dan has a very good point. It’s similar to me towing my car. People often think there is no cost involved with towing other than gas. Meanwhile, my last jeep’s tranny blew up after a single year of towing, and my trailer over the year and a half that i’ve had it has aquired over 300$ in general maintanince that its needed just in different parts here and there.
Besides that fact, thats not even my buisness. Imagine if it was, and people we’re looking at my investment as if it didnt matter. Thats some insane thought process going on right there, infact it is rather sad.
Bing also has a very good point, there are hundreds or thousands of companies in Toronto that could benefit from sponsorship at some level or another, but you need to find a company that is INTERESTED in what you’re doing, otherwise its not only useless but your relationship with that sponsor (if it ever did happen) would be less than ideal.
That being said, Dan did sponsor the Sequence-Garage race team in the form of no cost dyno time for my race car and customers cars. What does this mean? Well it basically means that I have to bring Dan an equal amount of dyno time to do my job well. Anyone that knows anything about sponsorship will tell you: getting the sponsorship is just the beggining.
There’s a really good book out actually I forget the exact name of it but it is something by the name of Motor Racing and the task of Sponsorship" or something along those lines, i would imagine it is very helpful in suggesting approaches to companies etc.
Of course, this would only work if you actually do have anything to offer companies - if you dont, and you’re asking for sponsorship - you’re just an idiot.
Bing there is lots going on in Ontario. Look at Martin, Adam and Sasha. Soon my name will be in that mix hopefully. More will likely get involved in racing with the start of SONR. Personally, there is little you can offer as a sponsor, tire sponsorship is what is really needed. Toyo already offers this to anyone in racing, 4 ra-1’s for the price of 3 as long as you show them your involvement and results in organized motorsports.
The only people that will approach you are people that want something you are selling, for a lower cost. Jeff on the other hand, offers welding, fabrication, etc etc. Same goes for Ian (Battle Auto). These are the kind of sponsors that I would persue.
With that being said, I agree to the fact of having to offer the sponsor something. If you are able to promote their name and bring them business then you have a chance of receiving their sponsorship. Untill then, its not going to happen.
i used to sponsor people all the time , they ask i say ok, i add on a huge markup and then give them a percentage off so they think they saving tons of money and they put a sticker on the car, the size of the sticker depends on the discount and the markup, or sould i say the markup and discount depends on the size and location of the sticker , or i give them a discount off of the regular labor rate and charge “buddy” price.
but then of course my boys do actually get cost +10% and buddy rate all the time
To me, that shows their true colours. If they were really interested in sponsorship, and benefitting you, not just their pocketbook, they would have taken the deal. Hell, that sounds like a fantastic deal to me. 20% off for someone who just walked in off the street looking for sponsorship? I certainly wouldn’t expect that if I were hunting for a sponsor.
This is all very interesting and I’m glad Bing started this thread. Personally, if I were on the hunt for sponsors (and I may be in the near future) I wouldn’t expect anything from them on the first few purchases except maybe a free sticker to put on the car. But that’s just me, and I’ve seen the inside of running your own buisiness… And I’m not a bum just looking for free shit. With the right exposure and the right terms, I would hazzard to guess that sponsorship can be one of the cheapest forms of advertising besdies word of mouth.
Think about it this way (we’ll use someone worth sponsoring for this example), you sponsor someone, and it costs you… $300 out of pocket. Now, $300 isn’t even going to get you a black and white text ad in a magazine, however, you toss that $300 in parts, or dyno time, or paint, or powdercoating, welding, or whatever into a car, and put a sticker on it. Not only do you have the exposure that sticker provides, but you have all the word of mouth pimpage that that person provides, AND you have the benefit of your exposure being directed specifically and exclusively at the market you’re targeting.
Please, one of you guys feel free to correct me if I’m wrong with that statement, but I would like to think it’s fairly close to accurate. And again, it goes back to the right terms of sponsorship (whether it’s a discount, a deal, free stuff, buddy pricing on labour, or even just some extra hands when work is being done on the car)… Whatever it is that your company can ‘afford’ or deems worth doing for said car.
I think I’m starting to ramble now, so I’ll end it there, but hopefully that’s a reasonably useful contribution.
I’ve already worked with Martin a fair bit, i visited him at his home in Ottawa last year in fact and i have been more than happy to work with all of the NEO crew as there has been reciprocal benefit.
When your name is in the mix it will lend itself to the scenerio i mentioned already, how do you differentiate yourself from others?
as more and more people get into racing it will mean less and less to potential sponsors. also, you are obligated to wear certain stickers when you enter many series, for example Toyo with their 4 for 3 tire deal which isnt much.
If there were 9 guys from this community in Ontario Touring GT class then sasha’s exploits wouldnt be as impressive. When that happens it will be the guys that are winning that get the attention but there are limits there as well.
for example, we all follow sasha cause he’s our buddy. But i know that most of us are not familiar with what Adam or Martin are up to on the track… i only find this out from forum posts. What i mean by that is how much exposure are they generating and how much will you generate? im not suggesting that they are not generating alot of exposure in some circles but certainly for myself anyways Sasha is hitting the market i am in much better than the others so i would be most interested in working with him as i am sure Adam has excellent contacts and gets a great deal of exposure in more mature racing communities.
I’m not sure that Jeff or Ian are really at a huge advantage for obtaining sponsors because racers like adam, sasha, or martin and yourself are likely to conduct the majority of the maintenance and modifications yourself and will oinly require minor assistance like welding or powder coating in this case. Tires are a huge concern obviously, i agree.
All that aside, the next issue becomes maintaining sponsor ship.
A = how much $$$ the sponsor puts into you
B = how much $$$ the sponsor gains from the exposure you give him that he could not otherwise have had.
if B > A then hurray to a second go-round with the ‘sponorship’ but if A > B then its likely a no go.
A big part of making B > A is politics. In my opinion you should not be seeking out sponsorship from companies that you dont feel comfortable jocking hard.
IE: If you are not ready to tell everyone and their mother that Jeff (powder coating) is the Hollar McBaller of powder coating and that his shop is top drawer every day of the week then dont approach him. If your sponsor finds out you are hesitating at jocking the shop then that is not likely to bode well for the relationship.
That is a tricky issue right there considering the politics we have in this community right now since people are asking for assistance from other people in the community that most people know personally. personal politics can get in the way far easier than if you are sponsored by someone like Greddy or Toyo in this case. If you dont like RA-1’s or if you prefer another tire you can tell people you do and Toyo wont find out. But if you dont like the way Dan tune’s your car or question the accuracy of Dan’s dyno then you better keep that queit if he is helping you out.
that isnt what i meant Danno, what i mean is that being “sponsored by” is equivalent to being “spokesman for” and so the saying “if you dont have anything good to say then dont say anything at all” is changed to “find something good to say no matter what asshole”
just rocking the gear and the sticker is not enough and because we are all growing together there is a whole other dynamic to potential relationships that might not exist otherwise.
That I agree with…if Sasha couldn’t string together a sentance he probably wouldn’t have got very far with me. If he can’t tell people what U2NDyno.com is when they see the decal on his car…he is no good for me.
And that is why Benson will never be sponsored by U2NDyno.com. I may give him a break on the price cause he’s a bud…but THAT"S IT.
((edit: I just realized I have no idea if this is true. Does a dyno have any consumables?))